dave_f
Joined: 12/09/04
Posts: 55
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Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
#1028817 - 15/01/13 10:50 PM
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I need to record some simple percussion instruments - some bongos, a couple of shakers,
nothing too fancy - in a home environment. The rooms in the apartment have dreadful
acoustics, everything is boomy and there's echoes and reverberations bouncing around all
over the place. In addition to this, there is occasional street and traffic noise which
bleeds in through the windows.
My task is to get as clear a recording as
possible. I am not allowed to mess up the apartment in any way - no duvets on walls etc. I
need to find a mic which captures as much of the instruments, and as little of everything
else as humanly possible. Please suggests some microphones (and techniques, if you can
think of any) which you think would be suitable for this task. (Budget is not a huge
concern, but given the circumstances I'm fairly sure I will not need a hugely expensive
mic).
thanks!
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Mike Stranks
active member
Joined: 03/01/03
Posts: 3058
Loc: Oxford, UK
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028819 - 15/01/13 11:03 PM
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Your phraseology suggests that this is an assignment/homework question. If it
is - and my apologies if it isn't - then a read of THIS may be beneficial. What do
you think? What has your own research shown? We're happy to work with you,
but not do it for you!  If it isn't homework it's simple: find somewhere else to do the recording.
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dave_f
Joined: 12/09/04
Posts: 55
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: Mike Stranks]
#1028825 - 15/01/13 11:33 PM
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thanks for the reply not
homework, i'm afraid.. i'm primarily a graphic designer and bass player, not a recording
engineer, which is why i'm asking for advice here. the bass is going in to Logic direct,
so it's not a problem - but capturing the percussion is. there is unfortunately nowhere
else i can record, so that is not an option.
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zenguitar
active member
Joined: 05/12/02
Posts: 7605
Loc: Devon
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028832 - 16/01/13 12:22 AM
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In all honesty is there no way you can rig up a temporary duvet or 3? And if you really
can't (which I doubt because you can drape or zip tie them to a mic boom stand) is there
absolutely no way you can find somewhere more suitable to record, especially as budget
isn't a huge concern so even a donation for renting a suitable space for a few hours isn't
out of the question? I'm sorry Dave, but it looks like you are eliminating all
the sensible, practical, and affordable options before you even start and then looking for
a technical solution to a non-problem. Andy 
-------------------- When the going gets weird, the Weird turn Pro.
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dave_f
Joined: 12/09/04
Posts: 55
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028836 - 16/01/13 12:51 AM
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Thanks for your reply. Well, the initial idea was that i record a live bass and percussion
jam and film it at the same time - hence the 'no alterations to the room' rule.. but it's
sounding like it's not going to be possible to capture any kind of useable sound this way
without a bit of compromise.
So what's the absolute minimum duvet drapeage I can get
away with? Let's say I can get a boom stand up in front of the bongos with a duvet draped
on it, do you think I can get away with just one duvet and not much else? The bongos will
most likely be played on a big sofa or on big cushions, so the back will not be so much of
an issue. This way I may still be able to shoot video footage from a different angle at
the same time without the duvet getting in the way of the shot.
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Dave B
Joined: 03/04/03
Posts: 5367
Loc: Maidenhead
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028845 - 16/01/13 07:40 AM
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Would it not be easier to hire a rehearsal room to do it in? You'll get a better sound and
quite a few places have 'show room' type places which are posher than a typical room.
--------------------
Veni, Vidi, Aesculi
(I came, I saw, I conkered)
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Skerrick
Joined: 10/01/13
Posts: 192
Loc: Sydney NSW
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028852 - 16/01/13 08:42 AM
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man - who is implying these apartment related restrictions on you if you dont mind me
asking? your missus or your mum? it sounds like you wouldnt have the problem if you were
allowed to hang doonas up in your apartment.. honestly man if it was MY apartment, id
tell my spouse/parent that their hindrance of my desire to make music was unbecoming and
uncouth and just do it anyway. in fact, ive done that many times before hahah and
yeah the way you phrased it sounds like you wrote out a homework task and wanted help haha
(im not saying thats whats happened, its just funny, when i was reading it i thought the
exact same thing as old mate!) eff the haters man, just make the music 
-------------------- www.soundcloud.com/skerrick
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Richard Graham
Joined: 10/04/06
Posts: 2250
Loc: Gateshead, UK
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028858 - 16/01/13 10:15 AM
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Try recording them in the bog... if you haven't already.
--------------------
Battle flags are flown at the feet of a garden gnome.
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BJG145
Joined: 06/08/05
Posts: 2156
Loc: Norwich UK
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028860 - 16/01/13 10:42 AM
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Quote dave_f:
The rooms in the
apartment have dreadful acoustics, everything is boomy and there's echoes and
reverberations bouncing around all over the place...the initial idea was that I record a
live bass and percussion jam and film it.
Are you going to be filming all round the apartment, or just a fixed
angle...? In which case you could still treat the rest of the room. If you need to treat a
wall that's in the line of sight, maybe you could just hang a drape over it or
something...?
If you DI the bass, can they use headphones or in-ear
monitors...?
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Hugh Robjohns
SOS Technical Editor
Joined: 25/07/03
Posts: 18368
Loc: Worcestershire
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028872 - 16/01/13 11:41 AM
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Quote dave_f:
I am not allowed to
mess up the apartment in any way - no duvets on walls etc. I need to find a mic which
captures as much of the instruments, and as little of everything else as humanly
possible.
The only way to
deal with bad acoustics is to sort out the bad acoustics! That's it. Full stop.
You can minimise how much of the bad acoustic you capture by placing the microphone as
close as possible to the source, so that the direct sound is significantly louder than the
room sound... but some room sound will always remain. You will also have the potential
problem that close miking impacts on the captured sonic character of the source.
In otherwords, the result will always be a compromise. Whether or not the compromise is
acceptable is something only you can decide.
However, if the room acoustics are
poor, it's not that difficult to make significant improvemetns by the TEMPORARY
installation of acoustic absorbers. Duvets are a very cheap, convenient and simple
resource, and it's very easy to hand them TEMPORARILY from large mic stands, close-drying
frames, or even a few bits of timber nailed together and propped against a wall.
Hugh
--------------------
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound
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Exalted Wombat
Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 4202
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028877 - 16/01/13 12:15 PM
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Quote dave_f:
Well, the initial
idea was that i record a live bass and percussion jam and film it at the same time - hence
the 'no alterations to the room' rule.. but it's sounding like it's not going to be
possible to capture any kind of useable sound this way without a bit of compromise.
Why won't people ask the WHOLE
question at the outset? :-)
It sounds like, if you use this room, you're going
to be turd-polishing. Is this what anyone really wants? Don't try to rescue a bad
recording - go somewhere where you can make a good one. Or track it first, film them
miming to playback. This is how every other pop video is made.
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JPHogg
Joined: 05/07/11
Posts: 25
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028945 - 16/01/13 04:40 PM
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Why not video a take with the room as is and then put up your duvets etc and overdub.
Thast way yhou can have the best of both worlds. OIr even better just overdub somewhere
else more suitable.
Another option would be to disguise the acoustic
treatment. Make up panels and then cover with material in keeping with the decor of the
room.
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Skerrick
Joined: 10/01/13
Posts: 192
Loc: Sydney NSW
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1028990 - 16/01/13 11:30 PM
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if the room is really that bad, and you end up going ahead with the recording, youre gonna
end up regretting it and having to do another take elsewhere anyway. you should just find
a suitable environment, especially if theres no deadline involved, why rush it?
-------------------- www.soundcloud.com/skerrick
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Stuarto
Joined: 21/05/07
Posts: 37
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1029035 - 17/01/13 10:28 AM
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To answer your original question, I use a Neumann KMS 105 vocal mic (cost about 400
pounds) to record percussion in a less than perfect room, as it has extremely good
off-angle rejection characteristics and therefore removes as much of the room sound as
possible. I get a very dry, clean, detailed, albeit lifeless recording, which I can then
liven up a bit with reverb etc. Obviously the mic has to be pointing right at the
instrument for this to work properly.
If you don't want to spend that much
money, Rode do some similar condenser/capacitor mics designed for live vocal use that you
may want to check out.
--------------------
When I have nothing to say my lips are sealed.
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KuRu
Joined: 21/11/12
Posts: 41
Loc: uk liverpool
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Re: Recording in untreated boomy nasty room
[Re: dave_f]
#1029146 - 17/01/13 11:08 PM
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isnt there a VST for bad acoustics? yeh i think theres one called fix le mix vst  only
joking, yeh rent a ghood quality rehearsal space and save yourself heaps of messing about
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