Hi all...

Not sure if this is the right section to post this but lets see.....

My friend has started making our backing tracks on a PC, I am not sure of the programme he uses but he is now trying to export it from the pc onto minidisc.

He wants to try to keep it digital by using the optical in on the minidisc, is this possible and if so what lead would be needed.

If it is not possible what other ways would there be to record our tracks from the pc to minidisc.

Thanks in advance

Dave

www.the2fbs.co.uk

I think we might be talking S/PDIF - there's a couple of different types...

http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/printpage/82

To be honest I probably wouldn't bother. But I'm lazy.

Great joke.Minidisc in 2012?Hahahaha!

I've heard there's something called an eye pad which is very popular these days.

But if it ain't broke, why fix it?

Depends on the Minidisc player. I have a Sony one with a digital in, but the Minidisc is a compressed format so there will some degradation of the sound. I presume he wants to use the Minidisc in a live situation? I doubt it would make much difference to record into the analogue input if that is all he has available on the recorder he has.

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http://soundcloud.com/richie-royale
http://www.mixcrate.com/richieroyale

First question, does the PC/soundcard have an optical out?

If not, it's just a simple case of a line level audio in to the mididisc player and setting the manual recording level carefully.

Back when I was using minidisc as backing tracks I did dabble with copying the tracks over digitally but after a while I stopped bothering - on the basis that what little difference there was in quality would barely be noticeable if at all in a live environment over a PA and also the fact that the ATRAC compression that minidisc uses has a much more destructive effect on the qaulity of playback anyway regardless of how you get the signal into it.

Edit - I see a few people have already chipped in to much the same effect while I was typing this!

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http://www.partyfearsthree.co.uk

Edited by Steve A (05/07/12 05:21 PM)

Yes we still use minidisc

Yes we use it live for backing tracks for our duo.... ok maybe its old hat...but it works for us. God I feel old now

Anyway, it is to a Sony or a Tascam... it does have optical.

But if there would be no real loss in quality then we can go down the route suggested, would it just be from headphone socket to the left and right In and then watch the levels?

Cheers

Yea Gods! Minidisc has GOT to be better than the headphone out of a pc system sound card!

If your friend has a desktop pc get him to buy a Trust Optical Expert soundcard, about 15 quid. This has both co-ax and optical ins and outs.

If a laptop buy the Behringer UCA 202 usb interface, that has optical out. He could of course use the Berry on a desktop but that Trust card is pretty good for the money.

Dave.

Quote Dave.jj:

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But if there would be no real loss in quality then we can go down the route suggested, would it just be from headphone socket to the left and right In and then watch the levels?

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The minute you use Minidisc, you are losing data. MD is a lossy format.

Cheers.

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I'm All Ears.

Hello Dave:). I just stopped using minidisc recently in favour of the Ipad 2. As already mentioned, i wouldn't bother to much about recording using the digital connection......especially in a live situation.

I used to record directly from my soundcard into the analogue inputs on the minidisc. Main thing is to watch your levels when recording, it will sound really bad if you clip it. I used to settle for a level on the minidisc display "ladder" of (IIRC) 2 steps below the zero mark & i always made sure the loudest parts of the backing track didn't exceed this setting.

Don't be put off by negative comments.....if minidisc works for you then that's all that matters.
The only problem i ever had with minidisc was venues where we had to put the 18" subs on the stage, the vibration caused it to "skip" sometimes.

Good luck.;)

Cheers all.... negative or positive comments are all welcome. I guess this is what we have to put up with not being to used to modern tech

I know he used to do our backing tracks on a zoom 8 track, I think it connected digitally to the minidisc to record.

Now he is using the pc its just a bit new to us... I will look at all suggestions... and try to figure it out.

We really should look into this ipad thing.... will have to try to find someone who uses this set up to have a look.

Quote ef37a:

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If your friend has a desktop pc get him to buy a Trust Optical Expert soundcard, about 15 quid. This has both co-ax and optical ins and outs.

Dave.

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Looks like this is not avaliable now? do they do something like it?

Would one of these USB/SPDIF things do...?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/WMA-Channel-External-Audio-Sound/dp/B005M19I0K/ref =sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341518657&sr=8-1

Quote BJG145:

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Would one of these USB/SPDIF things do...?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/WMA-Channel-External-Audio-Sound/dp/B005M19I0K/ref =sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341518657&sr=8-1

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Yes, that looks like just the thing! In fact I might just order one myself and see what it is like.
BTW I have two MD recorders, one Sony one Grundig. The latter records from my HD Freeview tuner (via Toslink, no levels to worry about) which also means I can record iPlayer radio. I LIKE minidisc! I can only conclude that some very dirty politics stopped it being THE ideal ICE device?

Dave.

The MiniDisc format was very clever, but it wasn't around long before the iPod and Internet music started to ascend to global domination. The data reduction format had a few issues at launch but improved quickly and is actually a very clever and effective solution -- better than mp3 in many ways. Unfortunately, it turned out that several core elements of the ATRAC codec were infringing patents held by Dolby, so Sony ended up having to pay Dolby royalties and licensing fees on every machine and pre-recorded disc... and so that added to the internet / ipod competition made them turn their attentions elsewhere.

But for backing tracks it's still a pretty handy solution. A linear solid-state recorder would be a better bet if you were buying something today, but if you have a working machine it makes sense to make use of it.

Hugh

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Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

I used to connect the Coaxial out on my AWE64 Gold to the coax in on my JE520

Still have the JE520

My current gigging PC (several years old) has an output that doubles as SP Dif - you can buy a USB soundcard pretty cheaply that would have the same.

Here! Here!

No doubt minidisc is not a lossless format, but I cant hear any audio problems. Into the bargain it's robust, the cassetted discs are bulletproof (I just found a whole bunch of them from eons ago and I'm listening to them now on a Sony MDS-S38)

It always boils me up a bit to hear all these golden ears poopoo anything that isn't 192kHz at 32 bit when the reality is they can't hear the difference either, and most certainly not at a live gig.

The entire music buying population is listening to everything on mp3 or whatever the latest version of that is anyway.

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The only excuse we have for making music in the first place is to make it differently..vis-a-vis our own difference (Glenn Gould)

Quote Howdy Doody Time:

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It always boils me up a bit to hear all these golden ears poopoo anything that isn't 192kHz at 32 bit when the reality is they can't hear the difference either

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Recording to Sony proprietary media on an obsolete format isn't really about audio quality (though why record lossy these days?). It's more of a long term storage and playback issue . As the device gets older, it will fail. Maybe on stage. The OP will then need to buy another MD player or get all his stuff transferred. This could be 1 year or 10 years. A sound investment is a more modern device playing uncompressed audio.

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I'm All Ears.

Hmm.. Obsolete formats don't really bother me, I still use my Sony 3348, and my Otari 24. However with Minidisc recorder/player at 20 quid or less on ebay, and given they are built like tanks, spares are not expensive. My MD is half width, is a lot more robust than my iPad, and is not subject to O/S changes at the whim of someone else.

I think the point is the OP already has an MD and was just concerned about digital or analogue input (which won't make any audible difference) but then people started shouting LOSSY and OBSOLETE neither IMO would make the slightest difference to what the OP wants to use it for - nor indeed for most other uses either.

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The only excuse we have for making music in the first place is to make it differently..vis-a-vis our own difference (Glenn Gould)

Can I just say....

I AM PROUD TO USE A MINIDISC!!!

There I said it.... again thanks for the comments. I feel much better now....

No doubt we will move on, but then again as I am now in my 50's (early) maybe they will out live me anyway!!!

Thanks all.

Quote Dave.jj:

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Can I just say....

I AM PROUD TO USE A MINIDISC!!!

There I said it.... again thanks for the comments. I feel much better now....

No doubt we will move on, but then again as I am now in my 50's (early) maybe they will out live me anyway!!!

Thanks all.

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Pretty sure it will outlive me! I am 67 and I have two machines in perfect working order and probably nearly 100 discs. But what lossless medium to replace it? CD is ok but much bigger and prone to damage. Solid state systems need a readout so you can find out WTF things are. Then that is an "all eggs, one basket" solution.

In any event I am going thru our collection of discs (many were bought in with a recorder) and duping them to hard drive as 16bit .wav so I can re use the discs....You want a REALLY "lossy" format? Vinyl. Not a lot of welly below 50Hz, precious little above 18k, at best a 13bit noise floor and more mid band distortion than you can shake a stick at...And yet peeps LOVE it! (not me!) Oh! And I dupe stuff onto TDK AD/SA, more than good enough in a car!
Dave.

Quote Locha:

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Great joke.Minidisc in 2012?Hahahaha!

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If you think recording to something as old as Minidisk is hahaha, get this, there was a top producer on TV in his studio and he had bought an old analogue mixing desk from the 60's, it was the size of an aircraft carrier! but that's nothing, on the radio they were interviewing a top violinist and she said her Stradivarious was over 300 years old hahaha, what a joke eh

Quote OneWorld:

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Quote Locha:

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Great joke.Minidisc in 2012?Hahahaha!

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If you think recording to something as old as Minidisk is hahaha, get this, there was a top producer on TV in his studio and he had bought an old analogue mixing desk from the 60's, it was the size of an aircraft carrier! but that's nothing, on the radio they were interviewing a top violinist and she said her Stradivarious was over 300 years old hahaha, what a joke eh

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You aren't comparing like for like.

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I'm All Ears.

Quote Howdy Doody Time:

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Hmm.. Obsolete formats don't really bother me, I still use my Sony 3348, and my Otari 24.

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Tape isn't restricted to one type of playback device and a recording on magnetic media will still be easier to transfer in 5-10 years time. Tape machines are easily serviced. Not so with MD players. Again, Apples and Oranges.

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I'm All Ears.

I have no issue at all with the sound quality of MiniDisc, but having used it for years when it was the Great New Hope for pro-sumer recording, I've just found the disks and the players to be too fragile and prone to failure - contrary to others' experience above.

So for me, that risk is too high for either archiving anything of any value, or for trusting in a live situation for playback. The disks (in my experience) are very variable and unreliable, the players/recorders *very* prone to jumping if in any way knocked (even by loud bass soundwaves!), and the mechanisms don't last very long before they become too knackered to work any more (and I'm not a technology serial abuser, I assure you!).

I would use any of the myriad solid state recording media available, including iPod or iPad, long before returning to the ill-fated MiniDisc. Things like the Line6 BackTrack were even being given away with other products recently, so these are not expensive options!

Quote Billum:

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I have no issue at all with the sound quality of MiniDisc, but having used it for years when it was the Great New Hope for pro-sumer recording, I've just found the disks and the players to be too fragile and prone to failure - contrary to others' experience above.

So for me, that risk is too high for either archiving anything of any value, or for trusting in a live situation for playback. The disks (in my experience) are very variable and unreliable...

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Yup! Me too. I used minidisc a lot for 5 years or so, but found that the discs went "off" quickly and I couldn't rely on them in 'live' situations. They were great for conferences etc when you needed stabs, stings and beds. I found the 'cue to next start' feature very useful. But unreliability did for them for me.

I now use a laptop and something like Jazler Show....

Quote ken long:

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Quote OneWorld:

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Quote Locha:

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Great joke.Minidisc in 2012?Hahahaha!

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If you think recording to something as old as Minidisk is hahaha, get this, there was a top producer on TV in his studio and he had bought an old analogue mixing desk from the 60's, it was the size of an aircraft carrier! but that's nothing, on the radio they were interviewing a top violinist and she said her Stradivarious was over 300 years old hahaha, what a joke eh

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You aren't comparing like for like.

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You didn't take all that literally did you LOL It was meant to be ironic!

Quote OneWorld:

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You didn't take all that literally did you LOL It was meant to be ironic!

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Actually, it read as sarcasm.

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I'm All Ears.

I also used mine for years with no problems whatsoever. Still using it in fact. But I have a theory about blogs, fora and the internet. It does not matter in the slightest what the discussion is about, given enough time, an equilibrium will be reached where the nays will balance out ayes. I don't like to think about that though, because the inevitable conclusion is that it's all pointless.

what should we call this phenomenon, netquilibrium? - any ideas?

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The only excuse we have for making music in the first place is to make it differently..vis-a-vis our own difference (Glenn Gould)

Quote BJG145:

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Would one of these USB/SPDIF things do...?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/WMA-Channel-External-Audio-Sound/dp/B005M19I0K/ref =sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341518657&sr=8-1

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Just ordered one. I will let you all know the SP asap.

Dave.

Quote ef37a:

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Quote BJG145:

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Would one of these USB/SPDIF things do...?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/WMA-Channel-External-Audio-Sound/dp/B005M19I0K/ref =sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1341518657&sr=8-1

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Just ordered one. I will let you all know the SP asap.

Dave.

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Got it 2 hours ago. Very cute and solid little thing (57x82x2mm, packet o fags)have not got it working on XP Home so far! Going to try Win 7. Will report back asap. Hold the flexible friend!

Dave.