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Keef



Joined: 04/10/04
Posts: 203
Loc: Montreal, Canada
Steinberg getting Cubase users angry
      #410446 - 23/01/07 02:04 PM
Many on the Cubase forms are complaining about the lack of support for Cubase 3, and there does not appear to be any more updates or fixes.
Many have also complained about the multiple issues with version 4 as well. At this point many state that they are jumping ship to Samplitude who has given them great customer service already. Samplitude has always impressed me as I tried out the demo version. It’s work flow can be similar to Cubase which makes switching over easier than going to Logic…that is if you work on a Mac.
Usually when people start with a DAW program, they like to stick with it because it’s what your used to. However I am thinking about going to Samplitude myself. The latest version and review here at SOS looks very promising. As a PC user, it seems to be one of the best options. One thing that is really nice is the ablility to master music with Samplitude as you can burn CD’s within the program, and it’s POW-R plug in.
I did a SOS search on the topic and found a great response regarding the differences between the two.

Quote:

the most important difference between the two is that Cubase SX works on a traditional 'virtual studio' model, whereby audio lives on tracks, and effects are applied on mixer channels. Samplitude can work this way too, but its Arrange page is designed so that each chunk of recorded audio is treated as an independent Object, with automation and effects settings applicable to individual Objects rather than mixer channels or tracks. Some people find this way of working more to their taste, especially for mastering applications.




What are your thoughts on Steinberg support and Samplitude?


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410462 - 23/01/07 02:35 PM
Quote Keef:

Many on the Cubase forms are complaining about the lack of support for Cubase 3, and there does not appear to be any more updates or fixes.
Many have also complained about the multiple issues with version 4 as well. At this point many state that they are jumping ship to Samplitude who has given them great customer service already. Samplitude has always impressed me as I tried out the demo version. It’s work flow can be similar to Cubase which makes switching over easier than going to Logic…that is if you work on a Mac.
Usually when people start with a DAW program, they like to stick with it because it’s what your used to. However I am thinking about going to Samplitude myself. The latest version and review here at SOS looks very promising. As a PC user, it seems to be one of the best options. One thing that is really nice is the ablility to master music with Samplitude as you can burn CD’s within the program, and it’s POW-R plug in.
I did a SOS search on the topic and found a great response regarding the differences between the two.

Quote:

the most important difference between the two is that Cubase SX works on a traditional 'virtual studio' model, whereby audio lives on tracks, and effects are applied on mixer channels. Samplitude can work this way too, but its Arrange page is designed so that each chunk of recorded audio is treated as an independent Object, with automation and effects settings applicable to individual Objects rather than mixer channels or tracks. Some people find this way of working more to their taste, especially for mastering applications.




What are your thoughts on Steinberg support and Samplitude?




I think Steinberg's customer relations were bad (going back years) and are getting worse.

Most recent:

1) They don't disclose that they will no longer support DX from C4 onwards. The main probelem here is, a lot of users dind't know about this until the bought it and tried to load their plugins. It was one of the Cubase.net forum members that brought this to light.
2) Not fulfilling their promises to fix bugs and more importantly, mend BROKEN features in SX3. Features that SX claimed to do on the box.
3) They stopped support of their Midex 8 MIDI hardware, so no 64 bit drivers, leaving a perfectly decent device redundant.

I think it's shocking behaviour, especially when they have the financial and business backing of giants such as Yamaha. I'd love to hear Yamaha's side of the story! They've not said a word... Unless this all comes from Yamaha via Steinberg.

P


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John Willett
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410467 - 23/01/07 02:44 PM
Samplitude9 is great (upgrade to v9.02 came out yesterday).

I got my copy a couple of weeks ago.

Bonus Until the end of Feb. you can crossgrade to Samplitude9 Pro for only £300

--------------------
John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: John Willett]
      #410472 - 23/01/07 02:53 PM
Quote John Willett:

Samplitude9 is great (upgrade to v9.02 came out yesterday).

I got my copy a couple of weeks ago.

Bonus Until the end of Feb. you can crossgrade to Samplitude9 Pro for only £300




It's a possibility, but I aint got £300 to spend just yet

I'm considering getting a new soundcard in the near future and might go for the Digi 002 as this has PT LE included. Might not be as feature intensive, but the rest of the world seems to get good results with PT.

Cheers,
Peter


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Matt P
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: John Willett]
      #410489 - 23/01/07 03:25 PM
Quote John Willett:

Samplitude9 is great (upgrade to v9.02 came out yesterday).

I got my copy a couple of weeks ago.

Bonus Until the end of Feb. you can crossgrade to Samplitude9 Pro for only £300




John, how do you go about registering for this crossgrade. The likelihood is that I'm just being thick, but I can't find any mention of it on the main Magix site.

Also, I understand from some of your recent posts that you've joined the RME SmugFace brigade - I run one of the 800 cards and was wondering how you'd found the software/hardware combination.

Here's to voting with one's feet


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John Willett
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Matt P]
      #410492 - 23/01/07 03:37 PM
Quote Matt P:

Quote John Willett:

Samplitude9 is great (upgrade to v9.02 came out yesterday).

I got my copy a couple of weeks ago.

Bonus Until the end of Feb. you can crossgrade to Samplitude9 Pro for only £300




John, how do you go about registering for this crossgrade. The likelihood is that I'm just being thick, but I can't find any mention of it on the main Magix site.



Give DACS a ring - 0191-438-2500 - and they will tell you how to do it.

I think you have to send in the front page of your Owners Manual (or something like that).



Quote Matt P:

Also, I understand from some of your recent posts that you've joined the RME SmugFace brigade - I run one of the 800 cards and was wondering how you'd found the software/hardware combination.




My Fireface 400 has not arrived yet - due this week. But Synthax (excellent company that they are) loaned me one for the weekend as I had loads of editing to do (25-hours over two days).

The 400 worked very well and did what I needed to. But I could not get any digits out of it properly.

Probably settings, but I did not have the time to check and only used the analogue outs.

I had wanted to use the digits into my Grace m902 - it appeared to sync, but I could get no sound. I'll check it through properly when my own one arrives.

--------------------
John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons


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Keef



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: John Willett]
      #410494 - 23/01/07 03:40 PM
Some advantages of Samplitude 9 over Cubase

1. More analog sounding compressors and Eq compared to SX 3.
2. Supports 64 bit as SX 3 does not
3. Has a convolution reverb
4. Controlling wave forms appears to be easier and more flexible
5. Can burn CD’s
6. POW-R dithering
7. Supports direct x
8. Appears to be more stable and has less issues than SX 3 and especially Cubase 4.
9. You can see inserts and effects at the same time in mixer screen.
10. Lay out on mixer screen shows more info.
11. Can swap effect order with mouse.
12. Better support
13. They appear not to release updates with as many bugs and issues

Anything I am missing.

Edited by Keef (23/01/07 03:41 PM)


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John Willett
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410500 - 23/01/07 03:47 PM
Quote Keef:

Anything I am missing.




  • Can burn DVDs
  • rock solid and very stable
  • can write CD text, including ISRC codes
  • Can check CD/DVD against the original for burning errors and reports the results




--------------------
John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons


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SecretSam
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410506 - 23/01/07 03:58 PM
'Rock solid and very stable' sounds good to me. Cubase isn't as bad as it was in this respect, but it isn't fantastic either.

--------------------
Instant gratification is actually pretty good. It's fast as well.


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Pink Fluid
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410560 - 23/01/07 05:24 PM
I've been looking at Samplitude off and on for the last couple of years and decided to shell out £30 for the Sam V8 SE product. It's great for audio, less so for VSTis mainly as you can't monitor aux send fx whilst playing (inserts ar OK). I also found zipper noise when using my Mackie Control. V9 (as in demo version) is a big step forward if you use soft synths and there are promises of future improvements in VSTi handling in an imminent update. I still do not think it's as good at handling loops though and the object editing can take some getting used to. Also, it doesn't import REX files in case that's your thing. I also wish you could just record the output of VSTis as audio in real time without having to go to internal mix down. Interestingly, the SOS review concentrated on its audio capabilities which is fine but high-end programs need to do a bit more more these days. Having said that, the DACS offer for Cubase users is pretty good and the Classic version (one down from 'Pro') is a steal in terms of what it offers. BTW I run my progs on an Intel Mac Mini (Windows bootcamp) without any problems.


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Michael B
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410564 - 23/01/07 05:34 PM
I decided to stop using crackd software years ago, and bought VST full version and have upgraded as far as SX3. Now I'm fed up, would like to go to SX4 but now the upgrades have jumped in price as well, and I just missed the cutoff for the 50.00 upgrade, but there's no way I'm paying 150.00 after the experience of going to SX3 and shortly after hearing that has become defunct.

I would like to go to Samplitude but £300? cross grade, I could buy half a second hand V-Synth for that almost


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Dave B



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410572 - 23/01/07 05:43 PM
I had a look at Samplitude last week (for obvious reasons) and whilst it is very feature rich, it just doesn't float my boat for some reason. I find the user interface unappealing (picky and personal I know) and generally doesn't seem to flow as nicely as I'd hoped.

Personally, if I were to move from Steinberg to something else, it would probably be (do I hear groans?) Pro Tools - simply as it is an industry standard. I'd keep a version of Cubase for midi arranging and then do all serious work in PT.

--------------------
Veni, Vidi, Aesculi
(I came, I saw, I conkered)


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PrinceXizor
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Dave B]
      #410577 - 23/01/07 05:47 PM
Did you get it set up in the mixer mode that appeals more to Cubase users?

Jim

--------------------
My Home Studio Build Thread


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Dave B]
      #410580 - 23/01/07 05:53 PM
Quote Dave B:

I had a look at Samplitude last week (for obvious reasons) and whilst it is very feature rich, it just doesn't float my boat for some reason. I find the user interface unappealing (picky and personal I know) and generally doesn't seem to flow as nicely as I'd hoped.

Personally, if I were to move from Steinberg to something else, it would probably be (do I hear groans?) Pro Tools - simply as it is an industry standard. I'd keep a version of Cubase for midi arranging and then do all serious work in PT.




I'm with you 100% on this, although the demo was easy to get into, there was just something that didn't float my boat too and I'm seriously considering PT


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Keef



Joined: 04/10/04
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Loc: Montreal, Canada
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #410595 - 23/01/07 06:20 PM
Quote Conz:

Quote Dave B:

I had a look at Samplitude last week (for obvious reasons) and whilst it is very feature rich, it just doesn't float my boat for some reason. I find the user interface unappealing (picky and personal I know) and generally doesn't seem to flow as nicely as I'd hoped.

Personally, if I were to move from Steinberg to something else, it would probably be (do I hear groans?) Pro Tools - simply as it is an industry standard. I'd keep a version of Cubase for midi arranging and then do all serious work in PT.




I'm with you 100% on this, although the demo was easy to get into, there was just something that didn't float my boat too and I'm seriously considering PT




What are you looking for is the question. Are you looking for some graphic screen and built in plug ins that knock you out? Or are you more interested in a program that is rock solid, offers lot's of flexiblity, and where you get great support?

Before I jump ship on Cubase, I will give Steinberg a little while to come out with some fixes for Cubase 4. When I get a dual processing computer, I would like my DAW to support 64 bit. If Cubase 4 still has many issues, including being too dark and difficult to read, I will switch to Samplitude. Pro Tools LE is too limiting for me, and the full version is not needed and way too expensive. Not to mention all the plugs ins cost more for it compared to the native versions. We have enough power with dual and quad processors that we don’t need DSP cards anymore.

Edited by Keef (23/01/07 06:26 PM)


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AllyB
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410605 - 23/01/07 06:35 PM
can i rewire ableton live into samplitude?

What about samplitudes video editing?

--------------------
Producer etc


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Dave B



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410639 - 23/01/07 08:07 PM
Quote Keef:

What are you looking for is the question. Are you looking for some graphic screen and built in plug ins that knock you out? Or are you more interested in a program that is rock solid, offers lot's of flexiblity, and where you get great support?




Not necessarily 'knock me out', but I do have a thing about the aesthetics of software - usually if it is clearly laid out and readable then it easier to use especially for long periods. This is one of Steinberg's strengths imho although I will probably bite the bullet and get a copy of C4 and am dreading the darkness...

However, it's not about a zillion plug-ins - just a handful of useful ones are preferable and there Samplitude did score well - as I have a Liquid Mix and Powercore so I'm sorted for a lot of the basic stuff. Solidity _is_ important, as is flexibility. Support .... I can do without as long as it's there if I really do need it. And sadly that's where Steiny are really lacking - they just seem to be completely indifferent to their customers from where I'm standing.

Pro Tools is a known quantity and it's strengths and failings are well documented. Plus I'd be able to exchange projects with other studios which would be nice for a change. It's not something that I'd leap into blind and I'll probably consider a Mac+Logic as well. Still, plenty of time before that happens...

--------------------
Veni, Vidi, Aesculi
(I came, I saw, I conkered)


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tex
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Dave B]
      #410691 - 23/01/07 10:02 PM
Steinberg are being pretty shocking to their customers. While I think that C4 is pretty stable there are some issues but the real grief over there is the dropping of SX3 DX & Midex support which may be understandable but there was no notice given to customers & the mods are stomping all over posts that dare to complain (Other than mine, to anybody clued in. Yes, I know. I didn't know "mini" was that bad an insult and was not given a chance to aopologise). The paranoia seems to be very large and sulky. I'd wait a bit for C4 as they are developing a 64bit version urgently it seems from their explanation for dropping SX3 but beware the mangement (sic)and the PR representation from one or two of the mod's is shockingly bad at the moment. They've painted themselves into a corner so it's best to let the paint dry a bit first.

--------------------
Success is round the corner. It's also round the bend.

Edited by tex (23/01/07 10:11 PM)


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Keef



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: tex]
      #410777 - 24/01/07 05:00 AM
Well just in case things at Steinberg continue to be messy, I tried out Samplitude 9 demo today. I found it to be very nice and better than Cubase in some ways, and in other ways not. (Guess your not surprised.)

I do like that you have 16 channels on your mixer showing all your inserts, aux, and EQ's on every channel. Cubase still can't do that. I also like on the arrange page on the left, you can see your notes, eq, plug ins and other info all at the same time. Again with Cubase it's only one view item at a time. I was able to get my Waves plug ins to work nicely with it as well. Found you can change a track from mono to stereo with a click of a button. If you make your arrange page a little larger you can see the volume on each channel all at once with Samplitude.

I like the compressor, EQ, chorus, and delay effects better than what is in Cubase SX 3. Though I know they improved them on Cubase 4.

However the mixer looks a little 2 diminsional compared to Cubase. With Cubase you can have 2 mixers on one screen and the arrange page on other screen. Mixer 1 for instance can show audio tracks only (if you choose), while mixer two can show vst, midi, and group channels. You get about 24 channels total compared to the 16 channels plus output channel limit in Samplitude. Didn't see a snap option yet which I like in Cubase or the ability to choose different colors on the fly for your tracks like Cubase.

After going through some growing pains with Samplitude, I will make a decision. However at this point, I am on the fence.


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410806 - 24/01/07 09:14 AM
Quote Keef:

What are you looking for is the question. Are you looking for some graphic screen and built in plug ins that knock you out? Or are you more interested in a program that is rock solid, offers lot's of flexiblity, and where you get great support?




I want something that is rock solid, intuative and know is going to be with me for a very long time, with the minimum of fuss.

I've been MIDI programming for 20+ years now and to be honest, most of the feautures that've been added to Cubase over time I rarely or never use. I program simple edits, using note on / off, volume, AT, the usual stuff. What I do with Cubase, from a MIDI point of view, can be done with my old program Music X, so I'm almost certain I will be fine with Pro Tools LE.

I still need to do a lot more homework before I make the switch though. Hopefully in this time too, we will see some progression (either way) with Steinberg.

Cheers,
Peter


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marsnic
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #410825 - 24/01/07 09:53 AM
Quote Conz:



I've been MIDI programming for 20+ years now and to be honest, most of the feautures that've been added to Cubase over time I rarely or never use. I program simple edits, using note on / off, volume, AT, the usual stuff. What I do with Cubase, from a MIDI point of view, can be done with my old program Music X, so I'm almost certain I will be fine with Pro Tools LE.

I still need to do a lot more homework before I make the switch though. Hopefully in this time too, we will see some progression (either way) with Steinberg.

Cheers,
Peter




I wouldn't hold your breath. You might as well make your decision now because in the 20 odd years I've been a Pro24/Cubase user, nothing's changed. From my poor experiences over the years (with Steinberg and most other companies), I no longer expect decent support (hardware or software). If you get it (and it's not in Mumbai), it is a bonus but it seems a rarity now. I know that is not right, but that is the reality of the world today from my experience. What I do look for however is a good user community and to that end, I now never contact Steinberg support but go straight to the forums. I've personally never had a problem solving a problem this way. Even companies with good technical support (Soundscape being the best I've come across), I still find myself more often than not using the user forums.


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Koed



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410833 - 24/01/07 10:04 AM
Give the free 30 day trial of Sonar 6 a whirl while you're at it.


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: marsnic]
      #410842 - 24/01/07 10:17 AM
Quote marsnic:

Quote Conz:



I've been MIDI programming for 20+ years now and to be honest, most of the feautures that've been added to Cubase over time I rarely or never use. I program simple edits, using note on / off, volume, AT, the usual stuff. What I do with Cubase, from a MIDI point of view, can be done with my old program Music X, so I'm almost certain I will be fine with Pro Tools LE.

I still need to do a lot more homework before I make the switch though. Hopefully in this time too, we will see some progression (either way) with Steinberg.

Cheers,
Peter




I wouldn't hold your breath. You might as well make your decision now because in the 20 odd years I've been a Pro24/Cubase user, nothing's changed. From my poor experiences over the years (with Steinberg and most other companies), I no longer expect decent support (hardware or software). If you get it (and it's not in Mumbai), it is a bonus but it seems a rarity now. I know that is not right, but that is the reality of the world today from my experience. What I do look for however is a good user community and to that end, I now never contact Steinberg support but go straight to the forums. I've personally never had a problem solving a problem this way. Even companies with good technical support (Soundscape being the best I've come across), I still find myself more often than not using the user forums.




Ah, Pro 24. That brings back memories. I actually started off using Pro 12, but soon moved to 24 (amongst a few other packages). I never really had any problems with Steiny back then, probably because everything was a lot simpler and didn't have the internet explosion we have today to bring the user community together, hearing other user horror stories.

P

--------------------
Composer, Songwriter, Producer, Sound Designer
www.peterconnelly.com


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #410868 - 24/01/07 10:51 AM
Hmmm, the Pro Tools family and options are starting to make more sense to me. I have a Delta 1010 and there is a Pro tools M Powered package which might be perfect for me:

Pro Tools M Powered INFO

Very cheap!

P


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #410869 - 24/01/07 10:52 AM
Quote Conz:

Hmmm, the Pro Tools family and options are starting to make more sense to me. I have a Delta 1010 and there is a Pro tools M Powered package which might be perfect for me:

Pro Tools M Powered INFO

Very cheap!

P




I'd love to try before I buy though. I really need to see if PT works for me! I suppose it could if it had to, but nice to try first.

P


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tomafd



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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410885 - 24/01/07 11:16 AM
Just to say that having started on Pro 12, then 24, on the Atari, I went Logic about 5 years ago (having finally replaced the Atari with a Mac) simply because most of the folk I was working with were using Logic, and easy transfer to other systems was important.

One of the best music tech decisions I ever made... for flexibility and open architecture (which often cause the initial confusion people have with Logic) you can't beat it, so if you need plenty of room for all kinds of routing and experimentation, go Logic. You won't regret it !

--------------------
http://anotherfineday.bandcamp.com/ http://anotherfineday.co.uk http://apollomusic.co.uk


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Peter Conz Connelly
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Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #410891 - 24/01/07 11:29 AM
Quote Conz:

Quote Conz:

Hmmm, the Pro Tools family and options are starting to make more sense to me. I have a Delta 1010 and there is a Pro tools M Powered package which might be perfect for me:

Pro Tools M Powered INFO

Very cheap!

P




I'd love to try before I buy though. I really need to see if PT works for me! I suppose it could if it had to, but nice to try first.

P




Got a 7 day trial download from the M-Audio site. Nice!

P


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Peter Conz Connelly
active member


Joined: 17/09/02
Posts: 2194
Loc: Tyne & Wear, UK
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: tomafd]
      #410892 - 24/01/07 11:30 AM
Quote tomafd:

Just to say that having started on Pro 12, then 24, on the Atari, I went Logic about 5 years ago (having finally replaced the Atari with a Mac) simply because most of the folk I was working with were using Logic, and easy transfer to other systems was important.

One of the best music tech decisions I ever made... for flexibility and open architecture (which often cause the initial confusion people have with Logic) you can't beat it, so if you need plenty of room for all kinds of routing and experimentation, go Logic. You won't regret it !




Yeah, I know a few people that swear by Logic. If I were a Mac user, this would be a good candidate, but as I'm PC it just isn't viable at the moment.

Cheers,
Peter


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Spandau-Staaken



Joined: 15/03/06
Posts: 647
Loc: N.E. U.K.
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #410893 - 24/01/07 11:30 AM
As a former 'ship jumper' from long term Cubase (up to SX) use to Pro-Tools LE, I would advise caution before jumping;

I too found that Cubase SX had many bugs and issues (mainly around MIDI for me) in the software that was starting to drive me mad, and like others I was disatisfied with Steinberg support.

The move to Pro-Tools LE (via the MBox 2 bundle) initially proved to be twice as painful for one main reason; whereas PT is generally more stable and bug-free than Cubase from a Software/operating perspective, PT is MUCH more sensitive to the hardware that is used. You need to consider this as Hardware based incompatibility and issues can be more frustrating and get in the way of creativity a lot more than software bugs! For starters, PT will not work with all PCs / MOBOs / etc. You need to check the compatibility section at www.digidesign.com to ensure it will work with your system. Next, you will need a seperate (2nd) drive for audio. PT is not happy sharing the primary OS drive for it's audio files. If you compromise on this, PT may still run but latency, playback and even WAV Rendering performance can be seriously affected.

Next comes the fact that PT is locked in with the Audio Interface that you buy it with (except PT M-Powered), so is not as flexible in this regard.

Also for all the MIDI heads out there, remember that PT is still heavily oriented towards audio recording, and MIDI sequencing is still not it's natural, intuitive speciality.

I do confess to a smug grin when I read these posts. Being an ex-Cubase SX, ex-Pro Tools LE user who now works blissfully on Tracktion 2, with absolutel rock solid reliabiltiy in every respect, a fantastically simple workflow, and did I mention how good the audio summing (mixing) engine sounds, thanks to the radical new math approach used? People persist in turning their nose up at Tracktion but (like Samplitude) it should be a very serious consideration for those fed up with things getting in the way of fast, powerful, intuitive music making!



--------------------
What it says on the tin...


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Doublehelix



Joined: 04/12/02
Posts: 4162
Loc: USA
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Peter Conz Connelly]
      #411391 - 25/01/07 02:31 AM
Quote Conz:

Quote Dave B:

I had a look at Samplitude last week (for obvious reasons) and whilst it is very feature rich, it just doesn't float my boat for some reason. I find the user interface unappealing (picky and personal I know) and generally doesn't seem to flow as nicely as I'd hoped.

Personally, if I were to move from Steinberg to something else, it would probably be (do I hear groans?) Pro Tools - simply as it is an industry standard. I'd keep a version of Cubase for midi arranging and then do all serious work in PT.




I'm with you 100% on this, although the demo was easy to get into, there was just something that didn't float my boat too and I'm seriously considering PT





This cracks me up you guys, because I am in the same exact boat! I tried the Samplitude demo tonight for the first time, and although I didn't spend very much time with it, I do have to say that it did not float my boat either. Cubase just looks and acts more "classy" in some way that I cannot describe fully.

If I am to go the PT route, it will be PT HD, and not the PT LE version. I need ADC and rock solid ability.

To Keef's comments about the plugins...

I looked into this extensively, and most of the VST (native) plugins also have RTAS (Pro Tools Native) versions on the same disc at no additional charge. These will run fine in PT, and run natively on the host CPU. At some point, I might consider upgrading to the TDM versions of some of the more popular plugins, but for now, I could get by just fine with the RTAS versions for those that are so equipped, and with a VST wrapper for those that are VST-only.

By using this philosophy, I can probably get by with a PT HD1 or HD2 system, no problem.

Still lots of money I know, but I am tired of playing Steinberg's game.

--------------------
James
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake" ~Napoleon Bonaparte~


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Glenn Bucci
active member


Joined: 28/10/02
Posts: 1214
Loc: Pennsylvania
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411394 - 25/01/07 03:35 AM
I am another one on this boat. I am not crazy about the look and work flow of what I have seen with Cubase 4. I like my vst instrument setup in SX 3. I don't like the dark screens and difficult to read menus. Not to mention all the bugs that it currently has.

I told Doublehelix and others that we have been using Cubase for many years and we are so used to it. Samplitude has more of a Cubase 5.1 look and feel. I spent about 2 hours with it yesterday and calling up the help desk on how do you do this, and can you do this. I was not very excited about it either. Tonight I got all my VST instruments (including Hypersonic II), UAD and Waves plug ins working with Samplitude. I would think you would need to at least record a couple of songs from start to finish on any new DAW before you to start to get used to the look and feel of it.

I can tell you already that I like the arrange page in Samplitude better. I like that the plug ins, effects, and info is all on the left side of the page and all at the same time. Then depending on what stage your at on a song, there is a easy, mastering and other menu on the bottom of the screen which shows different icons and options. Some of them hide when you choose the mastering option since you won't need them at that time. So it only displays particular things on the arrange page when you choose the different options. This makes the arrange page cleaner and not as messy.

Samplitude does not need as much cpu to run compared to Cubase. It opens a lot faster and just seems to be easier on my computer. What I don't like is not having the ability to have two mixers on one screen, with one showing audio tracks and the other mixer showing midi and vst tracks. However seeing all your effects, inserts, and EQ on each track on the mixer is really nice and very informative. I was also told by Samplitude that they are going to have a special for a couple of weeks on a cross grade option of only $399 US dollars. That will be a $200 savings on the regular upgrade. It would also only cost $200 more than the upgrade to Cubase 4. I could still use Cubase SX 3 and learn Samplitude until I am ready to use it with clients. I have to admit I am starting to like Samplitude a little more each hour I am on it. This would be interesting if all of us jump to Samplitude. We would then have to ask SOS to have a Tips article with Samplitude as well.

--------------------
revelationsoundstudio.com


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S G H Houbart



Joined: 26/02/06
Posts: 73
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411413 - 25/01/07 07:25 AM
I'm a cheapskate. Using freebie plugs always carries with it the risk that you bring down your entire DAW with an ill judged choice. What sold Samplitude 7 to me when backing off of SX1 was the fact that when something does go wrong, Sam 7 traps the fail in a dialog that lets you save the project in a controlled way. SX1 just unexpectedly vanishes leaving a wrecked and unusable project behind.

It's the little unobvious things. Like running two versions of Sam at once synced on different ASIO drivers. There's a whole world you just don't expect if you're coming off of Cubase.


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Peter Conz Connelly
active member


Joined: 17/09/02
Posts: 2194
Loc: Tyne & Wear, UK
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: S G H Houbart]
      #411447 - 25/01/07 09:24 AM
I also tried Sonar demo yesterday, but hated it. It seems a million miles from SX and Samplitude. It's very well presented and is pleasing to the eye, but the MIDI edit is plain awful (that was the killer for me). Once I realised what I was dealing with, I shut it down. BUT, in fairness, thought I'd give it another go and digged deeper. Same result. Hated it.

Maybe I didn't give it enough time, I dunno, but as with games if I can't pick up the controller and get straight into them, chances are I won't stick with it or buy them.

Cheers,
Peter


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John Willett
Sound-Link ProAudio


Joined: 07/03/00
Posts: 12366
Loc: Oxfordshire UK
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Glenn Bucci]
      #411480 - 25/01/07 10:45 AM
Quote Blueberry:

We would then have to ask SOS to have a Tips article with Samplitude as well.




Yes please - I'm definitely for this.

--------------------
John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons


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MsM



Joined: 09/02/06
Posts: 103
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411501 - 25/01/07 11:28 AM
I'm also at a decision point, going from SX3 to what? Samplitude looks interesting, does it have the same or similar kind of integration with external effects and MIDI instruments as Cubase?

M.


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JosephR



Joined: 23/01/06
Posts: 204
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411772 - 25/01/07 08:18 PM
I too jumped off the Cubase wagon a while back...and i'd be lying if i said i missed it as my main DAW, (although i have to confess to having reinstalled Cubase LE just for MIDI control of external gear).

I'm now relying on a combination of Tracktion 2 and PT LE but to be honest neither are great for MIDI. I like Tracktion because it's so quick, laying down a track in the box really doesn't get much easier, and PT is great for recording/audio editing but neither of them are comparable to Cubase for controlling external synths.

I'm definitely going to have a look at Samplitude now, after everyone's recommendations, and hopefully i can reconsolidate things back into one package...probably not but it's worth a try


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Doublehelix



Joined: 04/12/02
Posts: 4162
Loc: USA
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411838 - 25/01/07 11:24 PM
I really don't do much (if any) midi work, so I would be OK with a limited implementation compared to Cubase, but I *do* want it to work.

--------------------
James
"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake" ~Napoleon Bonaparte~


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Glenn Bucci
active member


Joined: 28/10/02
Posts: 1214
Loc: Pennsylvania
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Doublehelix]
      #411850 - 26/01/07 12:04 AM
Quote Doublehelix:

I really don't do much (if any) midi work, so I would be OK with a limited implementation compared to Cubase, but I *do* want it to work.




I recorded some midi tracks and you have the ability to control the notes, velocity, etc just like Cubase. I also like the punch in markers on the transport, and the editor it has. There is a expander on the master bus which is cool, and a way to keep the level at 0 with a push of a button. Also found to cut and paste to be a little quicker than Cubase. Just got down reading 150 pages of the manual. Still have a couple of questions, but I think I should be able to switch and know 70% of what I will work with in about a 2 week time period. At this point I am leaning towards getting it. I think Keef is too. Keef where are you?

--------------------
revelationsoundstudio.com

Edited by Blueberry (26/01/07 12:04 AM)


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Sam Inglis
SOS Features Editor


Joined: 15/12/00
Posts: 1715
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411941 - 26/01/07 09:46 AM
FYI, there are some Samplitude workshops in the pipeline for SOS later this year...


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Loudbox
new member


Joined: 10/01/01
Posts: 297
Loc: UK
Re: Steinberg getting Cubase users angry new [Re: Keef]
      #411978 - 26/01/07 10:35 AM
Sorry, I've posted a similar comment elsewhere. I'm a long time Cubase user (back on Atari with Pro24). I've used it virtually every day for the past 12 years. So a move to any other platform is going to be tricky. I've tried the demos of both Samplitude and Sonar and just can't seem to get into them at all. Is this because Cubase is better or more likely that I'm so used to Cubase that I just can't see beyond the different interface and gui.

I know that in principle I should look for an alternative to Steinberg due to the shocking way they have treated loyal customers over the years. However, Cubase 4 offers me an application that I'm familiar with and new features that will be very handy. Whether they work or not remains to be seen!


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