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feline1
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So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :)
      #1070449 - 15/10/13 03:14 PM
Doubtless some will complain it's no Windows 3.1, but I'll be whacking it on nonetheless.

Anyone else?

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desmond



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070455 - 15/10/13 04:13 PM
I'm doing it for my Dad, who thinks his recent laptop with Windows 8 is appallingly bad, confusing and horrible to use.

Hopefully it will result in a better computing experience for him... the 8.1 update is free for Win8 users, right?


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robinv



Joined: 31/08/04
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: desmond]
      #1070458 - 15/10/13 04:39 PM
Quote desmond:

I'm doing it for my Dad,





That sounded like a Hovis ad there for a minute.

Yes, i'm looking forward to it - want to get my hands on the actual install media so i can run up a couple of test machines as my work machine is too much of a mess to notice any differences. I hope there's more stuff that's really annoying for people.

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Howdy Doody Time



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070512 - 16/10/13 09:14 AM

I'm interested. My Sony Tablet / fold out keyboard hybrid whatever it is came with Windows 8 pre installed, 3 months ago, will I qualify for a freebee update?

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oggyb



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070580 - 16/10/13 05:52 PM
I'm stoked to try it on my desktop. I've had no issues whatsoever in using W8, but the usability improvements will still be welcome. And a service pack is always nice to have.

Interesting how, back in XP days (some people are still in them) I'd be waiting a few months after a service pack to see what broke and what work-arounds/updates were needed. Now I feel like there will be no problem day 1.

Is that naive?

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Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070591 - 16/10/13 06:49 PM
It seems to be mostly about making it easier to avoid the Metro side and its toy apps. I imagine most of us who use Windows 8 have become pretty adept at that already?

Metro stopped annoying me once I realized it was just the Sidebar run riot. And an OS isn't REALLY all about the desktop interface. That isn't where we spend most of our time, or do our real work, after all!


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dubbmann
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070605 - 16/10/13 08:53 PM
i'm not a win8 user but my 87 year old mom is and it's been a fricking support nightmare for me. when i go home next i'm installing 8.1 and getting the damn start button front and center. microsoft did itself such damage with this that it's incredible that ballmer still has a job. oh, wait....

cheers

d

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Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: dubbmann]
      #1070627 - 16/10/13 11:24 PM
Quote dubbmann:

i'm not a win8 user but my 87 year old mom is and it's been a fricking support nightmare for me. when i go home next i'm installing 8.1 and getting the damn start button front and center. microsoft did itself such damage with this that it's incredible that ballmer still has a job. oh, wait....

cheers

d




How many applications does your Mum use? I'd have thought you'd have got them lined up nicely on her Desktop by now, or shown her where they are in the toybox. Does she want to change again?


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Shambolic Charm



Joined: 13/07/05
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070651 - 17/10/13 07:51 AM
I rather like the absence of a start button. Once you get used to it Windows 8 is more intuitive.

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070663 - 17/10/13 08:59 AM
There was no damn start button in Windows 3.1, I'm frankly aghast that it will be back in Windows 8.1.

The Start Screen is *almost* as good as the Windows 3.1 Program Manager. Almost

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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Pete Kaine
Scan Computers


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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070694 - 17/10/13 11:31 AM
Just takes you back to the metro "Start menu" screen through doesn't it? Not actually the start menu fix that people have been asking for.

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070703 - 17/10/13 12:07 PM
Quote Pete Kaine:

Just takes you back to the metro "Start menu" screen through doesn't it? Not actually the start menu fix that people have been asking for.




But the start screen is WAY better at showing you what programs you have (just like Windows 3.1 Program Manager was) than that stupid-ass Windows 95 "Start Menu", which takes an age to unfold, hides and collapses half the stuff you're interested in, and means you have to position the mouse with the accuracy with a gnat's eyelash.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070718 - 17/10/13 01:41 PM
excuse my dayjob enroaching on reality,
but I noticed Windows 8 and 8.1 have successively more unicode and font support than ever before
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/goglobal/bb688099.aspx

This is the sort of real tangible technical improvements that you never read about in dumbass articles moaning about what colour the Start button is.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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robinv



Joined: 31/08/04
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070721 - 17/10/13 01:57 PM
Just ordered a real live copy from Scan so i'll be able to do some real testing on the real thing - none of this "preview" nonsense. What fun.

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Molten Music Technology - Computers for doing music on


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The Elf
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070723 - 17/10/13 02:02 PM
Good riddance Metro. Good riddance Start button.

Oh, heck... What??!? Nooooooooooooo!!!!

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070735 - 17/10/13 04:08 PM
here's a Microsoft video on various 2D graphics improvements on Win8.1
http://channel9.msdn.com/Events/Build/2013/3-191

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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robinv



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070765 - 17/10/13 08:36 PM
Woohoo - there's a new sound recorder! Awww it's been the same classic one since Windows 3.1 and now it's gone all new and smart phone like - is nothing sacred?

Just having a look around.
They've removed the words "boot to desktop" and instead make it "go to desktop after sign-in or when all apps are closed rather than start".
Store - that's so much better, i hated the original Windows Store, it was ugly once you got past the "top apps" screen but this is more like it.
The Start-over-desktop-background thing is good, feels much nicer although they've lost the daisy desktop background which is a shame because i really liked it.
Apps view and access is much better - although you still can't collapse categories.

So yeah, all good really.

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Molten Music Technology - Computers for doing music on


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Shambolic Charm



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070772 - 17/10/13 09:51 PM
Bugger! I've been impetuous and updated to 8.1 without backing up and it's knocked out the drivers on my Cakewalk VS100. even if Roland (or Gibson?!!) do update them they take forever to do it generally. I tried a few tweaks to the info file in the driver folder, which I did with the changeover from Win 7 to 8 but it doesn't work. I am feeling annoyed with myself now.

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tex
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070774 - 17/10/13 11:08 PM
Roland Octa-Capture is a no go so far. I can't seem to find ANY of the changes trumpeted. Might have to do a system restore. But am betting that's not possible.
Option of start screen: Duh?
Resizing: Duh? Well it does but clunks.
Start button: Don't really miss that but: Duh?
Lock screen options: Duh?

But especially sound: OH Duh? Roland were pretty quick on the Win 8 / 1.51 driver though.

If you need your tools DON'T!

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Pete Kaine
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070821 - 18/10/13 10:33 AM
Quote feline1:


But the start screen is WAY better at showing you what programs you have (just like Windows 3.1 Program Manager was) than that stupid-ass Windows 95 "Start Menu", which takes an age to unfold, hides and collapses half the stuff you're interested in, and means you have to position the mouse with the accuracy with a gnat's eyelash.




But I hated Win3.1 in comparison to 95!

In fact I think you've just nailed down in essence the problems between those who are pro/against the new metro front end.

You find the old start menu fiddly with a mouse, I find it really fast using the keyboard.

In fact I reckon I can launch anything from an old style windows menu using the start button plus arrow keys in the same time it takes Metro to do that fancy open and ripple (the loading of all the icons) motion it has and that doesn't include me then having to scroll the screen across in metro because inevitably the program I want isn't on the first screen as it opens.

So maybe the people who like Metro just don't use the keyboard to navigate windows as much as those who dislike it?

Quote Shambolic Charm:

Bugger! I've been impetuous and updated to 8.1 without backing up and it's knocked out the drivers on my Cakewalk VS100. even if Roland (or Gibson?!!) do update them they take forever to do it generally.




Roland will be keeping the hardware from what I understand and I imagine removing the Cakewalk branding in light of the sale.

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ScanProAudio & 3XS Audio Systems
ScanProAudio Blog


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robinv



Joined: 31/08/04
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070828 - 18/10/13 11:06 AM
Quote Pete Kaine:



In fact I reckon I can launch anything from an old style windows menu using the start button plus arrow keys in the same time it takes Metro to do that fancy open and ripple (the loading of all the icons) motion it has and that doesn't include me then having to scroll the screen across in metro because inevitably the program I want isn't on the first screen as it opens.

So maybe the people who like Metro just don't use the keyboard to navigate windows as much as those who dislike it?






But that's the weird thing - people seem to be blinded by the Start screen. You can press the start key and use the arrow keys to select which program to run in exactly the same way as you've described. Ah but there's all the micky mouse stuff in the way - no, not if you remove them or move them - the same as you un-pin the useless shortcuts from the old start menu. The Start page is awesome if you spend 5 minutes tidying it up and making it work for you rather than being alarmed by it. This all occurred to me this morning while playing with the Start Menu and how much nicer it was with the desktop background remaining. I'd mostly ignored the Start Menu except for games my kids can play - but i'm running out of room on my taskbar and so actually, rearranging the Start Menu completely puts everything where i need it with easy access using the keyboard - just as you describe.

Got to move to a new paradigm man

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Pete Kaine
Scan Computers


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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: robinv]
      #1070833 - 18/10/13 11:47 AM
Quote robinv:


Got to move to a new paradigm man




Or Linux

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ScanProAudio & 3XS Audio Systems
ScanProAudio Blog


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070835 - 18/10/13 12:24 PM
Quote Pete Kaine:

Quote feline1:


But the start screen is WAY better at showing you what programs you have (just like Windows 3.1 Program Manager was) than that stupid-ass Windows 95 "Start Menu", which takes an age to unfold, hides and collapses half the stuff you're interested in, and means you have to position the mouse with the accuracy with a gnat's eyelash.




But I hated Win3.1 in comparison to 95!

In fact I think you've just nailed down in essence the problems between those who are pro/against the new metro front end.

You find the old start menu fiddly with a mouse, I find it really fast using the keyboard.

In fact I reckon I can launch anything from an old style windows menu using the start button plus arrow keys in the same time it takes Metro to do that fancy open and ripple (the loading of all the icons) motion it has and that doesn't include me then having to scroll the screen across in metro because inevitably the program I want isn't on the first screen as it opens.

So maybe the people who like Metro just don't use the keyboard to navigate windows as much as those who dislike it?





Metro is designed to me navigated with FINGERS on a touch screen, not a mouse or a keyboard.

As for using the keyboard to navigate the Win95 start menu - that was no help when the damn thing still took about 95 seconds to unfold the next bit of the menu, and then opened 12 bits at once all in a splurge so you'd end up selecting and launching the wrong thing. And then "Doctor Watson" would pop up and ask you if you wanted to eat your own puke ("well, at least it's *fresh* puke!" etc etc)

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070836 - 18/10/13 12:25 PM
Anyways I'm really rather excited about the 2D graphics improvements in Win8.1 that are in that video. Font colouring for instance!

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070837 - 18/10/13 12:30 PM
Quote feline1:

Anyways I'm really rather excited about the 2D graphics improvements in Win8.1 that are in that video. Font colouring for instance!



Sounds like a riot


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oggyb



Joined: 09/02/08
Posts: 1609
Loc: Leeds, UK
Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070838 - 18/10/13 12:48 PM
Quote Pete Kaine:

In fact I reckon I can launch anything from an old style windows menu using the start button plus arrow keys in the same time it takes Metro to do that fancy open and ripple (the loading of all the icons) motion it has and that doesn't include me then having to scroll the screen across in metro because inevitably the program I want isn't on the first screen as it opens.




I bet you can't.

The Start screen operates immediately, thankfully. So you can type [Win] ONE [Enter] and be in OneNote in less than 1.5 seconds.

Now they just need to apply that same responsiveness to the login screen so I don't have to type my password twice every morning.

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tex
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070851 - 18/10/13 02:38 PM
An update for Roland owners. The Octa-Capture drivers are out for Win 8.1.

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070864 - 18/10/13 03:50 PM
It doesn't appear as something u can download from Windows Update, so I guess I gotta go hunting for it... .

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: johnny h]
      #1070865 - 18/10/13 03:50 PM
Quote johnny h:

Quote feline1:

Anyways I'm really rather excited about the 2D graphics improvements in Win8.1 that are in that video. Font colouring for instance!



Sounds like a riot




typrography is important, Johnny, you philistine

--------------------
~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070922 - 19/10/13 09:19 AM
I upgraded my Surface Pro tablet to Windows 8.1 last night.

It's a 3.6GB download (or something like that) so it took ages, but it appeared to work seamlessly.

Curiously, it comes via the Windows Store, not the Windows Update service.

Here's Microsoft's "Update Assistant" compatability checker that will scan your PC for any known hardware or software that's not supported. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-8/upgrade-assistant-download-on line-faq

I only got two issues when I ran it on my desktop:

1. it helpfully reminded me to DE-AUTHORISE THE PC on iTUNES before doing the upgrade! (I guess the new OS makes iTunes see it as a "different PC")

2. It said MIDI-OX (7.0.2, 32 bit) wasn't compatible with Win 8.1 64 bit. (Aw!) I have emailed MIDI-OX to give them this terrible news

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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The Elf
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #1070923 - 19/10/13 09:30 AM
Quote Pete Kaine:

So maybe the people who like Metro just don't use the keyboard to navigate windows as much as those who dislike it?



Not in my case.

I keep the stuff I need on my desktop - two clicks, job done. I've never used the keyboard to launch programs and, although sometimes it's a necessity, I avoid using the Start button - it's far too fiddly.

If I need something often it goes on my desktop. If I need something all the time it goes in my Quickstart bar.

What I don't need is my PC to look like a damned XBox!!

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robinv



Joined: 31/08/04
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070928 - 19/10/13 10:15 AM
Quote feline1:



I only got two issues when I ran it on my desktop:

1. it helpfully reminded me to DE-AUTHORISE THE PC on iTUNES before doing the upgrade! (I guess the new OS makes iTunes see it as a "different PC")

2. It said MIDI-OX (7.0.2, 32 bit) wasn't compatible with Win 8.1 64 bit. (Aw!) I have emailed MIDI-OX to give them this terrible news




I didnt know there was a checker - i just found that a bunch of programs had disappeared. It didnt like LoopBe MIDI loopback or Alcohol 120 because of the virtual drives. And some other things needed reauthorisation as apparently the digital signature had changed. It also creates a "windows.old" folder which i'm assuming i can delete once i'm happy with everything.

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1070931 - 19/10/13 10:52 AM
I believe that the standard Windows 8.1 "Disk Cleanup" tool will even delete that Windows.old for you, if you clcik the "Clean-up system files" option.

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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1071031 - 19/10/13 11:07 PM
(yep, it definately does.)

2 out of my 3 machines upgraded to Windows 8 now, no probs so far.....

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johnny h



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1071062 - 20/10/13 12:12 PM
Quote feline1:

Quote johnny h:

Quote feline1:

Anyways I'm really rather excited about the 2D graphics improvements in Win8.1 that are in that video. Font colouring for instance!



Sounds like a riot




typrography is important, Johnny, you philistine



Yeah maybe its a big deal on Windows. Macs have had great fonts since 1984 so its something I take for granted these days.


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Exalted Wombat



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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1071068 - 20/10/13 12:34 PM
Quote feline1:

Here's Microsoft's "Update Assistant" compatability checker that will scan your PC for any known hardware or software that's not supported. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-8/upgrade-assista...




The compatibility checker for Windows 7 didn't know what would work, it just knew what had paid to be Microsoft certified. Which left out a lot of the small-company products we use. Is the Windows 8.1 one any different?


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feline1
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Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: johnny h]
      #1071074 - 20/10/13 01:03 PM
Quote johnny h:

Quote feline1:

Quote johnny h:

Quote feline1:

Anyways I'm really rather excited about the 2D graphics improvements in Win8.1 that are in that video. Font colouring for instance!



Sounds like a riot




typrography is important, Johnny, you philistine



Yeah maybe its a big deal on Windows. Macs have had great fonts since 1984 so its something I take for granted these days.




You clearly know absolutely bugger all about font technology. Apple's TrueType font system has been supported on Windows since Win3.1... TrueType's successor, OpenType, was launched by Adobe/Microsoft in 1996... Windows 8.1 supports one of the latest enhancements to OpenType, font coloring, with for the first time allows fonts to contain multicoloured glyphs... this means things like emoticons can be done as fonts, rather than bitmaps, which is hugely more efficient, and looks better too.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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feline1
active member


Joined: 23/06/03
Posts: 4279
Loc: Brighton, UK
Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: Exalted Wombat]
      #1071075 - 20/10/13 01:04 PM
Quote Exalted Wombat:

Quote feline1:

Here's Microsoft's "Update Assistant" compatability checker that will scan your PC for any known hardware or software that's not supported. http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-8/upgrade-assista...




The compatibility checker for Windows 7 didn't know what would work, it just knew what had paid to be Microsoft certified. Which left out a lot of the small-company products we use. Is the Windows 8.1 one any different?




I dunno! But I have tons of tiny little applications by companies that I very much doubt have paid for microsoft certification, and it didn't tell me they were incompatible, so that would suggest it is more intelligent than in the past.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~


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johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3397
Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :) new [Re: feline1]
      #1071138 - 21/10/13 12:04 AM
Quote feline1:

... this means things like emoticons can be done as fonts, rather than bitmaps, which is hugely more efficient, and looks better too.



Amazing! Well done Windows 8. Good quality emoticons.

There's one for you, I hope it renders gloriously well. Perhaps it will even turn around all the negative publicity and falling PC sales which have blighted the industry in the last year....


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IvanSC



Joined: 08/03/05
Posts: 7791
Loc: UK France & USA depending on t...
Re: So, Windows 8.1 is out on Friday! :)SO BE CAREFUL!!!!!! new [Re: feline1]
      #1071588 - 23/10/13 07:50 PM
In a fit of excessive optimism (and after a certain amount of wine) I blasted into the 8 to 8.1 upgrade and like a pillock used a very frivolous username and equally daft password when setting up my microsoft account, which I assumed I could just dump as usual once the install was done and which I forgot to write down..

I did manage to rescue my install, but am now stuck with being user "ivan ideayourekiddingme"
until I figure out how to either rename myself or get rid of THIS user and enter a new sensible one.

*sigh*




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Me? But I`m such a loveable old bugger!


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