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table for two
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Alesis Fusion 6HD £399
      #547106 - 19/11/07 11:58 AM
I had my attention drawn to this at this ridculously low price by a fellow SOS Forumee.

I think its a steal and well worth a gander.



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pe-te



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547113 - 19/11/07 12:10 PM
hehe. I noticed it in the turnkey leaflet that came with this months SOS too!


I've never been a fan of 'workstation' type keyboards, but for the money you cant really go wrong.


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_Nuno_



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547116 - 19/11/07 12:14 PM
I have a 8HD that I use mainly as a keyboard controller and occasionally some sounds from it and at that price I'd say it's very good value for money. The VA and sample playback engine are pretty good and capable of some very good sounds. Well worth that price just for that and the keyboard.


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pe-te



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: _Nuno_]
      #547128 - 19/11/07 12:31 PM
Quote Nuno_:

I have a 8HD that I use mainly as a keyboard controller and occasionally some sounds from it and at that price I'd say it's very good value for money. The VA and sample playback engine are pretty good and capable of some very good sounds. Well worth that price just for that and the keyboard.




not to mention the 8track hdd recorder with 1/4 inputs


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3badpets



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: pe-te]
      #547130 - 19/11/07 12:42 PM
great price none in stock as of last week they told me 21st of december and wanted full deposit to secure one have done this in the past and basically told a week before that they could not do the deal im sure they do it so they can buy bulk to achieve this price but thats along as they hit thier target


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Dave B



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547135 - 19/11/07 12:56 PM
That's a serious bargain and I can feel my credit cards burning in my pocket. But seeing as I just picked up a nice condition JD800 for only £300, my synth budget is all gone now. Maybe one day..

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: pe-te]
      #547163 - 19/11/07 01:55 PM
Quote p3t3:

not to mention the 8track hdd recorder with 1/4 inputs



In fairness (and IMO), that's probably the least interesting aspect of Fusion ... although I guess some/many would find it useful especially for taking out pre-recorded audio backing tracks live.

For me, the excitement comes in the form of the very fruity VA synth, its 'real' 6 operator FM synth (like DX but with multi-mode filters) and the sampler (that's falls somewhere between an Akai S3000XL and an S5000). The Physical Modelling (PM) section is a bit weak if I am being honest and you ain't gonna get the perfect flute but it's well good for whacked out pads and stuff. And it's the combination of all these in one box that makes the thing very interesting and intriguing, especially at that price

The styling is like Marmite - you love it or hate it - but there's no denying that £399 for a 6HD has to qualify as a bargain (the 88-note weighted 8HD seems to be going for around £750 BTW).

Disclaimer: I have worked on Fusion for Alesis and I am a well-known advocator of it so I am trying to avoid making this post look like an ad! But £399 for this? S'almost criminal!!!

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Pashmina



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547208 - 19/11/07 03:22 PM
Is this just on Turnkey's flyer in the new SoS? 399 sounds like a great deal to me, but their site is showing it for 500-odd pounds, and so is SC's.

I don't really want to use Turnkey, like many forum users, my experience has not been good.

--------------------
"We hate all those who diss them, but shot all those who like them"


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547228 - 19/11/07 04:11 PM
Aye if it is Trudkey, No matter how tempting the deal,
best way to buy from them is turn up in person and see the goods right in front.

If paying a deposit or full payment to Turdkey ... well you takes yer chances ... somewhere between Bob Hope and ....


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Tomás Mulcahy
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547251 - 19/11/07 05:05 PM
That's a great price, but stock on these is very low. And you're familiar with Turnkey already...

The Fusions don't seem to be selling, which is a pity because it is a truly great synth, far better sounding than the Roland, Korg or Yamaha workstations. And the non weighted version has the best aftertouch I've ever played, loads of travel.

--------------------
madtheory creations
Synths and pianos for Kontakt


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547261 - 19/11/07 05:21 PM
I think other dealers are doing them at this price - they've just not updated their sites.

Quote Tomás Mulcahy:

The Fusions don't seem to be selling, which is a pity because it is a truly great synth, far better sounding than the Roland, Korg or Yamaha workstations. And the non weighted version has the best aftertouch I've ever played, loads of travel.



Looks like Fusion's gonna go the way of the 303/808/909, Korg Z1, Yammie FS1R, et al....

Underrated - nay, derided - or ignored in their lifetime; highly sought after following their demise!

At least I can say "Told ya so" in tones of obscene smugness

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Pashmina



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547263 - 19/11/07 05:29 PM
Probably add the K5000 to that list. I was lucky enough to get one for 205 quid a couple of years ago, apparently they're on the way up the scale now.

"Best aftertouch feel" makes me even more interested, I'll phone the local Sound Control in the morning.

--------------------
"We hate all those who diss them, but shot all those who like them"


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Michael B
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #547300 - 19/11/07 06:48 PM
Quote hollowsun:

Quote p3t3:

not to mention the 8track hdd recorder with 1/4 inputs

In fairness (and IMO), that's probably the least interesting aspect of Fusion ... although I guess some/many would find it useful especially for taking out pre-recorded audio backing tracks live.






I read the review of this machine when it first came out and SOS said there were some issues with the HD recording, can't remember exactly what it said but then later I seem to remember that the OS update addressed a lot of issues. Is it unrealistic to use the Fusion as a HD Recorder, and of course sync it with MIDI. WHy is it th least interesting aspect of the Fusion.

I also read that the sounds are no where near as good as the Korg Triton for example, one of which I already have but the prospect of HD recording, sampling, MIDI in the same bos is really tempting


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Michael B
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547365 - 19/11/07 09:28 PM
Quote table for two:

I had my attention drawn to this at this ridculously low price by a fellow SOS Forumee.

I think its a steal and well worth a gander.






Where are they advertised at 399?


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pe-te



Joined: 09/03/06
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Michael B]
      #547375 - 19/11/07 09:56 PM
turnkey


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Pashmina]
      #547377 - 19/11/07 10:00 PM
Quote Pashmina:

Probably add the K5000 to that list.



Yes

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Michael B]
      #547388 - 19/11/07 10:26 PM
Quote Michael B:

I read the review of this machine when it first came out and SOS said there were some issues with the HD recording, can't remember exactly what it said but then later I seem to remember that the OS update addressed a lot of issues.



Yes.

At the time of the review, there was a problem where audio could slip out of sync with MIDI but this was fixed in V1.24.

Quote Michael B:

Is it unrealistic to use the Fusion as a HD Recorder, and of course sync it with MIDI. WHy is it th least interesting aspect of the Fusion.



Maybe I was being uncharitable.

It's fairly basic, that's all, with simple and basic editing. That said, it is possible to do all the fancy work on your DAW and import them into audio tracks on Fusion. I haven't used it so can't vouch for it.

But for *basic* record/playback duties, I guess it could be useful to some.

Quote Michael B:

I also read that the sounds are no where near as good as the Korg Triton



"Nowhere near as good"? A bit subjective but I take your point. The factory ROM stuff is arguably not as 'polished' as 'the big 3' perhaps but as a result, Fusion has a different 'character' which can complement quite nicely. Many have only their Fusions and are quite happy with the sounds overall. Of course, there are some duffers in the factory ROM but 'the big 3' have their fair share of those as well

However, my involvement was to create new sound library for Fusion which is available for free download. I've also supplied a few freebies off my own back and a complete list of the stuff I've done can be seen here.

Some audio demos are here -- mostly done and donated by users BTW

Quote Michael B:

but the prospect of HD recording, sampling, MIDI in the same bos is really tempting



Indeed.

And apologies to the mods if this looks anything like a sales pitch - just trying to furnish people with info

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Michael B
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: pe-te]
      #547448 - 20/11/07 12:10 AM
Quote p3t3:

turnkey




Where on Turnkey, have been on the site and can't find it, and interestingly enough, in typical Turnkey fashion, they have an ALesis QS6.1 at about 700 quid! (I got one for 80 off eBay!)

ANyway, I think I want a Fusion at that price, another synth to add to my personal obscure synth museum


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grahawk



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Michael B]
      #547492 - 20/11/07 07:49 AM
Quote Michael B:

Quote p3t3:

turnkey




Where on Turnkey




In their latest product magazine thing - the one you get with Sound on Sound.

Sound Control had it at this price for a few days, as a Music Live promo, a couple of weeks ago.


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Michael B
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547631 - 20/11/07 01:55 PM
Doh! I always throw that out before reading it, so as to avoid temptation!


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pe-te



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Michael B]
      #547635 - 20/11/07 02:08 PM
Quote Michael B:

Doh! I always throw that out before reading it, so as to avoid temptation!




page 19


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jellyjim
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #547772 - 20/11/07 08:28 PM
Quote hollowsun:

derided




Um ... I've been rather rude about the Fusion's appearance in the past. I think I even pushed one over in the playground once and stole it's dinner money.

However I saw one properly in a shop not long ago and I have to say it's actually a rather handsome beast. More so than photos of it suggest.

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: jellyjim]
      #547785 - 20/11/07 09:23 PM
Quote jellyjim:

I think I even pushed one over in the playground once and stole it's dinner money.






I've said it before....

It is not photogenic and photos don't do it justice.

In subdued lighting, all those backlit buttons are very 'Star Ship Enterprise' ... if you like that sort of thing.

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Pashmina



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #547981 - 21/11/07 11:50 AM
Not looking too hopeful, this.

--------------------
"We hate all those who diss them, but shot all those who like them"


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pe-te



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Pashmina]
      #548003 - 21/11/07 12:34 PM
Quote Pashmina:

Not looking too hopeful, this.




What's not?


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Pashmina



Joined: 02/09/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: pe-te]
      #548383 - 22/11/07 12:47 AM
The likelyhood of actually getting one of these at this price, that's what!

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"We hate all those who diss them, but shot all those who like them"


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #548692 - 22/11/07 03:55 PM
I have a Yamaha Motif 6 (the 'classic' model, not the more recent ES and XS updates).

How does the Fusion 6HD fare when compared with the Motif?

The Motif's sampler is too convoluted to bother with (does anyone actually sample with it?), so that aspect of the 'head-to-head' comparison doesn't really matter to me, but I'm interested in how the two workstations compare for sounds, synthesis, sequencing, MIDI control, etc.

--------------------
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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #548889 - 22/11/07 11:57 PM
Quote comradec:

How does the Fusion 6HD fare when compared with the Motif?



They are very different.

The Motif's on-board ROM samples are a lot slicker, smoother, polished, whatever. Fusion's are good in places, a bit 'retro' in others. However....

There is a bunch of stuff (like a coupla hundred MB) I did for Alesis which is a lot more detailed than most of the competition (inc/ Motif) which is loaded from Fusion's internal disk drive. Much of this is bundled with Fusions but can be downloaded from Alesis' website. This is ongoing too with more stuff to be released soon. There is some good 3rd-party material available now as well.

The VA synth is just that - a VA synth. 3 oscillators per voice with all the usual (PWM, osc sync, ring mod), multimode filters, up to 8 envs and LFOs, big mod matrix. Nice anti-aliased oscillators.

FM is like a DX without the algorithms - you can define the operators/carriers as you want. Uses the same multi-mode filters as the VA synth. Creating FM sounds from scratch is fiddly (when was FM ever easy?) but there are hundreds of FM patches you can use as a starting point.

Physical Modelling (PM) synth is ok for weirdness.

Sampler is probably somewhere between Akai S3000XL and S5000 and pretty respectable, Has the same filters, envs, LFOs and mod matrix as the VA synth so some serious sample manglage to be had. Alesis supply Fusion converter that allows you to convert wavs, aiffs, soundfonts, Akai S1/2/3/5/6000 and Z4/8 into Fusion format on your Mac/PC. These are transferred to Fusion's HD via USB.

MIX mode allows you to layer all these different synth/sampler types with up to 16 layers and/or keyboard splits.

Effects are basic but pretty good. 2 bus effects and 4 insert effects (shared in MIX and SEQUENCER).

Sequencer's a fiddly little f'cker (aren't they all?) but not unusable. 32 tracks. It is linear, not pattern based. You can import MIDI files created on your favourite sequencer/DAW.

8-track disk recorder - functional but not sophisticated. You can cut, paste, copy, move, fade in/out. Integrates quite nicely with the sequencer where the audio is just extra tracks (on top of the 32 sequencer tracks). You can import audio created on your favourite DAW.

UI is (IMO) pretty good overall, especially once you spend a bit of time with it (like everything).

Fusion's not without its quirks but it's quite a package, especially at the new prices.

Should you REPLACE your Motif with a Fusion? I don't know. It would certainly make a nice adjunct to it with its contrasting 'sound' and complementary features.

In the almost two years I've been working with mine, I have come to a conclusion....

Try any of the Big 3 and you will be blown away and reach for your credit card almost without hesitation. Then you get it home and over time, you start running up against limitations due to the closed sample set in ROM (unless you buy expansion boards).

Try Fusion and it can be thoroughly underwhelming. But over time, you discover more and more things it can do that you never thought of - it's something you can grow with and which can grow with you.

Perfect synth? No - not at all. There are better ROMplers, there are better samplers, there are better VA synths (maybe - subjective ... Fusion's is pretty pokey) and there are better FM and PM synths on eBay. But it's the sum of these parts in one package that makes it such an intriguing and beguiling little bugger.

IMO

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Music Wolf



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #548941 - 23/11/07 07:23 AM
I've had my 6HD for a few months now. Got a good deal from Thomann in Germany. Can't find the receipt at the moment so couldn't tell you exactly how much or exactly when. I do remember that they were going for £599 in the UK at the time, I think I paid below £550.

Anyway, I've been very happy with it and this despite it developing a fault within the first month and having to be returned for repair (excellent customer service from Thomann who arranged shipping and had it back within 3 weeks in time for rehearsals).

I feel as though I haven't scratched the surface of what it can do. I've mainly been using pre-sets for live work but I hope to spend some time over Christmas getting to grips with it.

I've been using a Midiman Radium keyboard for a few years just using soft-synths. First thing I noticed about the Fusion was how nice the keyboard action was - it's really helped my playing (that along with fact that I've now actually done some practice!). I'm wondering whether I should have paid the extra for the 8HD with the weighted keys?

In short - if it got stolen I'd replace it with the same again. Excellent value at £800 let alone £400.

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MarkOne



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #548970 - 23/11/07 09:22 AM
I'll just throw my 0.02 standard value units in...

I've had an 8HD for around 18 months now, and have used it in live and recording situations. I think it's an amazing keyboard, particularly for the money. And with Steve's hollowsun sounds its taken to a whole new level. (Take his "Tape Watcher" sound and play the opening bars of Watcher of the Skies and its hard not to believe you are playing a real tron)

This summer I got into programming stuff with the VA and have to say once you get the UI, it's rather powerful, I've still only scratched the surface of the modulation matrix!

Bu for me one of the highlights is creating a mix with multiple layers and zones freely mixing samples VA and FM, can create some really unique sounds.

As Steve says some of the stock sounds can be a little "also ran" but it takes very little synthesis knowledge to push it to a whole new level (and fortunately Steve is a samplist extrordinare and he and his merry band at Hollowsun has given the user community some fantastic goodies.)

And finally. If you own a Triton, or a Motif etc (which I will say right now are fabulous boards, soundwise - even if Korg's 5 octave synth action leaves something to be desired these days!) I reckon you are going to hear your sounds on lots of records, particularly if you just use the stock ROM samples.

The fusion is just rare enough, and different enough that you can be pretty sure you won't be sounding like someone else.

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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: MarkOne]
      #549099 - 23/11/07 12:43 PM
But haven't Alesis pretty much abandoned the Fusion now?

I read somewhere that there wouldn't any more updates and some of the ones promised had been scrapped.

Alesis seem to have cocked up big-time in marketing this product. They appeared to have launched it without anybody noticing until they re-launched it later. The dedicated website was scrapped. We were encouraged to register our email addresses to receive news of when the Fusion would be available but no news ever arrived. And so on.

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Steve Cooke
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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549125 - 23/11/07 01:11 PM
They way I like to "programs" drums is by overdubbing
ie. play the whole track and play the drums realtime as if it was just another instument.

No programming, no looping, no 1,2,3,4 bar patterns to copy and paste (though these are useful tools to have)

Does the Fusion alloow this.

Thanx.



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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #549134 - 23/11/07 01:28 PM
Quote comradec:

But haven't Alesis pretty much abandoned the Fusion now?



I think it is fair to say that, yes. It is 'supported' but unlikely to be developed further.

Quote comradec:

I read somewhere that there wouldn't any more updates and some of the ones promised had been scrapped.



There probably won't be any more OS updates and they originally announced that CD burning on external SATA drives would be implemented which never happened. ISTR that there was also talk of a vocoder which never happened either.

Quote comradec:

Alesis seem to have cocked up big-time in marketing this product.



That would be fair to say as well, at least originally. But they did go to extraordinary lengths to 'rescue' the thing with a raft of OS updates, loads of new sound library, promotional incentives and so on. But for whatever reason(s), Fusion couldn't break the stranglehold 'the big 3' have on the market.

The fact is, however, that that was then and this is now. The OS is now stable with no real bugs to speak of (mostly 'quirks' and some odd operational implementations or omissions) and for the prices currently being advertised, Fusion is a great piece of underrated kit that is at least worth investigating.

IMO of course

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549140 - 23/11/07 01:34 PM
Quote table for two:

They way I like to "programs" drums is by overdubbing
ie. play the whole track and play the drums realtime as if it was just another instument.

No programming, no looping, no 1,2,3,4 bar patterns to copy and paste (though these are useful tools to have)

Does the Fusion alloow this.



Yes.

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jellyjim
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549194 - 23/11/07 03:29 PM
hollowsun, does the VA synth in the fusion share technology with the ion and micron? i've owned a micron, great synth, got sold tho to fund the purchase of my little phatty, can't have everything :-(

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: jellyjim]
      #549219 - 23/11/07 04:17 PM
Quote jellyjim:

hollowsun, does the VA synth in the fusion share technology with the ion and micron?



Surprisingly, no (Fusion uses different processors or something) but it does sound good. Put it this way, I know a few people who have both and they use their Fusion's VA more (though that could just be convenience of having it one box with all the other bits and bobs).

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DePulse



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549231 - 23/11/07 04:36 PM
Is it posisble to use the 8 inputs to the HD recorder as "mixer channels" i.e. can I mix my other synths into the Fusion at the same time I'm using the Fusion?

--------------------
TritonExtrMOSS/EX800, NordRack2, ATC1, D550/XV5080/MKS70/MKS7/MKS50/MKS80/S550/JP8080/Ju60/JD990, Blofeld, Mopho, TG77/An1X, ESQM, Emax, Esynth, AkaiS5k/MPC1k, Indigo2, Rogue, Machinedrum, ProOne


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_Nuno_



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: jellyjim]
      #549246 - 23/11/07 04:54 PM
Quote jellyjim:

hollowsun, does the VA synth in the fusion share technology with the ion and micron? i've owned a micron, great synth, got sold tho to fund the purchase of my little phatty, can't have everything :-(




I have both and they do have some stuff in common. The fusion has the edge on modulation possibilities because it has more envelopes and LFO's and on polyphony, but the micron has two filters and the fusion one only. I prefer the micron, but they both sound very good.


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: DePulse]
      #549270 - 23/11/07 05:34 PM
Quote DePulse:

Is it posisble to use the 8 inputs to the HD recorder as "mixer channels" i.e. can I mix my other synths into the Fusion at the same time I'm using the Fusion?



I believe so - in fact, I am almost certain.

i think you need to have the tracks permanently armed for record though.

I know some users do this. I imagine it would be a bit basic but could be useful I guess.

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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #549273 - 23/11/07 05:51 PM
Has anyone here used the Fusion as a MIDI controller with their software DAW?

I'd be interested to know if it's any good in that role.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #549780 - 25/11/07 06:18 PM
Is it possible to hook up the Fisuon to a pc via the Fusion's USB port and make it a USB MIDI KB controller.


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Music Wolf



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549803 - 25/11/07 07:35 PM
Quote table for two:

Is it possible to hook up the Fisuon to a pc via the Fusion's USB port and make it a USB MIDI KB controller.




I'm pretty sure that you can't. When you hook it up to a PC it shows up as an external Hard Drive. It doesn't appear as a MIDI input device in Cubase.

I may be wrong, and I'm sure that Hollow Sun could give a definitive answer, but its 4:30 in the morning here in Japan and I'm wide awake due to being on UK time so I'm offering advise on subjects where I have little, or no, expertise. So sorry if I mislead anyone - but I'm bored, .............and hungry.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Music Wolf]
      #549810 - 25/11/07 07:45 PM
Quote Music Wolf:

but its 4:30 in the morning here in Japan and I'm wide awake due to being on UK time
so I'm offering advise on subjects where I have little, or no, expertise.
So sorry if I mislead anyone - but I'm bored, .............and hungry.






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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549817 - 25/11/07 08:04 PM
Quote table for two:

Is it possible to hook up the Fisuon to a pc via the Fusion's USB port and make it a USB MIDI KB controller.



Sorry - no.

As the bored and hungry man in Japan says ... it's strictly for HD access only.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #549826 - 25/11/07 08:23 PM
ooops doubleh posteh


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #549827 - 25/11/07 08:23 PM
Thanx Wolfie & HS

If I plug in my mobile phone (with memory card) into a USB port
it offers options of either file transfer or phone services.

An OS update for the Fusion could do likewise.


Meanwhile there is this E-Mu MIDI 1X1 £21.99





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Gelled_Fringe



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #549942 - 26/11/07 01:38 AM
Quote comradec:

Has anyone here used the Fusion as a MIDI controller with their software DAW?

I'd be interested to know if it's any good in that role.




an excellent question - hollowsun?


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #549954 - 26/11/07 04:07 AM
I haven't used it extensively with plug-ins (because I don't use them - my armoury is almost totally hardware) but it worked fine. It works fine with my various bits of hardware gubbins as well.

I find the default factory global velocity setting to be too low (as do others) but increase that and it works just dandy (for me anyway). There are also several velocity curves to choose from.

Furthermore, in Fusion's MIX mode, you can set up 16-way layers and keyboard splits for external stuff (hard or soft).

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YamahaForums
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #550893 - 28/11/07 12:15 AM
Paid £250 for my Fusion 6HD. Has 80gb hard drive. Was the best the 250 quid I have spent in a long time.

Bit of a bummer that the usb doesn't also act as a midi port when the big 3 all have that feature but I guess it's not too much of a big deal..bit silly to leave it out though.

Hollow Sun packs really are the icing on the cake and the Fusion Converter software very useful for easily bringing in your Akai samples

Now I have the Fusion I really doubt I would ever part with it.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: YamahaForums]
      #550978 - 28/11/07 10:30 AM
Quote YamahaForums:

Paid £250 for my Fusion 6HD. Has 80gb hard drive. Was the best the 250 quid I have spent in a long time.
Hollow Sun packs really are the icing on the cake and the Fusion Converter software very useful for easily bringing in your Akai samples

Now I have the Fusion I really doubt I would ever part with it.






Heya Yamaha

When I was giggling the Fusion HD I came across your post in another forum and that you had bought this I think last week or something.


£250 is a brilliant price. Niiice one


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Dunewar



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #551037 - 28/11/07 12:53 PM
How's the piano in this thing, and the keyboard action? Any good? I'm a jazz player, and I lug around a Rompler (XV3080 Roland), a stage piano (yamaha P120) and soon a sampler (A3000) so I can take sounds from my juno and my wavestation with me without taking them on the road. I would love for one synth to take all these duties into one, so I can just take the synth, my MPC, and go playing, instead of my piano, a rack of synths/samplers and my mpc.

How comparable to a mid-priced stage piano are the stock piano sounds? Of course I could allways add more via sampling, but that would take away sampling memory.

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MarkOne



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Dunewar]
      #551080 - 28/11/07 03:12 PM
OK Action first

The 6HD is a pretty light synth action board, and for piano duties really won't cut it.

The 8HD which I have has weighted action and I personally like it a lot. It is not as heavy as some of the other 88 note boards, but there is sufficient bounce and tactile response that I find it very easy to play.

Now the piano sound.

Alesis has licensed the Holy Grail piano from Q Up Arts. Generally the Fusion user community is split on it - it seems to be a marmite sound (you love it or hate it) If you are used to some of the very bright stage piano sounds from Korg or Yammy you will probably dislike it. But the 4 continuous controllers default to EQ when you select this sound so it's easy to tailor the sound on the fly.

but take a listen to this Alesis demo and make up your own mind.

Something to mention, as you bring up the point about sample memory. The Fusion makes no distinction between ROM samples and HD samples. In both cases the machine has to load the sample data either from ROM or HD into sample RAM. In this regard it is very different from boards from the big 3 where ROM samples are generally played right out of ROM. This means if you are used to the concept of switch on-lights come on and you select a sound and instantly play, you will find the Fusion takes time to load samples into RAM (However you can pre-load stuff up to the sample RAM limit so you can switch pretty much instantly in a live situation) but to be fair a number of people coming from other workstations were complaining about load times. (They obviously never used a rack-mount sampler live!)

Hope this is helpful

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MadManDan



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: MarkOne]
      #551153 - 28/11/07 05:39 PM
Sadly, I’d lost my whole studio and have to start all over again. The Fusion 8HD looks SOOO NICE!!!!! The price around here is only $1000. What a time to be broke lol

Quote MarkOne:

Generally the Fusion user community is split on it - it seems to be a marmite sound (you love it or hate it) …but take a listen to this Alesis demo and make up your own mind.


I sort of like it, so that disputes the Marmite theory. I’ve never even tasted Marmite (coincidence???) But then again, presently I have no synths whatsoever, so how picky can I be?

I think that I'm critical of the piano sound hearing it solo. I'd imagine in the context of a piece of music it sounds right.

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Edited by MadManDan (28/11/07 05:48 PM)


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: MarkOne]
      #551166 - 28/11/07 06:00 PM
Mark is pretty much spot on in his analysis. Many use the 6HD for piano duties perfectly well but, of course, the 8HD's nicely weighted keyboard is bettter. And yes, opinions are divided about the on-board 'Holy Grail' piano.

That said, there are other pianos available for Fusion and that is one of Fusion's greatest strengths - the fact that it is a sampler as well as a ROMpler and so you can add your own piano(s) as you wish and save 'em to the built in HD and load/use 'em just like the on-board stuff (you could sample your P120 and maybe some of your fave sounds from the XV3080 if you find Fusion's don't cut it for you). As to your comment "that would take away sampling memory...." - not really ... your piano samples would use the same space as the 'Holy Grail' you would be replacing (IYSWIM - i.e. instead of loading the HGP, you'd load your own).

I know that the competition have sampling facilities but they don't appear (to me at least) to be as 'integrated' as Fusion's - that internal HD is not to be underestimated.

Incidentally, if you want to compare the two (HGP and your P120) side by side, try these:

8HD

P120

Quote MarkOne:

The Fusion makes no distinction between ROM samples and HD samples. In both cases the machine has to load the sample data either from ROM or HD into sample RAM.....

but to be fair a number of people coming from other workstations were complaining about load times. (They obviously never used a rack-mount sampler live!)



Correct but one thing worth mentioning perhaps is that unlike a typical rack sampler, there is no specific LOAD mode, page, menu - call it what you will - where you have to sit down and decide what to load. Instead, sampled sounds (your own, from ROM, any of the downloads, whatever) load on demand when selected and typically take just a few seconds. It should also be pointed out as well that once loaded, you can switch between them instantly (like a ROMpler).

FYI, the pianos included in Fusion as standard are:

* The Holy Grail Piano
* Yamaha CP70 Electric Grand
* The 'classic' electric piano that cannot be named for legal reasons
* Wurlitzer EP200
* Hohner Pianet
* RMI Electrapiano

All are sampled in detail with samples every minor third and with up to four velocity layers.

There is also a very tasty Yamaha grand piano floating around in the Fusion community that was created by a Fusion user.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #551182 - 28/11/07 06:42 PM
Quote hollowsun:

and that is one of Fusion's greatest strengths - the fact that it is a sampler as well as a ROMpler and so you can add your own piano(s) as you wish and save 'em to the built in HD and load/use 'em just like the on-board stuff (you could sample your P120 and maybe some of your fave sounds from the XV3080




This is SUCH an apppealing feature for me
"Import and convert WAVE files (.wav), AIFF files (.aif and .aiff), Akai S-1000/3000, SoundFonts (.sf2) files using the Alesis Fusion Converter application"

I can see myelf putting loads of converted sounds on the HD


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: YamahaForums]
      #551185 - 28/11/07 06:48 PM
Quote YamahaForums:



Bit of a bummer that the usb doesn't also act as a midi port ...bit silly to leave it out though.





One would have thought a firmware update might have resolved this ... but I guess no such updtes will be forthcoming.


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Dunewar



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #551299 - 29/11/07 07:54 AM
Tnx Hollowsun, i'll be sure to check it out once the P120 is due for replacement, it sure looks very good for the money, integrated sampling+rompler YEAH! I will check out the piano action though, i'm very picky in that department, so far only yamaha has been able to satisfy my hands, but I haven't tried the fusion yet.

One last small question though : how sturdy is the build quality? My P-120 is built like a tank, and has even survived a fall of the stairs without so much as a scratch. I gig almost every week, so it gets shoveled in and out my car a lot, on stage, of stage etc.... You get the picture. THe P-120 is absolutely unbeatable in that area, how's the fusion?

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Miles Davis


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: MarkOne]
      #551424 - 29/11/07 12:57 PM
Quote MarkOne:

Now the piano sound.

but take a listen to this Alesis demo and make up your own mind.





Thanx for that Mark

Reminded me of some of the John Coltrane cds I have.

Yes the sound is a bit bright but a bit of equing can fix that.


I actually Really like the piano samples that came with Sonar 3 Producer ... across the range soft, mellow, deep.

As Hollowsun says, can import a suitable piano file into the Fusion.

If I do end up getting the Fusion, this is mos def what I'll do.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #551447 - 29/11/07 02:13 PM
I wasn't totally enamoured by that demo, tbh. but i've got plenty of great pianos on my akai z4 i could easily port over. tis very tempting.

Quote table for two:

I actually Really like the piano samples that came with Sonar 3 Producer ... across the range soft, mellow, deep.




i've got Sonar producer 5 and 6. whereabouts are they? there are so many virtual instruments i haven't really had a go with many of them.


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #551453 - 29/11/07 02:20 PM
Hi there OMB

AFAIK ... they only came on a separate CD with Producer 3.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #551486 - 29/11/07 03:36 PM
really?

d'oh!

cheers tho


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Dunewar]
      #551602 - 29/11/07 08:18 PM
Quote Dunewar:

I will check out the piano action though, i'm very picky in that department, so far only yamaha has been able to satisfy my hands, but I haven't tried the fusion yet.



If the P120 has that graduated hammer action, Fusion may disappoint. But it's a nice action nonetheless - weighty enough for piano, light enough for synth, etc.. Well... for me anyway.

Quote Dunewar:

One last small question though : how sturdy is the build quality?



Strikes me as pretty sturdy ... 8HD in particular.

There are lots of Fusion users who gig with them regularly and they don't seem to have any trouble to speak of (that I am aware of anyway).

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Dunewar



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #551786 - 30/11/07 01:29 PM
Quote hollowsun:

Quote Dunewar:

I will check out the piano action though, i'm very picky in that department, so far only yamaha has been able to satisfy my hands, but I haven't tried the fusion yet.



If the P120 has that graduated hammer action, Fusion may disappoint. But it's a nice action nonetheless - weighty enough for piano, light enough for synth, etc.. Well... for me anyway.

Quote Dunewar:

One last small question though : how sturdy is the build quality?



Strikes me as pretty sturdy ... 8HD in particular.

There are lots of Fusion users who gig with them regularly and they don't seem to have any trouble to speak of (that I am aware of anyway).




Tnx hollowsun, in any case, I wouldn ever buy one to replace the P120 without trying. I could allways get the fusion 6 on top of my p-120, so I have the choice between synth action or piano action. I'm thinking about this...........

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"Do not fear mistakes. There are none."
Miles Davis


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leslam



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: pe-te]
      #552007 - 01/12/07 09:43 AM
I noticed you use the Fusion as a controller. I just purchased an HD8 and want to control my Korg M1, Alesis Nanosynth and Alesis Ion from my Fusion. Any suggestions?

Thanks


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: leslam]
      #552225 - 01/12/07 10:20 PM
Quote leslam:

I noticed you use the Fusion as a controller. I just purchased an HD8 and want to control my Korg M1, Alesis Nanosynth and Alesis Ion from my Fusion. Any suggestions?



MIDI OUT of Fusion to MIDI INs of those items.

You might want to adjust Fusion's global velocity parameter (GLOBAL > SETTINGS > Velocity Curve and Velocity Scaling) as the default is a bit low for controlling external gear (I use LOG curve and a setting of 50)

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #553262 - 04/12/07 06:46 PM
Anderton's have the 8HD at £599

http://www.andertons.co.uk/acatalog/info_FUSION8HD.html

Website says they are awaiting stock, bit I left a message on the enquiry form on the same page on moday afternoon
and today tuesday mid morning a slaes rep phoned me called Will Keen
who was well keen to do a sale & friendly.


So I asked him various details re warranty, after sales service, managers name, contacts, delivery, invoice.

Paid with maestro + £10 delivery by City-Link next day.

The order number is the customer ref num for City-Link.

About 4.20pm got an email from anderton's warehouse saying goods had been dispatched.
After 5pm I checked City-Link's site and in the tracking part entered the oorder number in the customer reference num box

sure enough it said

"Current Status: These goods have been scanned at the collection branch and are now on route to the delivery branch."


I am not counting my chickens, and knowing city-link its best to be realisitc
Hopefully it will be here by Thursday


Will Keen said they had 11 8HD's in stock.

Now 10, mebe less.


Many thanx to Hollowsun for all his aedvice and pointers and to everyone else on this thread



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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #553286 - 04/12/07 08:04 PM
Wow! Good 4 U T42

I hope it all goes well for you. Gimme a shout if you have any questions.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #553306 - 04/12/07 09:13 PM
Thanx HS


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #553679 - 05/12/07 04:34 PM
Well, I couldn't resist it at that price so I've gone and ordered the 6HD model from Turnkey.

They don't have any in stock now but say they're expecting some more on December 20. Alesis, I was told, are very reliable at delivering to schedule.

The Fusion's sampler appears to be a waste of time, at least as a phrase looper, not offering time stretch/beat synchronisation, but the synthesis options seem very exciting.

And I'm in the camp who like the look of this thing.

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #553693 - 05/12/07 04:42 PM
Quote comradec:

The Fusion's sampler appears to be a waste of time, at least as a phrase looper, not offering time stretch/beat synchronisation



Well... not a waste of time exactly but yes - no onboard stretch/beat match stuff. But....

You could do that outside of the box, mangle as you want and then lob it at Fusion via the convertor.

And if I remember correctly, ReCycle can export its slices to Akai S5/6000 .akp programs which can be converted for use in Fusion. The MIDI file it generates can be imported into Fusion too ..... I think - haven't tried it so can't vouch for that 100% (and I haven't used ReCycle for ages).

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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #553718 - 05/12/07 05:32 PM
I've ordered one too...YAY!!!

lets form a secret club.

i too have gone for the Anderton's 8HD deal, plus i've (rather dangerously) discovered the wonders of interest free credit

i've got loads of great stuff on my Akai z4 that i should be able to port over without too many hitches.

lets all rendez-vous in a week's time to compare notes.....

(rubs hands together)


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #553756 - 05/12/07 06:32 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

I've ordered one too...YAY!!!





Quote OneManBanned:

lets form a secret club.



There is already is one

Quote OneManBanned:

i've got loads of great stuff on my Akai z4 that i should be able to port over without too many hitches.



Should be fine. In fact, that's a nice system - do your sampling on the Z4 using ak.Sys, wave editors, etc., as before then lob it all at Fusion via the convertor. You won't need to change your sampling methods!

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leslawrenson



Joined: 14/03/06
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #553765 - 05/12/07 06:44 PM
Quote hollowsun:



And if I remember correctly, ReCycle can export its slices to Akai S5/6000 .akp programs which can be converted for use in Fusion. The MIDI file it generates can be imported into Fusion too ..... I think - haven't tried it so can't vouch for that 100% (and I haven't used ReCycle for ages).





You recall correctly, Hollowsun!

I've recently bought ReCycle 2.1 for the very purpose of chopping up files for importing into my Z4 via ak.Sys. And, also, for using it with Reason 4. It will certainly work with the S5/6000.

And a bloody marvellous tool ReCycle is, too!


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #553779 - 05/12/07 07:02 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

lets all rendez-vous in a week's time to compare notes.....
(rubs hands together)




We'll still be waiting for delivery then.

--------------------
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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #553815 - 05/12/07 08:59 PM
Well ... whadayaknaw

City-Link delivered on the right day ... that's gotta be a first

Aparently aprrox 4pm this afternoon


It is in someone elses place, as it had to be singed for.

Big up to Will Keen & Andertons ... they kept their side of the deal to deliver in 24hrs


Tracking available all the way on City-Link's website.


I am going to pick it up tomorrow and post a pic.


Thank you amigos


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #553853 - 05/12/07 10:56 PM
Okay hollowsun, now that you've won some converts, what online resources would you recommend for all us newbie Fusion owners?

(Yes, you can include your own site!)

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #553911 - 06/12/07 03:17 AM
Quote comradec:

Okay hollowsun, now that you've won some converts



Hang on a sec - that wasn't my intention. T42 start this thread - I simply filled in the details!

Quote comradec:

what online resources would you recommend for all us newbie Fusion owners?

(Yes, you can include your own site!)




Ok.....

Official sound library releases

My own Freepacks

Alternative grand piano

Another alternative grand piano

Various Fusion tutorials

Fusion Club forum

Hope this helps.

But I will say....

When your Fusion arrives, take it out of the box and and hook it up and play with it and make sure it's working ok before buggering about with updates, etc.. Give it a few days before you embark on that.

Assuming all's well, go about adding the new sounds bit by bit.

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Music Wolf



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #553924 - 06/12/07 06:15 AM
Quote hollowsun:



When your Fusion arrives, take it out of the box and and hook it up and play with it and make sure it's working ok before buggering about with updates, etc.. Give it a few days before you embark on that.






And don't throw the packaging away. My 6HD developed a fault within the first 30 days. Fortunately Thomann collected, repaired and returned in time for a vital session but they could have replaced it under their no quibble 30 day policy if only I'd kept the original packaging.

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Music Wolf]
      #554161 - 06/12/07 06:02 PM
Quote Music Wolf:

And don't throw the packaging away.



Good advice for almost everything these days not just synths, whatever. We had a problem with a microwave (oven not synth!) and they too would have just done a straight swap if we'd kept the packaging. As it is, we had to have it repaired.

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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #555673 - 11/12/07 04:38 PM
Ok

so my beast of keyboard has arrived today in all it's glory (8HD from Andertons - Jean was very helpful and communicative - delivery man, not so much. this thing is HEAVY ). i don't think i've ever bought something of this size new before. it felt like xmas had come early


Early impressions are....that i couldn't possible give any early impressions. I had a quick dabble and realised that this thing's gonna take me while - i barely scratched the surface in my 45 minute lunch break. just flicking through some of the programs gave me the impression that there certainly wasn't the lack of "sheen" i was expecting from reading some of the previous comments. There are plenty of good rhodes and wurlis and the Holy Grail Piano is more than useable. Certainly better than the Roland samples i last had a go with, IMHO.

Only other area i feel i can comment on is build quality which is of a high standard. Like my Alesis Ion, all knobs and buttons feel solid and firm and unlikely to come away or snap off. The keyboard action is good. Unlike real pianos or some of the more expensive weighted keyboards there isn't that initial resistance as the hammer is set in motion, instead it's a more uniform resistance which feels a tad mechanical. But it feels sturdy and, again, relatively high quality. Ofcourse, this doesn't apply to the 6HD.

anyway, gonna sit down over the next few evenings (hopefully) and have a proper play. i couldn't see how to access the synth engines or the recorder so i'll have a poke around the instructions after work.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #555905 - 12/12/07 11:12 AM
Quote OneManBanned:

The keyboard action is good. Unlike real pianos or some of the more expensive weighted keyboards there isn't that initial resistance as the hammer is set in motion, instead it's a more uniform resistance which feels a tad mechanical.




Ok, after setting it up along side my other weighted piano, i've completely changed my mind. The action on the Fusion is very good - i was in doubt coz the keyboard i'd played last was a nicely battered old upright. The manufacturers have even gone as far as dulling the finish on the black notes to give a more wooden "ivory" feel. Nice touch Plus, while the notes emit the usual dull thud when hammered, there's no trace of any internal mechanical noise sometimes present in cheaper controllers.

ok, bear with me. this next bit is probably more for my own benefit than anyone elses

I'm not sure what i was expecting really, but the whole keyboard comes across a lot more "workstation" than i thought it would be. There are a lots of shiney "EP plus strings" type patches (has anyone found a use for these this side of '95 ?) along side some quirky greats (ol steve hollowsun gets his own sound bank! my favourite so far? "Ruff Organ", plus the handful of odd drum machines).

I was also suprised at how well integrated the audio recorder is with the midi recorder. I was expecting the 8 audio ins to be completely discrete but you can set up a "song" to record any internal synth track via midi or audio track automatically, depending on whatever is receiving a signal - i think the problem mentioned previously revolved around the lack of ability to route a midi synth track to an audio input internally. Not a huge problem in my case. It integrats perfectly with my Motu 828mkII which currently has 8 redundant audio outs. Now i can route any of my other studio gear, including pod and mic preamps to any input on the fusion via the motu. The fusion also has an 8 channel (2 x stereo outputs, 4 FX bus outputs) ADAT out socket which, again, will make use of my redundant ADAT interface on the Motu.

One area of particular weakness which i did notice was the midi file editting. While the midi file display seemed perfectly comprehensive, as soon as you play the track to work out which note you want to edit, the screen is blanked and a message like "song is playing" is displayed!

this was all before ever really sticking my nose in the manual. the more i played, the more logical the layout seemed and i've just read of some key shortcuts that should make workflow quicker. so far, so very good...


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #555909 - 12/12/07 11:17 AM
Keep us informed of your progress, OneManBanned (this is the discussion thread that won't die).

I'm still awaiting the arrival of my Fusion 6HD, which Turnkey say will be dispatched on December 20. Strictly speaking, I'll have to wait until December 25, as it's an Xmas present from my partner.

--------------------
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http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #555914 - 12/12/07 11:30 AM
oh, one more small thing.

Steve, if you're reading, i noticed that when i tried to edit the programs on your bank purely to find out what was going on "under the hood", i got messages telling me the referenced audio files could not be located and yet the program worked perfectly well. is this some kind of copy protection as any default sounds referenced, like the Holy Grail piano, were displayed without problem?

i think i'm safe in saying this was the only sound bank in which it happened.


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #555955 - 12/12/07 12:56 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

oh, one more small thing.

Steve, if you're reading, i noticed that when i tried to edit the program....



OMB...

I think it's relevant to share your experience of Fusion here but we should take specific tech questions elsewhere to save boring the rest of the parish. PM me or pop along HERE. Happy to help but maybe here's not the place.

Glad to hear that your experience is positive though.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #556054 - 12/12/07 04:53 PM
Hi OMB

Quote OneManBanned:



Ok, after setting it up along side my other weighted piano, i've completely changed my mind.
The action on the Fusion is very good - dulling the finish on the black notes to give a more wooden "ivory" feel.
Nice touch
Plus, no trace of any internal mechanical noise sometimes present in cheaper controllers.






I'd agrre with that.

I've played a few 88key MIDI KB cintroller, 88note workstations, 88 noteelectric pianos
and New Kemble pianos (Kemble are my fave New pianos for action & soound)


The Fusion 8HD has is one of the best weighted actions i have played.
None of that sponginess rubbish on some 88kbs.
Nice springiness, decent travel, nice separation in the keys, comes back to the fingers nicely.
allows fast playing as well as mellow, with afertouch.

The keys themselves are well made, by Fatar AFAIB.
For me its a pleasure to play.



Quote:

I'm not sure what i was expecting really, but the whole keyboard comes across a lot more "workstation" than i thought it would be.
There are a lots of shiney "EP plus strings" type patches (has anyone found a use for these this side of '95 ?)
along side some quirky greats (ol steve hollowsun gets his own sound bank! my favourite so far? "Ruff Organ", plus the handful of odd drum machines).





For me there's 2 ways to look at the Fusion IMO

1. To see the Fusion as an instrument which allows one to be individual
as it allows the sculpting of any soound to fit our own personality, music.

Typical worksations are closed boxes, one has a fixed set of sounds.
It may give the immediacy of having typical sounds to hand but then we end up sounding like every one else = a sheep

Also the sounds in these typial workstations, sometimes a thousand or so are heavily comppressed
sometimes to fit into jsut 64MB or 160MB.


2. The Fusion an open box to add any number (thoousands) of high quality sounds to it 80GB harddisk...
just as one would on a PC by bying software and sample banks and placing in on the pcs harddsik.

Using chickensystems Fusion Pro cnverison software one can convert and import into the Fusion

http://www.chickensys.com/products/sw_iteminfo.php?sw_name=Fusion+Converto r+Pro

GigaStudio EXS-24 Steinberg HALion
NI Kontakt SoundFont Ensoniq
Akai samples Akai MPC Emu E3/ESi
Roland S-5x Kurzweil NI Battery
Emu E4 NI Reaktor PropellerHeads Reason
SampleCell Bitheadz Unity Recycle
Steinberg LM-4 Emulator X SFZ
ShortCircuit WAVE AIFF

There is nothing in the market in terms of an all incklusive kb that does this.
Not even the Oasys and the Oasys is £5399 !


The way the Fusion sees that HD is just as it sees the ROM, and it opens up any sound on the 80GB hard disk to be used sculpted, mangled using Fusion's software engines & sound sculpting tools.

Thus one can sound as uniqe as one wants.


Quote:

I was also suprised at how well integrated the audio recorder is with the midi recorder.
... can set up a "song" to record any internal synth track via midi or audio track automatically, depending on whatever is receiving a signal -




Yeah, the way the hd is integrated is very useful !



Quote:

Now i can route any of my other studio gear, including pod and mic preamps to any input on the fusion via the motu.
The fusion also has an 8 channel (2 x stereo outputs, 4 FX bus outputs) ADAT out socket which, again,
will make use of my redundant ADAT interface on the Motu.




The roouting options are ppretty neat.

Also can for instance plug a mic, geetar in to the 2 baanced inputs that have gain control,
use the Fusions synth engines as a fx, sculpting tool and take it out of the Fusion.

This to me is even more fun and powerful that say just a vocoder !


Quote:

One area of particular weakness which i did notice was the midi file editting.



TBH nearly all workstation withoout a mouse, this includes the Oasys, suffer from MIDI noote editing foibles.

Personally give the large screens of pcs and the toools available, I'd just export to pc and edit there.


Quote:

this was all before ever really sticking my nose in the manual. the more i played, the more logical the layout seemed and i've just read of some key shortcuts that should make workflow quicker. so far, so very good...




The manual is pretty kack
More useful info to be hand froom Hollowsun's Fusioneer forum and Fusionzone.

I find the Fusion so intutive, tha I have not looked at the manual for any operational things.
I have only used the manual too check up on different input outtputs




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paulustlocust



Joined: 07/06/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556085 - 12/12/07 05:58 PM
Quote comradec:

I'm still awaiting the arrival of my Fusion 6HD, which Turnkey say will be dispatched on December 20. Strictly speaking, I'll have to wait until December 25, as it's an Xmas present from my partner.




I don't mean to be the bearer of bad news, but I phoned them yesterday and they said that they wouldn't haven any for another 4 weeks. I'm very annoyed as I ordered mine 4 weeks ago already, AND they wanted the money upfront...

I'm praying to god this is the one time they actually deliver, cos I really really really want my Fusion but have been down this road before with Turnkey...

Maybe you are lucky though, and getting the 1st batch of stock or something? I don't know, but mine was due to be delivered this week and I'm annoyed!!

--------------------
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: paulustlocust]
      #556091 - 12/12/07 06:13 PM
Sorry to hear of your woes amigos

Page 1 of this thread


Quote table for two:

Aye if it is Trudkey, No matter how tempting the deal,
best way to buy from them is turn up in person and see the goods right in front.

If paying a deposit or full payment to Turdkey ... well you takes yer chances ... somewhere between Bob Hope and ....







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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: paulustlocust]
      #556195 - 12/12/07 11:33 PM
Quote paulustlocust:

I don't mean to be the bearer of bad news, but I phoned them yesterday and they said that they wouldn't haven any for another 4 weeks. I'm very annoyed as I ordered mine 4 weeks ago already, AND they wanted the money upfront...



Sorry to hear that.

Call Alesis UK on 01252 341 400 and try and establish what the supply situation is with your dealer.

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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #556199 - 12/12/07 11:40 PM
Glad to see you're liking your Fusion T42 - you've obviously 'got it' (in the sense of understanding what it's all about). So many haven't.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #556214 - 13/12/07 12:31 AM



Would you believe, though I've had it for nearly a week, i've ony played on it a total of 2 hours

But that was more than enough to figure out plenty.

I think its a doddle to use ... yet it can do so much.

I can think of any number of software, even workstations from now and yesteryear
that are far harder to use.

Hopefully I will have this weekend free to do something on it.

Cant wait to put a condenser through its sample input and mangle the sound






Oh & errrr

The integration of the 80GB hard disk as something to manipulate cannot be over estimated.
Not even the Oasys does this in the way the Fusion does nor as elegantly.







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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #556334 - 13/12/07 11:31 AM
Quote table for two:


The manual is pretty kack





Agreed.

It's deceptively large as there's a serious lack of ink. In it's favour it comes across as uncomplicated with a touch of humour without being patronising. Yet all it really achieves is to explain what all the onscreen labels mean, which are pretty obvious anyway.

I tried to find references to the dual sound engine and usb implementation in the manual but entries were either very brief or non-existant.

Ofcourse, that's where the forums come in.


Quote hollowsun:

you've obviously 'got it' (in the sense of understanding what it's all about). So many haven't.




What's not to get?

It's a completely open ended sound source with, as far as i'm concerned, infinite storage. i've been filling up my akai z4 with the best quality sample sets i can find for the past 2.5 years and i've only managed to reach about 11 to 12gb. I'm running out of ideas of stuff to put on it.


am getting my head round the song recorder and midi editting now and it's not as gauling as i first thought. you do need a keen ear to work out the note you want to edit mind. but hey, that's probably just good training.

and it's going to take me a while to get used to the usb connection. with the later akais, you can hook up usb and drag and drop your files and all the while play them as they arrive on the machine with 'aksys'. With the fusion, it acts like my Sony Ericcson. It stops functioning while windows treats it as an external storage device before returning to normal once the usb is disconnected. Not a huge problem but it meant that when one of the programs i loaded from my pc needed testing and altering i had to connect the fusion, load the files, disconnect the fusion to try the files, alter the offending file on the pc, reconnect the fusion, upload new file, disonnect fusion, try new file again. Still, most synths of this type don't even offer this feature so can't really complain.


Not, ofcourse, that i want to end on a negative.
I'm still very much in love with this machine (on day 3 ) and i'm certainly in no hurry to try and "conquer" it any time soon. there's no point. it'll take up all that time i should be spending making music.

And if i come across any niggles, i just think "£600"!!!


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #556348 - 13/12/07 12:05 PM
Quote OneManBanned:



It's a completely open ended sound source with, as far as i'm concerned, infinite storage. i've been filling up my akai z4 with the best quality sample sets i can find for the past 2.5 years and i've only managed to reach about 11 to 12gb. I'm running out of ideas of stuff to put on it.






OH YES .... I am almoost having palpitation thinking about this.

The integration of the 80GB harddisk, (which can be upograded to 120GB) !
withthe Fusions achitecture & synth engines is something else.

There is Nothing out there, Not even the Oasys, that does this.
Nor can the Oasys impoort such a large range of hardware & software sample formats ... only Akai S1000/ S3000, aiff, wav Korg's own libraries.
The Oasys is infact quite limited in this.



Quote:

am getting my head round the song recorder and midi editting now and it's not as gauling as i first thought.
you do need a keen ear to work out the note you want to edit mind. but hey, that's probably just good training.




Its pretyy ok. Quite usable. Though I still prefer to export to pc and edit there.


Quote:

With the fusion, it stops functioning while windows treats it as an external storage device before returning to normal once the usb is disconnected.




I think this is a useful unintentional safety feature such that things can't get mucked up in the Fusion


V.Important to ofcoure back up the Fusion first
and uninstall it proerly in windoze by clicking on the Green arrow near the clock Safely Remove Hardware.


Quote:

I'm still very much in love with this machine (on day 3 ) and i'm certainly in no hurry to try and "conquer" it any time soon. there's no point. it'll take up all that time i should be spending making music.
And if i come across any niggles, i just think "£600"!!!




I've had the 8HD for a week now, and played on if for .... all of 2 hrs DOH

I feel its possibilities allows me to go Loads of places my imaginaion takes me.

To me it really is an Out of the box instrument.


And £600 is just ridiculous.


If it had 2 dedicated mic pres, 2 hi-z gtr ins, 8 x100mm faders for mixing, 10.4" colour touch screen
modelling software for mic, gtr, eq, compression, mastering
it would eat the Oasys £5399 for brakfast.

As it is at £600 it almost makes a pancake out of the Oasys


I almost never spend such an amount in one go on myself, esp not music stuff.
But the 8HD gives me a warm glow




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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #556598 - 14/12/07 01:53 AM
I've had the dreaded email from Turnkey. They won't be taking delivery of my Fusion 6HD until January 16 due to problems at Alesis's end.

--------------------
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http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556608 - 14/12/07 03:22 AM
Quote comradec:

I've had the dreaded email from Turnkey. They won't be taking delivery of my Fusion 6HD until January 16 due to problems at Alesis's end.



Hmmmmmmmm....

Are you in a position to cancel your order, demand a refund under the circumstances and take your business elsewhere ... like to a dealer that can supply in a timely fashion such as T42 and OMB have used?

This seems a bit shabby and I am suspecting some blame shifting (although I can't vouch for the exact circumstances of course).

But this particular dealer's reputation precedes them!

Sorry to hear of your woes.

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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556633 - 14/12/07 09:37 AM
Quote comradec:

I've had the dreaded email from Turnkey. They won't be taking delivery of my Fusion 6HD until January 16 due to problems at Alesis's end.




Yeah, sorry to hear that Comradec. Maybe i'll shut up going on about how great it is.

Like Steve says, what are your options? i'd tell Turkey to stick it if you can get it elsewhere.


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556635 - 14/12/07 10:00 AM
Sorry you're being dicked around this way Comrade.

Not nice.

I certainly woouldn't appreciate it.


But hey chin up, its better than getting your ass chewn off by a dog

And by the time you get the Fusion, you will have So Many musical ideas


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paulustlocust



Joined: 07/06/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #556644 - 14/12/07 10:28 AM
Quote hollowsun:


Hmmmmmmmm....

Are you in a position to cancel your order, demand a refund under the circumstances and take your business elsewhere ... like to a dealer that can supply in a timely fashion such as T42 and OMB have used?




That's what I'd like to do! I can't find anywhere else that does a 6HD for £400 though... anyone wanna help me out?!

Paul

--------------------
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: paulustlocust]
      #556646 - 14/12/07 10:40 AM
Hi Paul

I really think the 8HD for extra £200 is worth going for : the kb is superb
and is so useful for playing, imrpovising, composing, hooking up to PC DAW.

It makes me feel as a "proper" player and makes me want to practce more ... which for a lazy person as me is something.


Various places do the 6HD but at £549, £589 or £599, crazy when teh 8HD is £599 !

Maybe you and Comrade can get a refund. Andertons were excellent with their 24hr delivery.





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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556669 - 14/12/07 11:35 AM
Quote comradec:

January 16




I'm not going to get much of a chance to play with mine with the build up to xmas anyway.

does that make it any easier?



seriously tho, if you can't find it anywhere cheaper, 4 weeks isn't that long in the grand scheme of things. You may well be using it for years to come. I do understand the frustration tho. I ordered another (controller) keyboard for my band a month and a half ago from Dolphin and they've only just got it in stock. again, they were the only people doing the deal.


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: paulustlocust]
      #556698 - 14/12/07 01:16 PM
Quote paulustlocust:

That's what I'd like to do! I can't find anywhere else that does a 6HD for £400 though... anyone wanna help me out?!



Just got off the phone to Alesis UK.....

The delay is genuine - the shipment's been held up for reasons unknown. Unfortunately, apart from Anderton's 8HD, seems no-one has any stock and are in the same boat (almost literally!).

So unless you're willing to shell out the extra £200 for Anderton's 8HD, the waiting game is the only option.

Should you choose to go for the 8HD, be sure to check availability with Anderton's first before cancelling your order with Turnkey.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #556799 - 14/12/07 06:28 PM
I'll wait for January 16. The 8HD isn't really an option for me because I'm no pianist. I've only ever used synth action keyboards and switching to weighted keys at this time in my life would probably deter me from using the Fusion altogether.

I also don't have the space. A 61-noter will fit nicely in the corner allocated for keyboards. An 88-noter would necessitate other things being sold on eBay.

I can live with the delay. It's just that my partner is buying me it for Xmas so it won't be available by then.

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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #556863 - 14/12/07 10:04 PM
Quote comradec:

The 8HD isn't really an option for me because I'm no pianist. I've only ever used synth action keyboards and switching to weighted keys at this time in my life would probably deter me from using the Fusion altogether.



Without wishing to throw further confusion into the pot....

I thought that about the 8HD having only ever really played synth keyboards but in fact, I like the 8HD's action so much it makes me WANT to play it!

Quote comradec:

I also don't have the space. A 61-noter will fit nicely in the corner allocated for keyboards. An 88-noter would necessitate other things being sold on eBay.



That, of course, is a different, more practical problem.

Quote comradec:

I can live with the delay. It's just that my partner is buying me it for Xmas so it won't be available by then.



That IS a shame

Take some consolation that there'll probably be some new sound banks released by then so some extra goodies to look forward to!

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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #556894 - 14/12/07 11:34 PM
Roll on floor laughing



Was aiming to get an early night tonight, but just thought i'd upload the Vstream free samples on the fusion (for which i thoroughly recommend Fusion Sort, downloadable here: Fusion Sort thread - be careful which column you drag the files from/to, i can't even remember now). Was happily auditioning them when one struck me as being particularly inspirational. I dialled up a new song and started trying to record. unfortunately nothing happened. I then spent the next 2 hours trying to figure out why the metronome stopped after the count in and no midi was recorded - it had worked for the previous songs i'd created. Anyway, to cut a long story short, i ended up leaving it for a bit, coming back and trying again and, hey presto, the Fusion had HEALED ITSELF

anyway, the real reason i felt like posting was to try and describe the sonic noodlings that came out of the resulting 15 minute recording session. Through no choice of my own, i found i had created a track that sounded like some deliquent bastard child of Kate Bush (Hollowsun's Fairlight samples), Gary Numan and Vangelis (various Vstream's samples). Given that i'm in my mid-20s (ahem) i've never really listened to those guys before (ok, i have a bit) - it just goes to show how the choices made by the sound providers can influence the output from this thing. All the sounds i've downloaded (primarily Hollowsun's and Vstream's freepacks) have a marvelous 80s retro-ness about them without being at all cheesey.

I have to admit, the whole recording process seemed somehow far more fun than booting up Sonar on my pc and specifying midi channels/audio ins etc. it all seemed to get very spontaneous. ofcourse it could never replace the ol' PC DAW, i guess i'm just suprised at how useful the Song function is, an aspect i initially presumed i'd entirely overlook.

i may even post the track up on my experimental myspace page. be warned, it's hilarious in a slightly bad way.


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #556903 - 15/12/07 12:22 AM
Quote OneManBanned:

Roll on floor laughing


anyway, the real reason i felt like posting was to try and describe the sonic noodlings that came out of the resulting 15 minute recording session.
Through no choice of my own, i found i had created a track that sounded like some deliquent bastard child of Kate Bush (Hollowsun's Fairlight samples), Gary Numan and Vangelis (various Vstream's samples)




Happy accidents often bring welcome surprises


Quote:

- it just goes to show how the choices made by the sound providers can influence the output from this thing.
All the sounds i've downloaded (primarily Hollowsun's and Vstream's freepacks) have a marvelous 80s retro-ness about them without being at all cheesey.







Yes these two downloads are synth oriented.

Can download into the Fsuion any sound synth to aocustic
from almost any hardware and software sample format
to sound like whoever, whatever onewants

http://www.soundsonline.com/home.php

http://www.soundsonline.com/Clearance-Sale-c-51.html EASTWEST sale

http://www.inspirationsounds.co.uk/acatalog/Sample-CDs.html

http://www.store.precisionsound.net/electronicproducer1info.php

http://www.wizoosounds.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/wizoosounds?c=e


Will need

Fusion Converter Free for Mac & Windows :
http://www.alesis.com/index.php?id=58,59,0,0,1,0

The Pro version converts many more formats
http://www.chickensys.com/products/sw_iteminfo.php?sw_name=Fusion+Converto r+Pro
http://www.fusionconvertor.com/upgrades/fusionconvertorpro/index.php < br />

Quote:


I have to admit, the whole recording process seemed somehow far more fun than booting up Sonar on my pc
and specifying midi channels/audio ins etc. it all seemed to get very spontaneous.
ofcourse it could never replace the ol' PC DAW,





Oh mos def ... i too have Sonar (3 priducer) and have been on daw's since 2002
and it was doing my head in creatively and musically.
Its so Non spontaneous.
Though I wil stilll use it for serious audio & midi editing.



Quote:

i guess i'm just suprised at how useful the Song function is, an aspect i initially presumed i'd entirely overlook.
i may even post the track up on my experimental myspace page.




I like the way the harddisk is integrated with the sequencer and anything on the harddisk is opned to manipulation.

Pesonally I am startiing to think again aboout buying esoteric and exciting stomp boxes
(a forumee mentioned the Session Award JD-10 responding to playing more like a real amp and speaker)
using the Fusions aux outs and possibly back into the Fusion via its dedicated sample inputs and mangling even more using its synth engines.

All amount of mangelage to be had on any sound ... synth and acoustic






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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #556952 - 15/12/07 10:08 AM
Quote table for two:



Can download into the Fsuion any sound synth to aocustic
from almost any hardware and software sample format
to sound like whoever, whatever onewants

http://www.soundsonline.com/home.php

http://www.soundsonline.com/Clearance-Sale-c-51.html EASTWEST sale

http://www.inspirationsounds.co.uk/acatalog/Sample-CDs.html

http://www.store.precisionsound.net/electronicproducer1info.php

http://www.wizoosounds.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/wizoosounds?c=e


Will need

Fusion Converter Free for Mac & Windows :
http://www.alesis.com/index.php?id=58,59,0,0,1,0

The Pro version converts many more formats
http://www.chickensys.com/products/sw_iteminfo.php?sw_name=Fusion+Converto r+Pro
http://www.fusionconvertor.com/upgrades/fusionconvertorpro/index.php




Don't have to tell me twice. As previously mentioned, i've got a z4 and i've already bought from sounds online. I also own the full version of Chicken-Systems Convertor but i've yet to test it out on my akai programs. Will have a dabble over the weekend.

BTW T4T, you considered the RAM upgrade yet?


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #556954 - 15/12/07 10:16 AM
Quote OneManBanned:

BTW T4T, you considered the RAM upgrade yet?




On that very topic, I read somewhere that the Fusion's RAM upgrade has to be factory-fitted. Is that correct?

--------------------
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http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #556979 - 15/12/07 11:46 AM
Quote OneManBanned:


Don't have to tell me twice. As previously mentioned, i've got a z4 and i've already bought from sounds online. I also own the full version of Chicken-Systems Convertor but i've yet to test it out on my akai programs. Will have a dabble over the weekend.





I really should read back on pevious posts .... i blame the late frrridhhay nite



comradec Quote:

BTW T4T, you considered the RAM upgrade yet?



I think this will have to be done.
Anderton's wern't doing it ...

Quote comradec:

On that very topic, I read somewhere that the Fusion's RAM upgrade has to be factory-fitted. Is that correct?



They are available for purchase I believe ... E3 memory for approx £70, at digital village and one can buy & fit i think
... hopefully Hollowsun Steve can pop in & enlighten







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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #557017 - 15/12/07 01:41 PM
Quote table for two:

Quote comradec:

On that very topic, I read somewhere that the Fusion's RAM upgrade has to be factory-fitted. Is that correct?



They are available for purchase I believe ... E3 memory for approx £70, at digital village and one can buy & fit i think
... hopefully Hollowsun Steve can pop in & enlighten




Actually, I read that in the SOS review of the Fusion: "The Fusion's 64MB memory can be upgraded with a 128MB factory-fitted RAM module" (my emphasis).

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #557077 - 15/12/07 04:29 PM
I've read a few threads on the subject on the Fusion forums.

Here's one:

http://promusicproducts.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2573&highligh t=song+record

I think this may be the one in which somebody mentions that they've spoken to alesis who say that installing it yourself doesn't necessarily invalidate the warranty, just as long as you don't break anything. I think we'd all agree that it's probably best to speak to alesis directly.

there's also a very useful pdf with accompanying photographs on how to install both ram modules - apparently one is very easy to access, the other involves a lot more work. the cofusing part is whether or not the ram upgrades offered by DV and Turnkey provide both 128meg modules, one for each signal processor. Some people have mistakenly upgraded only one - apparently not possible according to Alesis yet evidently it is.

If i can find out any more info on warranties i may well go ahead with the upgrade myself. i've no qualifications in electronics but i've upgraded stuff just like this before plus replaced broken pots and switches in various bits of gear. I can't imagine it's too hard.


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557079 - 15/12/07 04:38 PM
You can fit the memory expansion yourself - it's just bloody fiddly and you have a lot of screws to undo to get to the point where you can just pop the boards in.

If all goes well, you shouldn't invalidate the warranty ... and if you take care, all should go well.

As for the configuration, yes - you do need two boards. It can work with just the one (I gather) but there are 'issues'. Thing is, I don't know how they are sold. The £70 one T42 refers to, for example: I don't know if that is for one memory board or the two - you'd have to check - but you might need to buy two ... or not ... I dunno.

This doesn't help does it?!

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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #557105 - 15/12/07 06:22 PM
Quote hollowsun:

You can fit the memory expansion yourself - it's just bloody fiddly and you have a lot of screws to undo to get to the point where you can just pop the boards in.




I've successfully completed the same operation for Yamaha's Motif and the RS7000 in the past. It's a bid fiddly and nerve-wrecking if you're not confident about such things, but not really all that difficult, especially if you've undertaken the equivalent task with your computer at any time. It's not likely to be any more of an ordeal than a Motif upgrade, is it?

And how much of a difference does it actually make to performance? My Motif's maximum RAM is 64MB, which the Fusion has built in already. What are the main gains from upgrading? After all, there's already a hard drive in there, something the Motif certainly doesn't have.

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http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #557175 - 15/12/07 11:53 PM
Quote comradec:

I've successfully completed the same operation for Yamaha's Motif and the RS7000 in the past.



You should be ok.

I've not done it myself (I still have the standard 64MB) but I have seen someone doing it and it just looks a bit involved and fiddly.

Of course, in view of the delay on yours, you could always get Turnkey to fit it at source before they ship it to you.

Quote comradec:

And how much of a difference does it actually make to performance? My Motif's maximum RAM is 64MB, which the Fusion has built in already. What are the main gains from upgrading? After all, there's already a hard drive in there, something the Motif certainly doesn't have.



It just allows more sample-based material to be loaded at once which may or may not be an issue for you. It certainly helps if you're playing live.

It might be worth mentioning that Fusion doesn't load samples like a conventional sampler - there is no specific LOAD mode/page where you must decide in advance what sounds you want loaded, load them and wait while they all load before you can start playing. Instead, they load 'on-demand' when selected as you're flicking through the programs. Furthermore, when the memory is full, if you then select another sample-based sound, instead of giving an 'out of memory' error, it dumps samples from the first program loaded to make space. It's very clever and quite transparent. With the memory expansion installed, you can have more sample-based programs in memory before the system flushes anything.

FYI, sample-based programs typically take a few seconds to load (depending on the size of the samples). As an example, the Yamaha CP70 (which is very detailed and sampled at minor thirds) takes about 4 seconds or so to load.

I don't have the memory expansion installed and in the studio, I have not found this to be a problem.

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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #557366 - 16/12/07 06:41 PM
Ok.

I finally had a chance to try and convert some existing sampler programs i had into Fusion format using Chicken Systems translator with, quite predictably, varying degrees of success.

First off was, what i thought to be, a very simple multisampled tack piano that came in halion format on the front cover of a music mag a few years back. There are no clever modulations or envelopes, the samples are just played back with a small decay when the note is released.

Here's where the first hiccup occured - it turned out to be just over 80meg big! d'oh. looks like i may need the upgrade.

Next up was the much lauded Ultimate Piano collection from East West. This originally came in Akai cd format but after much hair loss and many emails to and from Chicken Systems, i managed to convert to .akp format (for my akai z4) soon after purchase. I chose my particular favourite Fazioli program which is split into two 62meg (or there abouts) programs which the aim of creating a mix using both signal processors (I know i jumped in the deep end here, but this was one i particularly wanted on my Fusion).

The conversion seemed to go fine again, but i couldn't load the second programme once the first had loaded using a mix whereby the second program uses the second processor (or so i've been told). Maybe i'd run out of memory or maybe the conversion hadn't worked. Maybe the fusion uses some of the sample ram to keep songs etc. either way the fusion just grunted and complained and i thought it probably best to start with something simpler.

Onto Hollowsuns Nostalgia sample set which i purchased last month in Kontakt format from Zero-G. I think i'm right in saying that these were originally made with limited RAM in mind so they'd be perfect. I started with about 8 or 9 minimoog patches from the US Classics folder and translator threw up no complaints.

I then A/B'ed the patches alongside Kontakt to see what the differences were.

First off, it was obvious that most didn't sound right. On investigation i found that simply opening up the low pass filter frequency seemed to solve the problem. Interestingly, in most cases, the filter had to have a frequency exactly 100 times that of the converted version in order to sound the same!! presumably a simple coding error. After carrying this ammendment out on my fusion patches plus adding any effects that were present in the Kontakt programs i ended up with some very accurately converted Fusion programs. The whole process taking about an hour and a half.

In my experience of converting from one sampler to another, this is generally the norm. Don't expect to buy a massive 4 gig halion library, load it up in translator and hit "translate" and expect to have all the patches on your fusion within the hour. It simply wont happen.

If you really like a patch then, by all means, port it over, but be prepared to put the time in to tweak it to sound like the original. No sample convert is 100% accurate.


I've not tried the free version of Fusion Sample Convertor as i believe it's just a cut down version of Translator made by the same people. Plus there are other alternative like CD Xtract which i currently have a demo of. I used it on some of the patches in Nostalgia that Translator didn't like and, while it did manage to convert them, the conversions retained none of their envelopes of modulation matrix connections. I'll try CDxtract when i get some more time and see what the outcome is. Past experience proves that the success rate of other convertors varies depending on the source programs. There's another program aswell i've been recommended but i can't bring to mind it's name right now...


My next post will be (if anyone's still reading this) on the subject of the "quirks" we've all heard about. Some might use stronger language. It'd be plain wrong to suggest that the fusion is perfect coz it isn't.

As i'm learning my way around, i'm also learning the pitfalls and the oddities that surround it and i've not seen many of them mentioned before. atleast not on the sos forums or reviews.

watch this space

ps don't worry, all those who're waiting for theirs, it's not "cancel your order time"


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557377 - 16/12/07 07:17 PM
Heya OMB

I think a fair amount of people who have not converted sample formats may expect 100% conversion,
but those who have experience of conversion know that this is not the case
regardless of what conversion tool they are using and from what to whom they are converting.


I'd be very interested to read of your quirky exeriences

Every hardware has quirks, with the Fusion it just maker us love her more


Given the amount of stuff the Fusion can do,
and only the Oasys (with its complex interface) at 10x the price is the only other instument in the market that compares,
and the ease of use of the Fusions many functions,
one would expect quirks.



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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #557410 - 16/12/07 08:35 PM
you're quite right. Many "quirks" could easily be replaced with the word "comprimises", tho not all


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557423 - 16/12/07 09:08 PM


Personally in terms of hardware I would liked to have seen

1. Sample streaming from hd ... might be tricky to implement. No one has done this.

2. 8x 100mm faders ... theres plenty of real estate on the 8hd.

3. Replacing the dedicated bank buttons, with more dedicated performance knobs that could also be used for pc DAW control
....
the category button, forward backward buttons, prev, next buttons and data wheel are plenty to select sounds.

4. Optical in

5. USB that allowed the Fusion to be as a MIDI Kb controller, not just for data transfer ... a firmware would resolve this i believe.

6. Firewire & ethernet port & the esata port to work.

7. 2 decent mic pres.


But then it might be £1699, still an absolute bargain, though not the steal at £599
... and it would blow the Oasys out the water.


I have been doing a comparison with the Oasys, and the Fusion comes out on top in quite a few aspects:


ability to add literally thousands of quality sounds ... might need the ram upgrade though for some of those big sounds
ability to add far more sampling formats
sample & sound mangling & sculpting
Fusions VA synth is better, Fusions of course also has FM
the mod matrix
routing options
the way the hard disk is open to the Fusions synth engines
the way the hd recorder is integrated with the squencer
immediacy
ease of use.









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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557428 - 16/12/07 09:22 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

I finally had a chance to try and convert some existing sampler programs i had into Fusion format using Chicken Systems translator with, quite predictably, varying degrees of success.

First off.....



Coo - you jumped in at the deep end a bit there didn't you?!

Most of the convertors/translators only cover the basics such as key mapping and maybe envelopes. They can rarely do LFOs and stuff because of the many different ways they are implemented in the various samplers. As for other parameters (such as filter cutoff), most can only guess.

In other words, it doesn't surprise me you had some trouble with the conversions you tried - I have had exactly the same problems here converting from one format to another over the years.

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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #557552 - 17/12/07 10:56 AM
Quote hollowsun:


Most of the convertors/translators only cover the basics such as key mapping and maybe envelopes. They can rarely do LFOs and stuff because of the many different ways they are implemented in the various samplers. As for other parameters (such as filter cutoff), most can only guess.





I was actually quite suprised at how much info was retained (using Chicken Systems Translator). You're right about the LFOs but i was glad to see that filter type, cutoff (in a way!), keymapping plus many of the basic modulation matrix entries survived intact.

One particular niggle i did have during the whole process was locating missing samples on the Fusion HD. Whenever i loaded up any of the newly converted programs, none of the associated samples were located so i was prompted to do it manually (maybe something to do with the conversion - maybe coz i had already moved them around before checking they worked after verification).

The problem i had here was that the fusion offers you no help in finding the file - you have to cycle through every sample folder on the HD (as far as i know, there's no way to organise these folders) until you've located the file you want. If the program requires another sample from the same folder (or the same sample again!) the fusion sticks you straight back at square one instead of putting you back to the folder you were just in!

I may be wrong on this one but if anyone knows of a work around i'd be eternally indebted. Is there some kind of shortcut?

That's maybe one for the Fusion forums.


Quote table for two:


6. Firewire & ethernet port & the esata port to work.





does the Sata port not work? tut tut

i think i'll have to get my head round this thing a little more before i start banding round more complaints. On several occasions, when something inexplicable has just happened, I've been all ready to launch into some huge rant only realise i've just pressed the wrong button


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557569 - 17/12/07 11:30 AM
Quote OneManBanned:



One particular niggle i did have during the whole process was locating missing samples on the Fusion HD. ...

- you have to cycle through every sample folder on the HD (as far as i know, there's no way to organise these folders) until you've located the file you want.


... if anyone knows of a work around i'd be eternally indebted. Is there some kind of shortcut?
That's maybe one for the Fusion forums.




FusionSort
http://fusioneer.proboards102.com/index.cgi?board=3rdparty&action=display& thread=1165457188



Quote:

does the Sata port not work? tut tut



No. But I think it showed excellent foresight by Alesis, no one else has one.

Quote:

i think i'll have to get my head round this thing a little more before i start banding round more complaints.
On several occasions, when something inexplicable has just happened, I've been all ready to launch into some huge rant
only realise i've just pressed the wrong button





Back of the class, and await summons to headmistress for your ritual caning


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #557590 - 17/12/07 12:30 PM
Quote table for two:



FusionSort
http://fusioneer.proboards102.com/index.cgi?board=3rdparty&action=display& thread=1165457188





Fusion Sort is a great little program. I'm suprised Alesis didn't provided this kind of software on their website. Anyway, at the moment it doesn't offer any way to organise samples, only programs and banks.


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #557620 - 17/12/07 01:57 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

maybe coz i had already moved them around before checking they worked after verification



Uh-oh!

Fusion Newbie Error #1 - Manually moving samples, multi-samples and programs around on the drive.

The multi-samples and samples used in any program have a pathname that relate to and point to the program(s) that use them. Move any of those around manually and things cannot be found (because the pathname is broken) giving rise to a "XYZ can't be found" error message.

So, for example, you have a program called 'Strings' sitting in a new folder called, say, 'Fusion Strings'. That program has a multi-sample which contains the various component samples. They all have a pathname:

The program is looking for:

HD/Volume/Strings/Strings.afi

The multi-sample is looking for:

HD/Volume/Strings/StrEnsmb1.afs
HD/Volume/Strings/StrEnsmb2.afs
HD/Volume/Strings/StrEnsmb3.afs
HD/Volume/Strings/StrEnsmb4.afs
HD/Volume/Strings/StrEnsmb5.afs

All fine.

But now you move some stuff or maybe rename it to something you prefer. The pathname is broken - the program is looking for stuff in a given location but can't find it.

This is not uncommon on other samplers. Move stuff around or rename stuff on Kontakt, for example, and you can get stuffed. Similarly on your Z4 - programs and samples have to be in the same folder else you'll have problem loading stuff.

This is not uncommon in some apps either. For example, in a document that references some external image, if that image is moved (or indeed, if the document is moved), the pathname is disrupted so can't display it.

Similarly on a website - if an HTML document has an image (or anything else) to link to, if the image (whatever) is moved or renamed, the link is buggered.

As I say, it is (for some reason) one of the first problems Fusion noobs encounter - they go moving stuff around and renaming it and then wonder why they get "Can't find XYZ" error.

I suggest you become more familiar with Fusion and its file structure before messing around too much with the disk contents.

And make sure you have a back-up of a working copy before you go buggering around too much and wreck it beyond rescue.

Alternatively, don't go buggering about with stuff on the disk and just leave it where it was installed!

--------------------
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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #558485 - 18/12/07 09:25 AM
Hi steve.

Maybe i should've made myself a little clearer. I've never moved any files around on the Fusion HD manually. I've only ever used Fusion Sort, presuming this to be pretty much safe.

I'm all to aware of the pitfalls of moving referenced files in any file system. I maybe a noob to the fusion, but i'm not a noob to sampling in general. Tho i can understand your frustration with probably having to deal with many users going around messing up the HD.


Given that i haven't been misbehaving as such, i'm still left with a slight problem. I checked last night by converting a batch of new programs, the Odyssey pads and basses from folder 1 of Nostalgia. This time i loaded up the new programs straight away and, sure enough, no problems (apart from the inevitable loss of LFOs etc).

I then used Fusion Sort to move the first three programs into the bank where i'm currently storing all Nostalgia programs.

When these three programs are now loaded, the samples cannot be located and yet i've moved plenty of programs around before this way with no problems.

Is there something happening to the sample path that i'm not aware of? I just presumed the samples would be left untouched. If the Odysset samples are being moved then how come this problem has occured before?

when i get a spare 20mins i'll go and maybe take a peek at what's happening to the sample folders.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #558521 - 18/12/07 11:04 AM
Quote OneManBanned:

If the Odysset samples are being moved then how come this problem has occured before?




Sorry, that should read:

"If the Odyssey samples are being moved then how come this problem hasn't occured before?"


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #558524 - 18/12/07 11:06 AM
Quote OneManBanned:

I've only ever used Fusion Sort, presuming this to be pretty much safe.



I don't know - never used it myself.

I think this chat should move HERE A) so as not to bore folk here and B) because there is more likelihood of answers from people with experience of Fusionsort.

Me? I just convert my S5000 stuff using Fusion Convertor and lob it as it at Fusion via USB and all's well.

--------------------
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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #558704 - 18/12/07 05:43 PM
Oh dear.

This is something to watch out for. I've just had to call up Anderton's and enquire about their returns policy.

I've come to notice that all the black notes play considerably louder than the white notes on my new Fusion 8HD. Infact on standard setting i simply can't get the white notes to play maxiumum velocity whereas it's really quite easy with the black notes. I've also noticed on the fusion forums that this problem has reared it's ugly head before. Hopefully it's just a mechanical problem present in the odd synth.

If I was just using it as a synth i don't think i'd mind or notice, but the aim was for it to become my main studio piano. If, whenever i move to play any black notes, the volume suddenly jumps up it just sounds like i'm playing badly. it's also particularly noticeable when using the reed modelled patches - basically any programs that sound different in the highest velocity areas.

If i haven't already scared everyone off with sample talk, i'll let people know how it pans out....


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #558951 - 19/12/07 02:10 PM
Heya OMB

I'm a newbie too ... a 2 week newbie

Have you tried the different veoclity curves.

I don't think you've sacred off anyone due to sample conversion ...
which is a well known headscratching from decades ago ..
and is ony a part of what the Fusion can do

nor about the kb misbehaving, which is rare on the forums,
plenty of issues and problems in instruments from the big boys too

i'd be surprised if there were such wusses around who did get "scared"

BTW, Keep it away from radiators




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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #558954 - 19/12/07 02:20 PM
Quote table for two:

BTW, Keep it away from radiators




When you say that, how far away do you mean? Is there a particular issue with Fusion being near heat?

My keyboards stand is quite near a radiator because there's nowhere else for it to go in the little box room I use for a home studio. Not so near that it's caused any problem for my other gear though. Is the Fusion particularly susceptible?

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #558966 - 19/12/07 02:32 PM
The Fusion, apart from the Oasys, is the only such instrument with a hard disk inside it,
and a 7200rpm hd, which ofcourse generates its own heat.

If keeping the Fusion ON (Not off) constantly and always right near a radiator, then one may see the screen brigntess change.

I'd say keep ALL insturments away from heat sources to prolong their life,
esp as these instruments have a psu built in, which ofcourse generates its own heat.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #558993 - 19/12/07 03:53 PM
Quote table for two:


Have you tried the different veoclity curves.





yes, this was my first port of call upon discovering the problem. I found most velocity curves only served to exacerbate the problem except for one.

the problem is almost unnoticeable with an exponential velocity curve and scaling of around 30. Unfortunately the side affect is that this seems to compress all the velocities to a very small range. Just tapping the key causes the velocity to jump up to about half and the only way to get lower velocities is to lower the note very slowly, a technique that would result in no sound at all on a proper piano.

anyway, i'll hopefully get a replacement from andertons and, should it suffer from the same problem, i'll have to make a decision about whether or not it's something i think i could live with.

T4T could you do a simple test for me?
could you load up the main piano (can't recall it's name right now) and see how hard you have to hit the white keys and black keys to get the loudest piano sample to play? You can hear the loudest piano sample on each note as it's clearly brighter and sharper than the slightly softer one before it. I can't remember whether or not you have the 8HD or 6HD but, like i said, on mine there's a clear difference in the amount of force needed. i have to absolutely belt the white notes to get them to max velocity. And it's not just my ears that confirm the problem. I've watched the midi output with a monitor on my computer and, sure enough, the numeric velocities between the black and white notes differs significantly - and no, i don't have this problem with my battered upright piano/Roland jv1000/technics px55/Studiologic VMK-161 or Alesis Ion - AFAIK there's nothing wrong with my arms


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_Nuno_



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559000 - 19/12/07 04:20 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

Quote table for two:


Have you tried the different veoclity curves.





yes, this was my first port of call upon discovering the problem. I found most velocity curves only served to exacerbate the problem except for one.

the problem is almost unnoticeable with an exponential velocity curve and scaling of around 30. Unfortunately the side affect is that this seems to compress all the velocities to a very small range. Just tapping the key causes the velocity to jump up to about half and the only way to get lower velocities is to lower the note very slowly, a technique that would result in no sound at all on a proper piano.

anyway, i'll hopefully get a replacement from andertons and, should it suffer from the same problem, i'll have to make a decision about whether or not it's something i think i could live with.

T4T could you do a simple test for me?
could you load up the main piano (can't recall it's name right now) and see how hard you have to hit the white keys and black keys to get the loudest piano sample to play? You can hear the loudest piano sample on each note as it's clearly brighter and sharper than the slightly softer one before it. I can't remember whether or not you have the 8HD or 6HD but, like i said, on mine there's a clear difference in the amount of force needed. i have to absolutely belt the white notes to get them to max velocity. And it's not just my ears that confirm the problem. I've watched the midi output with a monitor on my computer and, sure enough, the numeric velocities between the black and white notes differs significantly - and no, i don't have this problem with my battered upright piano/Roland jv1000/technics px55/Studiologic VMK-161 or Alesis Ion - AFAIK there's nothing wrong with my arms




As far as I remember this is a pretty common defect in the fusion and there are plenty of reports about it in the fusion forums. My H8D doesn't suffer from it, but if I remember correctly, and I might not, the fix is quite simple and just involves taking the cover off, loosening a few screws and adjusting position of the key bed.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: _Nuno_]
      #559004 - 19/12/07 04:31 PM
Really!?!?!

where do i find out how?????

please Nuno, you're my only hope


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_Nuno_



Joined: 20/05/06
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559013 - 19/12/07 04:50 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

Really!?!?!

where do i find out how?????

please Nuno, you're my only hope






this thread has some info but upon reading I realized that the keybed misalignment seems to produce clicks on the 8HD, and that the higher velocity in the black keys is a defect with the 6HD. I am not sure aligning the key bed would help in your case



You might want to have a look at the fusion forums and do a search there.

And I'd say it's better to contact alesis before doing anything since that might void your warranty.


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #559015 - 19/12/07 05:04 PM
yeah, i've just been checking the forums aswell. looks like it maybe related to Alesis compensating for the 6HD keyboard but using the same OS in the 8HD therefore creating a new problem.

cheers for looking tho

Looks like it's back to the shop for mine. Maybe this has something to do with the price slash?


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559040 - 19/12/07 06:05 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

Maybe this has something to do with the price slash?



Nothing at all.

Some users complained about this on their 6HDs but I've not seen anyone complain about it on their 8HD.

This did seem to be an issue a while back too - I've not heard anyone mention it for like a year or so now however (that I recall anyway).

I don't have the problem here and I can't say that I have ever experienced (or noticed) it on any others (inc. 6HD).

Dunno what to suggest other than getting a replacement but I can't see that happening before Christmas (or until the new year to be honest).

FWIW, my velocity settings are LOG/50.

And as I say, these findings might be better discussed HERE rather than clogging up the SOS forum with it.

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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559144 - 20/12/07 12:33 AM
Quote OneManBanned:


T4T could you do a simple test for me?




Heya OMB

It is ok on the 8HD that is with me.

Exactly when did this manifest btw. Have you had it for a week and was it fine at the beginning, if so what happened just prior.

Do you want to reset to factory settings and see how you get on ... as the velocity response is os controlled.


Personally from spending a lot of time on the pc forum ... people post only when they have a problem
they never posted prior to having a problem
and
loads of people dodnt post because they don't have a problem
likewise with the posts on the Fusion forums, Yamaha forums, Korg, Roland forums







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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #559235 - 20/12/07 10:46 AM
Don't worry, after this post i won't continue to 'clog' this thread anymore with this problem.

Quote hollowsun:


FWIW, my velocity settings are LOG/50.





Interestingly, these settings do succeed in ironing out the problem. The side affect, as previously mentioned, is that it's difficult to obtain lower velocity ranges (upto about 55 out of 127). I did manage to get the velocity scaling down to 35 before i noticed any difference between black and white keys tho - TBH i think i could potentially live that. it then responded very similarly to my Fatar keyboard.

Quote table for two:


Exactly when did this manifest btw. Have you had it for a week and was it fine at the beginning, if so what happened just prior.

Do you want to reset to factory settings and see how you get on ... as the velocity response is os controlled.





I first noticed it when i sat down to use the piano for a prolongued period, i don't think it 'started' at any point. i could try a reset i guess, no harm in it given that i'm getting a replacement anyway.

Like you say tho, people only generally pipe up when there's a complaint so i have every confidence that the next one i get will be fine. If you're considering buying one, don't be put of by my experience as it's clearly not widespread.

sorry if i've bored anyone. However, this is a thread regarding the new price of the Alesis Fusion, those who subsequently bought it and their experiences.



ps i've come up with a clear way to test for the black/white note problem. just set Velocity curve to EXP with scaling of 45 and play a chugging black note chord, then play down a semi tone with the same force.


there, i'm all done, and i still got love for da fusion


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Roid



Joined: 23/07/07
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Loc: Somerset
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #559288 - 20/12/07 12:45 PM
Actually FWIW I've found this thread valuable as I am considering buying an 8HD myself.


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559313 - 20/12/07 01:33 PM
Quote OneManBanned:

If you're considering buying one, don't be put of by my experience as it's clearly not widespread.




Yep you are right there, issues as with any other instrment from any other manufacturer, is limited.

I managed to get the 8HD two weeks ago, after I compared it to the motif XS8, fantom X8, Triton TR88 roland vsynth, korg m3 88, kurzweil pc2x, oasys.

The only one that came close to the Fusion was the Oasys £5399.
And once one looks past the "OMG its an Oasys", and looks as what it does
the Fusion wins out on quite a few counts as mentioned above and a few more that i didn't mention


Quote:

i still got love for da fusion



Given the whole heap she can do and the bang per buck she gives


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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: Roid]
      #559741 - 21/12/07 04:22 PM
Quote Roid:

Actually FWIW I've found this thread valuable as I am considering buying an 8HD myself.




That's not me using another alias by the way
glad to see it's not just me who's benefiting from my rants.

Welcome to the forums, Roid.


You're reading "Alesis Fusion 6HD £399".
The thread that never dies...


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rofox
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #559789 - 21/12/07 06:50 PM
Keep posting OneManBanned, You're helping all of us interested in the Fusion. Since the start of the thread it's been....Yes I will....Oh no I won't..Oh yes I will..
(Well, it is pantomime season!) He's behind you!.
You're not clogging the thread; it's called free exchange of information.


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: rofox]
      #559793 - 21/12/07 07:04 PM
Heya ROfOx

Yes !!!!!

Pleaaaase keep this thread going

its the only thead i've ever had on with so many reponses & views
well ... apart from the "post a picture of yourself" i did in Off Topic about a year ago.


TBH ... once I compared all the other workstations, incluing the

Fantom X8 fully expanded with 4 expansion boards
Motif XS8
KorgM3 88 with Radias board
Korg Oasys

it was a no brainer

It beats the lot of them ....

And if it had just a few additons it would be on a different planet







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Roid



Joined: 23/07/07
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559816 - 21/12/07 09:21 PM


That's not me using another alias by the way
glad to see it's not just me who's benefiting from my rants.

Welcome to the forums, Roid.


Thank you! Just getting back into music making after a few years domestic hiatus - really can't be faffed to go down the DAW route, so 8HD seems like a good way back in. Now, if only I could find a way to port all my Roland S760 sample library from the redundant scsi SyQuest 270mb cartridges gathering dust in the loft I'd be a happy bunny...


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: rofox]
      #559886 - 22/12/07 03:09 AM
Quote rofox:

Since the start of the thread it's been....Yes I will....Oh no I won't..Oh yes I will..





Quote Roid:

Thank you! Just getting back into music making after a few years domestic hiatus - really can't be faffed to go down the DAW route, so 8HD seems like a good way back in.




This might be of a little use

link




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OneManBanned



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #559934 - 22/12/07 11:40 AM
Quote table for two:


This might be of a little use

link







Blimey, T4T! you have been a busy boy. Consider it officially bookmarked.
(You don't work for alesis do you? ).

I've downloaded the free Luc Henrion piano you've linked to but it's only a program file. Presumably it uses existing multis/samples from the rom banks(?). Would love to try it but my Fusion's trussed up like an xmas turkey awaiting exchange Shoulda just kept it out to have a play.

Quote rofox:

Keep posting OneManBanned, You're helping all of us interested in the Fusion.




Oh no. i've suddenly been overcome with a sensation i can only presume is 'responsibility'

Well, where am i in my festive Fusion journey? Like i said, she's all packaged up against one wall in my studio (fusion, not wife) and TBH i really wanna unpack it and have a play (fusion, not wife). I miss her....sniff (again, fusion). I'm almost willing to forgive her for the weighting issue (given that i did pretty much find a work around). The days of files apparently going missing or the occasional long loading times have almost all been forgotten.

Put it this way: If the next one arrives and still has a problem (which i'm assured will be highly unlikely - we'll see) i'll probably just keep it and be happy. Yes i have an akai z4, an Alesis Ion and a technics px55 weighted 88note digital piano. And yes, i've got a PC with sonar, a dictaphone AND a zoom MRS-8 digital 8 track for capturing any 'magic' moments, but somehow having everyone in one keyboard just makes sense. You turn it on, you play. That's when the inspiration comes. Plus, once/if i'm happy with the fusion that lot can go straight on ebay and probably end up paying for the fusion and some. I used to hanker after a complex cave of wonders filled with patch cables, faders and tape loops that reached up to a padded ceiling. I've learnt over the past couple of years that that was simply not conducive to anything. There may be a great atmosphere and opportunities to create some amazing sounds but nothing actually gets done. The fusion has the potential to cut down on all the bits of gear i have lying around and that, to me , is a good thing.

With the fusion, as T4T has said on several occasions, you get an open sound source so what it sounds like is up to you. With this freedom does come responsibility tho and, on the occasions i did find myself trying to load a patch with missing files i soon found a logical source of the problem, namely me, ahem. tho in my defence, the fusion does have a strict filing system where things must be listed and verified. All in all, it'll take you weeks to get used to if you're planning on using it to it's full potential. To me, that learning process is great and all the more satisfying once you've mastered it.

Anyway, none of you bad lads should be thinking about forking out £600 on a keyboard 3 days before xmas!!!


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table for two
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: OneManBanned]
      #559989 - 22/12/07 03:15 PM
Quote OneManBanned:


(You don't work for alesis do you? ).






I could do with a mem upgrade to 2x192MB.

Also an Alesis IO firewire audio card.


Quote:

With the fusion ... you get an open sound source so what it sounds like is up to you. With this freedom does come responsibility




Aye ....

With great power comes great responsibility.






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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #560032 - 22/12/07 05:45 PM
The thread that refused to die ...

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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Roid



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #560429 - 24/12/07 01:03 PM
Quote table for two:

Quote rofox:

Since the start of the thread it's been....Yes I will....Oh no I won't..Oh yes I will..





Quote Roid:

Thank you! Just getting back into music making after a few years domestic hiatus - really can't be faffed to go down the DAW route, so 8HD seems like a good way back in.




This might be of a little use

link







Thanks for that T42 - my, what a load of resources!!

Anyway, have decided to take the plunge & pick up my 8HD on 27/12 - Merry Christmas to me. And everyone else,of course, especially those providing such helpful info.

I'll let you know how we get on!


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OneManBanned



Joined: 13/12/04
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #563507 - 04/01/08 07:16 PM
I hate to say it boys and girls but i've just had my Fusion 8HD replaced by Anderton's with another brand spanking new one only to find...

THE KEYBOARD ISSUE STILL EXISTS!!
(black notes play at higher velocities than white notes)


just as i suspected. The topic has appeared on numerous occasions throughout the fusions lifetime - not something you generally get with other keyboards. Anyway, i plugged it in and did exactly the same test i mentioned earlier in the thread and, lo and behold, exactly the same problem occured.

Before anyone launches into a rant about "bad batches" and the chances being second to none, a member of the fusion forums posted up an email he received from Alesis admitting to the problem but the moderators have since removed the quote.

here are some other threads on the issue (can't remember if the one i refered to is here):

Fusionzone 1

Fusionzone 2

Fusionzone 3

Fusionzone 4

there are more but you can find them yourselves.

The idea i suggested earlier about it maybe being something to do with alesis dropping the price doesn't seem quite so far removed now.

I'd be open to the idea that i did simply have a bad couple of machines if it weren't for the aforementioned reasons plus the fact that the problem is absolutely identicle on both and there is clearly nothing mechanically wrong with either.


So what now? well, i'm going to spend the weekend worknig out if it's something i feel i can live with. If you've got an 8HD and don't notice the problem then you're lucky - i suspect it's probably there tho.

However, there is some good news. As i mentioned, tweaking the velocity curves can iron out most of the problem plus it's only really noticeable with sounds that trigger different samples at different velocities e.g pianos, guitars.

I really WANT to forgive and forget. time will tell....



I apologise if this contradicts other people's experiences or interests. I'm only relaying my own discoveries and i fully admit that there is no proof that all Fusions suffer from this defect.


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oggy1310
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #570312 - 21/01/08 03:52 PM
So....
300 pages later - has anyone actually ever bought one of these for this price (and had it delivered) - or is this just a Turnkey scam?

I rang them earlier and they said they had none in stock but said if I ordered one they would get one in within 7-10 days.
Likely?


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paulustlocust



Joined: 07/06/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: oggy1310]
      #570396 - 21/01/08 06:18 PM
Quote oggy1310:

So....
300 pages later - has anyone actually ever bought one of these for this price (and had it delivered) - or is this just a Turnkey scam?

I rang them earlier and they said they had none in stock but said if I ordered one they would get one in within 7-10 days.
Likely?




Hmmm... I've been waiting 9 weeks so far! Getting very close to cancelling

--------------------
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"


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grahawk



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #570406 - 21/01/08 06:36 PM
The rumour is that Alesis have discountinued the Fusion and no more are being made so getting new stocks might be tricky.


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: grahawk]
      #570415 - 21/01/08 07:01 PM
Quote grahawk:

The rumour is that Alesis have discountinued the Fusion and no more are being made so getting new stocks might be tricky.




I suspect that the rumour is true. Let's face it, the Fusion hasn't exactly been a runaway success, commercially speaking.

But that doesn't mean it's not worth buying one if you get the opportunity. Buying end-of-line products is often a good way to save money. I bought my Yamaha Motif just after they'd announced the release of the Motif ES.

Where did Alesis go wrong, though? The marketing really does seem to have been crap for starters. But then, for all its merits, the Fusion doesn't quite into any category very neatly. Alesis tried to make it a bit more than a synthesizer by adding workstation features, but they missed out some of the key ones that make a contemporary workstation worth having - particularly sample time-stretching and beat synchronisation.

I'm still waiting for mine. I ordered it from Turnkey back in December shortly after this thread started. They promised it for December 20. Then for January 16. Now for January 24. We shall see ...

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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hollowsun



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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #570564 - 22/01/08 04:02 AM
Quote comradec:

Quote grahawk:

Where did Alesis go wrong, though? The marketing really does seem to have been crap for starters. But then, for all its merits, the Fusion doesn't quite into any category very neatly. Alesis tried to make it a bit more than a synthesizer by adding workstation features, but they missed out some of the key ones that make a contemporary workstation worth having - particularly sample time-stretching and beat synchronisation.



All of the above is true. As I see it....

MARKETING:

They were a little over-enthusiastic in their claims at its launch (it happens and Alesis are not unique in that respect). This was compounded by the fact that the V1.00 release was pretty buggy, the sounds were 'challenged' and incomplete and it didn't live up to those claims (again, not something unique to Alesis). What followed, therefore, was not a development of new features but a damage repair operation. What also followed was an almost universal damning of the instrument across internet forums and in blogs, etc., that earned Fusion a reputation for being buggy and unreliable (which at the time, wasn't untrue). Alesis did sort out the major problems relatively quickly, even adding some new features along the way but unfortunately, the V1.00 reputation stuck.

By January 2006, however, things were looking different. The OS was in much better shape, the factory sounds had been tidied up and Fusion wasn't looking too shabby. Then I was asked to create some new library and Alesis released this free of charge to some acclaim. Further quality sound updates were released on a regular basis. Things were looking better (although there were still its detractors that weren't helping matters).

But then Alesis announced a price reduction and once again, the forums were full of aggrieved users ranting about this (not unsurprisingly perhaps) and legal action was threatened, etc., even though price reductions are common in all sorts of businesses when things aren't selling as expected (and I don't recall the same level of vitriol levelled at Korg when they dropped the price of their Radius). But whatever, more bad vibes about Fusion on the interweb!

Then, not long after, Fusions started shipping with 80GB drives instead of 40GB. This was simply because they couldn't get 40GB drives and 80GB drives were pretty much the same price as the 40GB they used to ship. More interweb rantings from aggrieved users who felt ripped off.

Most bugs seem to have been eradicated (even though some users were attributing operational quirks as bugs and many reported problems were often pilot error) but one outstanding one was where audio tracks could slip out of time with MIDI tracks. This (along with some others) was fixed in V1.24 and things did quieten down pretty much in the Fusion community. The problem, however, was that Fusion still had a bad reputation and people who were genuinely interested were still seeing the debris of the V1.00 and price reduction debacle when they Googled around for info. Some read between the lines or saw beyond what they read but many still had doubts (even to this day).

SYNTH vs WORKSTATION

Yes - in hindsight (and IMO) Alesis might have been better off marketing the thing as a synth/sampler first and foremost with a sequencer thrown in for good measure (not unlike, perhaps, EMu did with their E4K). As a synth/sampler combo, Fusion is hard to beat but it is not (arguably) a 'workstation' in the strict sense of the word. The sequencer is actually ok and quite serviceable once you get used to it but it is, admittedly, a bit fiddly (as are many on-board sequencers) and I prefer to use my MPC for sequencing duties; others use Mac/PC sequencers.

But therein lies another thorn in Fusion's side : the on-board sequencer is linear and not pattern-based and this pissed a LOT of users off for some reason and led to yet more forum ranting, some of which continues to this day with people (still) demanding a pattern-based sequencer in an update. All of which (combined with other ranting) puts potential customers off.

Also, many people bought Fusions thinking they were getting - I dunno - an 'arranger' keyboard or something. Fusion is a heavy duty synth/sampler that requires you to know what you're up to and frankly (and with respect), some people bought Fusion without knowing a filter from a poke in the eye (hence Alesis releasing their various tutorials including one on analogue synthesis and another on sampler basics). But some were reporting issues as 'bugs' when in fact, some were just down to them not understanding some basic principles and when asked if they'd read the tutorials, you'd often get the answer "Yes but I didn't understand it". I don't know what some were expecting when they slapped their money down.

CATEGORY

Yes - Fusion doesn't fit well into any particular category. Is it a synth or a sampler or a workstation or what? Then there's the somewhat unconventional styling. All a bit confusing as to what it is.

Then there's the dreaded disk drive and the lure of unlimited expandability - a stroke of genius and also a millstone. For reasons I will never understand, some people take delivery of their Fusion. Do they play with it and see what it can do? Do they try out the various sounds or play with the sequencer and get a feel for how it works? Do they get a feel for basics and take it from there? Like hell they do! Instead, the first thing they do is hook up their Fusion to their PC, go buggering about with the drive contents, move stuff around, deleting stuff, renaming stuff, adding their own soundfonts and converting library (whatever) and then wonder why they get error messages ... and broadcast their frustrations on internet forums thus exacerbating the reputation to potential takers that Fusion is a crock of unreliable shite to be avoided!

All of the above (and more) is why Fusion (IMO and as I have seen it) wasn't the success and the potential it had to be - a catalogue of various disasters .... but a godsend to those looking for a bargain now.

But I stand by my previous statements - Fusion isn't perfect but she's not as imperfect as some interweb agendists would have you believe. I have had my 8HD for almost two years now and have developed and released several hundred MB of sound library without any problems (and any that I have had were of my own making and stupidity). Since V1.22, she's never crashed or locked up or bombed out on me - in fact, she has been thoroughly reliable.

I don't know what else to say on the matter to be honest!

--------------------
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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #571044 - 23/01/08 02:55 AM
The thing that really surprised me about Alesis' marketing of, and support for, the Fusion was the sudden disappearance of the dedicated website they'd set up for it.

A couple of years ago when Alesis started showcasing the Fusion at industry shows and suchlike, they published a Fusion site containing information about their forthcoming synth. Lots of pics, Q&A-type sections, pages for downloading resources, etc. I registered with the site to receive updates when the Fusion finally shipped but none ever arrived, which seems a missed opportunity to draw it to potential customers' attention again.

Then when I went to revisit the site, which was saved in my bookmarks, earlier in 2007, I found that it had gone offline completely and the only product support information available was that on Alesis' main site. This was disappointing as the early indications were that the site could have been developed to become a user-supporting resource of the type that KeyFax were commissioned to design around Yamaha's Motif range. Yet suddenly Alesis appeared to have relegated the Fusion to the status of 'just another product' rather than the flagship model I expected it would be. I don't think that can have helped its profile at all. And it also left users with problems nowhere official to air their grievances and receive product support. People complain about the Motif all the time on Motifator.com but, critically, Yamaha has put its technical staff at the disposal of the user community and they answer queries, share tips, make suggestions, etc, right there on the site for all to see and benefit from.

Edited by comradec (23/01/08 02:55 AM)


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #572251 - 25/01/08 09:21 PM
My Fusion 6HD arrived today. At last.

It's early days - I'm still working through the presets - but initial impressions are favourable.

I was surprised at how much smaller it is than my Yamaha Motif 6. I guess that's mainly because the pitchbend and modulation are located above the keys rather than to the left of them.

Not sure how I transpose the octaves up and down yet. I suppose I'll figure that out eventually (but grateful for any quick tips in the meantime).

Anyway, I'll see how it goes and let you know how I get on. Probably in a new thread, though. This one's a little long in the tooth now.

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: comradec]
      #572786 - 27/01/08 11:14 PM
Quote comradec:

My Fusion 6HD arrived today. At last.





Quote comradec:

Not sure how I transpose the octaves up and down yet. I suppose I'll figure that out eventually (but grateful for any quick tips in the meantime).



Yes - bloody silly oversight on Alesis' part. Anyway....

Press and hold the LOCATE key and press the key you want to transpose to. So for example, to transpose up an an octave, LOCATE+C4.

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #584264 - 24/02/08 01:05 PM
First off I'm sorry if bringing this post back from the dead upsets anyone or is against some (unknown to me) rules - I just figured it made sense as my question is related to some of the replies posted here.

Basically, at the moment I'm very much "in the box" when it comes to my music making and am looking for a sound source that is different from all the VSTs I have (mainly Ivory, BFD, Komplete 5, Lounge Lizard and Reason) and I can play without having to wait for the PC and Cubase to load up.

I'm very confused still about what the Fusion is but am very attracted by the price (assuming they're still about). I think from what everyone here has said, it is mainly something to load your samples on to play them - in which case I'm not sure it's what I'm looking for - rather than a sounds source that is different from what I already have - but I'd be grateful if someone could spell it out for me in complete novice/dumbass/layman's terms.

I've been wanting to go and play with one in the local Sound Control but just haven't been able to find time lately and I guess my confusion/uncertainty isn't helping my motivation to make time - might as well admit that upfront(!)

If I am right that it's not really for me I'd appreciate advice on what would be a good starting point in the synth world - but I realise that may require another thread.

--------------------
Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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MarkOne



Joined: 15/02/07
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584303 - 24/02/08 04:05 PM
Quote can7ona:

First off I'm sorry if bringing this post back from the dead upsets anyone or is against some (unknown to me) rules - I just figured it made sense as my question is related to some of the replies posted here.

Basically, at the moment I'm very much "in the box" when it comes to my music making and am looking for a sound source that is different from all the VSTs I have (mainly Ivory, BFD, Komplete 5, Lounge Lizard and Reason) and I can play without having to wait for the PC and Cubase to load up.

I'm very confused still about what the Fusion is but am very attracted by the price (assuming they're still about). I think from what everyone here has said, it is mainly something to load your samples on to play them - in which case I'm not sure it's what I'm looking for - rather than a sounds source that is different from what I already have - but I'd be grateful if someone could spell it out for me in complete novice/dumbass/layman's terms.

I've been wanting to go and play with one in the local Sound Control but just haven't been able to find time lately and I guess my confusion/uncertainty isn't helping my motivation to make time - might as well admit that upfront(!)

If I am right that it's not really for me I'd appreciate advice on what would be a good starting point in the synth world - but I realise that may require another thread.




First and foremost, in my opinion, it's a synth.

There are in fact 4 synths.

A Sample playback synth (more about which later)
A virtual analogue synth with 3 oscillators multiple filter types and a really advanced routing matrix
An FM synth (somewhat like the DX7, but not quite)
and finally the weakest synth a physical modelling synth (limited number of reed and pipe models)

The sample playback section is in fact a full blown sampler, you can sample your own sounds, or using the conversion utility use Akai samples or soundfonts (or using the ChickenSys converter, pretty much any format you want)

The hard drive means that you are never likely to run out of space for samples. Hollow Sun who posts here has produced loads of free banks for the fusion, plus one commercial one. All his stuff is brilliant (some of it transcends brilliance!) There is also Back In Time records (google 'em) creating commercial banks for it. there is pretty good user community creating sounds too. Some of which are very good!

For me where it gets interesting is you can use mix mode to layer samples, VA, FM and PM sounds into fabulous textures. You can split them over the keyboard, you can layer them (up to 8 at a time) to create very complex mixes.

Then there is the sequencer, which is OK, but not something I've really delved into , because I do all my sequencing in Cubase, there is an 8 track audio recorder, which you can combine with the sequencer to create songs. Again it's OK but not something I've explored hugely.

Feel free to PM me if you have any specific questions (or take them to The Fusion Club Forum where you will find lots of helpful people.

Hope this helps.

--------------------
New album 'Fantasy Bridge' available now!
Making of Fantasy Bridge Diary


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584405 - 24/02/08 09:01 PM
Quote can7ona:

I've been wanting to go and play with one in the local Sound Control but just haven't been able to find time lately and I guess my confusion/uncertainty isn't helping my motivation to make time - might as well admit that upfront(!)




It's extremely unlikely that you'll find one in stock at your local Sound Control anyway. Since SC and Turnkey (which is owned by SC) did the £399 offer on the Fusion 6HD, they've had all their allocation accounted for in pre-orders. So as soon as they come in they're already on the way out.

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #584449 - 25/02/08 12:23 AM
Thanks for the great replies...

I guess maybe I'm concentrating too much on the sampler side of the instrument then. I just figured that I could use my samples in the PC rather than converting and transferring them onto the Fusion (perhaps I'm too new to proper hardware anything to understand this concept! lol!)

Am I right in thinking that I could layer included samples with my own samples? That would definitely make it more appealing then. Also, that basically it is more "powerful" than anything else out there like a Fantom or Motif etc?

I guess at the current price point you can't really go wrong at all when compared to the price of the competition - but I just don't like making mistakes in that sense.

I say local SC but it isn't really convenient for me to go there so I'm glad I didn't waste a trip there. After a bad experience with the SC under the Virgin shop on Charing X Rd or Tottenham Court Road (can't remember exact location) I don't really like the company! While I'm on that particular topic I would like to say that people give Turnkey more of a hard time than its workers truly deserve - but that's for another topic on another day! :-)

Thanks again - will look at the Fusion Forum in the morning .

--------------------
Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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comradec
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584463 - 25/02/08 02:12 AM
Quote can7ona:

Am I right in thinking that I could layer included samples with my own samples? That would definitely make it more appealing then. Also, that basically it is more "powerful" than anything else out there like a Fantom or Motif etc?




That would be too general a statement. It really depends what you're trying to do.

When it comes to looping sampled drum beats and riffs, the Fusion is way, way *behind* workstations like the Fantom, Motif, Triton and M3. For one, very important, thing there's no time-stretching facility on the Fusion, which means you can't increase or decrease the tempo of a sampled loop. But that's basic stuff on its Roland, Yamaha and Korg rivals.

If that sort of sampling is important to your music, then the Fusion is a no-no unless you plan to use it with an external sampler (hardware or software). Pair it up with a Roland SP-606, SP-555 or similar, though, and you'll have a very good combination for a lot less money than you'd pay out for the other synth workstations on the market.

--------------------
Steve Cooke
http://soundcloud.com/stevecooke


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paulustlocust



Joined: 07/06/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584498 - 25/02/08 10:06 AM
I thnk I saw an advert in Andertons for the 6HD at £399 in this months SOS...

I think it's well worth it, I waited ages for mine to turn up but it's great. Especially at that price!

--------------------
"History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it"


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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #584525 - 25/02/08 11:27 AM
Sorry for being vague - it was late at night!

Mainly I want something that will have sounds, or the potential to create sounds, that I don't already have. If there are some overlaps I'm ok with that as my other requirement is to have something that I can just play sounds on without having to wait for the PC and Cubase to load up.

In terms of drum loops I doubt I'd use the Fusion or anything else for that as I'm happy with BFD and my samples I use in Battery. I'm not sure how the lack of time-stretching would affect me - sorry for being dumb - could you explain how that's something that would be a negative for me given that I'd record everything into Cubase and use that as my sequencer.

I already have a 61 key MIDI keyboard that I'm quite happy with so I think I'd go for the 88 key Fusion so that I have something different and maybe that will help improve my (limited) playing ability.

I guess the problem I have is that I think I want it, but I'm not sure if it's what I need - I had the same problem with the Open Labs NeKo in that I really loved the idea of it but it just wasn't what I needed.

Thanks for all the advice.

--------------------
Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584558 - 25/02/08 12:49 PM
Quote can7ona:

Mainly I want something that will have sounds, or the potential to create sounds, that I don't already have. If there are some overlaps I'm ok with that...



Fusion is a pretty respectable analogue synth, an FM synth, a good 'old-skool' sampler and a 'ROMpler' (for playing back preset factory samples) and a all in one box. Individually, these 'engines, are none too shabby but collectively, it can be a potent combination and separates Fusion apart from most other synth/workstations out there which, unless they have some optional board installed, are strictly sample-based only (Korg Oasys being the only exception).

So to do 'analogue' synthesis on Fusion, you're dealing with samples of raw analogue waveforms rather than samples of them as on yer typical 'workstation. This has distinct advantages in that Fusion can do real-time pulse width modulation, oscillator sync, ring modulation, cross modulation, etc., that are not possible on a sample-based products where all you have are static samples of these.

Similarly, on a sample-based synth, to do FM, all you have to play with are static samples of FM sounds whereas on Fusion you can sculpt your own FM AND control them in real-time.

The sampler is a pretty standard 'old skool' thing not a million miles away from, say, an Akai S3000XL. This can playback factory samples held in ROM or your own samples.

Each 'engine' has a multi-mode resonant filter offering low, band, high pass (with variable roll-off slopes), a 'modelled' filter (based on ARP2600) and various notch and formant filters plus oodles of LFOs and envelopes, 32 true sample+hold processors, slew limiters and more all patched together in a very comprehensive mod matrix.

And all that doesn't include the Physical Modelling synth which can make some pretty whacked out sounds (even if the perfect modelled flute is elusive on it!), a drum sampler (uses the sampling engine but more suited to drums), arpeggiators, a (scratchpad) sequencer, effects, insert effects and, rather significantly, an 80GB internal hard drive to store everything (including hundreds of MB of free sound library that's available for free download!).

I don't know if she could make any sounds you don't already have but she can make some pretty unique sounds, even more so when you come to layering these in Fusion's MIX mode.

Quote can7ona:

my other requirement is to have something that I can just play sounds on without having to wait for the PC and Cubase to load up.



Fusion certainly fits the bill with regard to switching on and getting jiggy

Quote can7ona:

In terms of drum loops I doubt I'd use the Fusion or anything else for that as I'm happy with BFD and my samples I use in Battery. I'm not sure how the lack of time-stretching would affect me - sorry for being dumb - could you explain how that's something that would be a negative for me given that I'd record everything into Cubase and use that as my sequencer.



Well... quite. If you want to chop up beats and stuff, you can use ReCycle, export in Akai S5000 format and port that to Fusion via Alesis' own convertor software.

Quote can7ona:

I already have a 61 key MIDI keyboard that I'm quite happy with so I think I'd go for the 88 key Fusion so that I have something different and maybe that will help improve my (limited) playing ability.



That sounds like a very sensible idea ... and the 8HD's keyboard is particularly nice I have to say.

The thing is, if you are going to decide on Fusion, you're going to have to move quickly! Since prices fell to the absurd point they're at now, she's hot property and a lot of people are snapping up a real bargain!

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #584574 - 25/02/08 01:25 PM
WOW! Thanks for that reply - I think I'm definitely sold on it - all I need is to find the cheapest price (I think Turnkey have the 88 at £549 now) and time my credit card payment date!

Before reading your post I was very tempted by the Nord Lead 2X which is now £469.99 at Andertons but I guess the Fusion would allow me to do so much more with the sounds than the Nord would.

Thanks to everyone for the replies - much appreciated!

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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
Posts: 5479
Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #584598 - 25/02/08 02:24 PM
Quote hollowsun:

So to do 'analogue' synthesis on Fusion, you're dealing with samples of raw analogue waveforms rather than samples of them as on yer typical 'workstation. This has distinct advantages in that Fusion can do real-time pulse width modulation, oscillator sync, ring modulation, cross modulation, etc., that are not possible on a sample-based products where all you have are static samples of these.



Ooooops ..... and I am beyond my 'edit time'.... so .... correction:

So to do 'analogue' synthesis on Fusion, you're dealing with RAW, ELECTRONICALLY GENERATED ANALOGUE WAVEFORMS rather than samples of them as on yer typical 'workstation'. This has distinct advantages in that Fusion can do real-time pulse width modulation, oscillator sync, ring modulation, cross modulation, etc., that are not possible on a sample-based products where all you have are static samples of these.

Sorry about that slip

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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
Posts: 5479
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Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584605 - 25/02/08 02:44 PM
Quote can7ona:

WOW! Thanks for that reply - I think I'm definitely sold on it - all I need is to find the cheapest price (I think Turnkey have the 88 at £549 now) and time my credit card payment date!



CHECK THAT THEY HAVE STOCK!!!!!!

Sorry to shout but I gather some have been caught out on this.

I have just spoken to Andertons (with whom I have absolutely no affiliation BTW) and they have several 8HDs in stock at £599. The extra £50 is worth it IMO as they appear to offer good service (from what I have heard from other new Fusion users who have recently bought from them).

Quote can7ona:

Before reading your post I was very tempted by the Nord Lead 2X which is now £469.99 at Andertons but I guess the Fusion would allow me to do so much more with the sounds than the Nord would.



Definitely but with the caveat that with that extra power and programming depth comes added levels of operational complexity ... naturally! Not that Fusion's hard to use (far from it IMO) but there is a UI to navigate which can be a little, shall we say, 'quirky' in places but you certainly get a very big bang for your buck with Fusion.

I mention this just in case the knobby immediacy of the Nord appeals to you.

That said, the Nord (whilst excellent) is a one-trick pony compared with Fusion in the long term - in two or three years time, you can (and will) still be adding more and more varied sounds (analogue, FM, samples) and mangling them in Fusion whereas with the Nord, you'll still be making the same analogue sounds you did when you bought it.

Your call though!

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
Posts: 43
Loc: UK
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #584611 - 25/02/08 03:01 PM
Quote hollowsun:



I have just spoken to Andertons (with whom I have absolutely no affiliation BTW) and they have several 8HDs in stock at £599. The extra £50 is worth it IMO as they appear to offer good service (from what I have heard from other new Fusion users who have recently bought from them).




Wow thanks for checking that! They offer a price match as well I believe so might just go with them. Being an ex-employee of Turnkey I thought I'd give the sale to an old friend of mine but if he's not there now I'll go through Andertons tomorrow morning!

Quote hollowsun:


I mention this just in case the knobby immediacy of the Nord appeals to you.




No the knobby immediacy over the Fusion wouldn't have made the difference - I'm coming fresh from the box and plugins so I think the Fusion will be plenty immediate for me (if that makes sense! lol!)

Quote hollowsun:


That said, the Nord (whilst excellent) is a one-trick pony compared with Fusion in the long term - in two or three years time, you can (and will) still be adding more and more varied sounds (analogue, FM, samples) and mangling them in Fusion whereas with the Nord, you'll still be making the same analogue sounds you did when you bought it.

Your call though!




That and the fact that the Nord has been around, and used, for a long time now so worries about a replacement coming out soon and the fact that most of the sounds will already have been used over and over made me think that the Fusion will be relatively fresher and more flexible.

I'm getting a bit excited now - my first proper synth! All I need now are some piano/keyboard lessons! lol!

Thanks again

PS - I really look forward to trying out the Speak-and-Spell additions you've made having never heard them before so thanks for that as well!

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Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
Posts: 5479
Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584617 - 25/02/08 03:21 PM
Quote can7ona:

Wow thanks for checking that!



No problem. I did so because this thread has had others contacting me about availability so I thought I'd check.

Speak to Giles there

Quote can7ona:

They offer a price match as well I believe



They do but bear in mind that you'll be negotiating with a weak hand - price matching only works when the dealer's competition has stock. If they don't, the dealer has the upper hand! But try 'em - they might be flexible. Even if they don't, £599 is still a steal for the 8HD.

Quote can7ona:

I'm getting a bit excited now - my first proper synth! All I need now are some piano/keyboard lessons! lol!





Quote can7ona:

PS - I really look forward to trying out the Speak-and-Spell additions you've made having never heard them before so thanks for that as well!





I don't think you'll find another workstation offering those particular samples!!!

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
Posts: 43
Loc: UK
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: table for two]
      #584658 - 25/02/08 04:27 PM
Well DV had one left and did it for £530 for me so went with them!

Should arrive Thursday now (fingers crossed!)


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
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Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584723 - 25/02/08 06:22 PM
Quote can7ona:

Well DV had one left and did it for £530 for me so went with them!

Should arrive Thursday now (fingers crossed!)




Cool!

You might find it arrives earlier - others have.

Have fun when it arrives and heed the following advice.....

Take it out of the box(es) and hook it up and play with it for a while to make sure it's all working ok (not that Fusion is statistically any worse than other gear). Spend a day or two getting a feel for her

I suggest this because there is a curious phenomenon whereby new Fusion users take it out of the carton(s), hook it up to their PC/Mac and instantly go buggering about with the contents of the drive, moving stuff around, deleting stuff they don't think they want and stuffing it full of dodgy soundfonts downloaded from equally dodgy sites.....

And then get onto their dealer (or internet forums!) to complain that the thing is broken and has error messages when trying to load sounds! I kid you not.

In other words, get to know her first and establish all's well before embarking on hard disk buggery. And before you do embark, back-up the contents of the drive in case anything goes wrong.

Not that you have anything to worry about (and not that you'd be so foolhardy!!) but I have had over two years watching people screwing their Fusions this way!

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
Posts: 43
Loc: UK
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #584763 - 25/02/08 08:36 PM
I asked for it to come on Thurs so I can take a day off work to play with it! lol!

Yeah I've read a lot of posts in this thread and others where people have tried a little too much too soon. Also, as it is my first hardware synth I think I just want to spend some time with it as it is and enjoy it for a while... though I'm so tempted by that speak-and-spell! (I'm far too curious for my own good sometimes!)

One thing I did want to ask though, if the unit comes with an older o/s should I update that first or play with it as it is and then upgrade the o/s?

Also, something that has just come to me, given that Alesis have given up on this unit, would it not be possible for them to open up the o/s or platform (can't remember the right term) to users so that those who feel inclined to can take it further and implement the things that were promised but, as far as I know, didn't arrive? (like the SATA port for example). It would be a bold move and one that I don't think has been done before, it's just that this unit seems to have so much unrealised potential (from what I've been reading on it) that it would be a shame to let it "rot" if you know what I mean.

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Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
Posts: 5479
Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: can7ona]
      #584785 - 25/02/08 09:32 PM
Quote can7ona:

I asked for it to come on Thurs so I can take a day off work to play with it! lol!



Ah! Right. Fair enough.

Quote can7ona:

Yeah I've read a lot of posts in this thread and others where people have tried a little too much too soon. Also, as it is my first hardware synth I think I just want to spend some time with it as it is and enjoy it for a while... though I'm so tempted by that speak-and-spell! (I'm far too curious for my own good sometimes!)





They can wait.

Good move to just 'enjoy' her first!

Quote can7ona:

One thing I did want to ask though, if the unit comes with an older o/s should I update that first or play with it as it is and then upgrade the o/s?



I'd like to think it comes with the latest OS (1.24 .... but 1.23 would be ok too).

But OS updating is easy and pretty bombproof. Instructions are available (can't quite remember the process and it's been ages since I updated).

Quote can7ona:

Also, something that has just come to me, given that Alesis have given up on this unit, would it not be possible for them to open up the o/s or platform (can't remember the right term) to users so that those who feel inclined to can take it further and implement the things that were promised



Little or no likelihood of that for any number of reasons....

IP (would you publish your trade secrets for your competitors to get hold of? ), customer support issues, documentation, developer support, etc..

Quote can7ona:

It would be a bold move and one that I don't think has been done before



Probably for the reasons stated above

Quote can7ona:

it's just that this unit seems to have so much unrealised potential (from what I've been reading on it) that it would be a shame to let it "rot" if you know what I mean.



I know exactly what you mean but whilst it's not for me to say, it ain't ever gonna happen!!!

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can7ona



Joined: 20/05/05
Posts: 43
Loc: UK
Re: Alesis Fusion 6HD £399 new [Re: hollowsun]
      #584811 - 25/02/08 10:31 PM
Quote hollowsun:



IP (would you publish your trade secrets for your competitors to get hold of? ), customer support issues, documentation, developer support, etc...




I'm a bit of a strange one, probably why I've been thinking about this.

Under normal circumstances I don't think any company would reveal their secrets but the only reason I asked is that it seems like they've just plain given up. If they were planning on replacing it then fair enough - but that's not the impression I'm getting (but then what do I know!). Besides I'm sure there's a lot of reverse engineering going on between all the major companies - happens in pretty much all the industries.

I just thought it might help improve the reputation and cement it as a classic if the o/s itself were made open to a community in the way Linux is, so that at the very least those promised features could be added.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not starting to complain about it as I've not even got it yet, just putting out an idea/asking a question - definitely not trying to start a big debate here either as I completely understand the reasons against my idea.

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Sham
www.soulchefs.co.uk


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