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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
budget PA for acoustic ensembles new
      #584113 - 23/02/08 08:50 PM
Hi,
It's been a very long time since I did live PA, so I'm completely out of touch with the latest technology, but I'm being pulled back into it due to work with a certain music charity.

What would you recommend for main speakers for small/medium venues, up to 50/100 people?

The group consists of various ethnic string instruments, tabla, lots of vocals.

Since it's a new charity, the budget is tight.
Thanks in advance.

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584393 - 24/02/08 08:34 PM

I'm just looking at the Studiospares catalogue and see a few candidates:
-Yamaha S112 or S115
-JBL JRX115
Studiospares have their own range too.

Any opinions on these ? Any experience with acoustic instruments ?

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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atarimad
member


Joined: 24/09/03
Posts: 378
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584408 - 24/02/08 09:10 PM
Studiospares Fortissimo 12a or 15a if you're on a tight budget.


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Paul Soundscape



Joined: 27/06/06
Posts: 722
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584413 - 24/02/08 09:29 PM
yamaha's are good,
dont know about the studio spares but people rate them here,
jrx's arent great,
if you can afford a bit more, you may want to look at EV or similar

--------------------
Live Sound and Studio Engineer


Edited by Paul Supersonix Studios (24/02/08 09:30 PM)


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Bazza
new member


Joined: 19/08/03
Posts: 484
Loc: County Durham
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584417 - 24/02/08 09:44 PM
RCF every time. THe 10A s would probably suit wht you're after if the budget's tight. If not get the 12As

--------------------
This time next week, who'll give a sh*t
http://www.podcastrevision.co.uk


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James PerrettModerator



Joined: 10/09/01
Posts: 10697
Loc: The wilds of Hampshire
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: Bazza]
      #584513 - 25/02/08 10:37 AM
Quote Bazza:

RCF every time. THe 10A s would probably suit wht you're after if the budget's tight. If not get the 12As




RCF are good but I wouldn't call them a budget brand. That's probably why RCF bought dB Technologies - so that they could keep the RCF name for the expensive stuff and use the dB Technologies name on the cheaper stuff.

Cheers

James.

--------------------
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration.
http://www.jrpmusic.net


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Bob Bickerton
active member


Joined: 20/12/02
Posts: 3080
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584514 - 25/02/08 10:42 AM
If you're looking for acoustic enhancement and balance for a listening audience as opposed to being "LOUD" over ambient noise you could get away with the Yamaha Stagepass systems. I've done around 300 shows with up to 200 school kids with a Stagepass 300 system in often poor acoustics. The Stagepass 500 is gruntier, but neither system would be suitable for club or enviroments other than concerts settings.

Otherwise I'd recommend JBL G2 Eons which I use in larger venues.

Bob

--------------------
www.bickerton.co.nz


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: Bob Bickerton]
      #584530 - 25/02/08 11:41 AM
We need at least 12 mic channels so The Yamaha StagePass is not good as the included mixer only has four.

I think you have phrased it nicely. 'Acoustic enhacement' is what I'd probably want, but experience tells me that some of the musicians there will expect to have the volume LOUD.

I just did my calculactions, and the price of that Studiospares range is really attractive. The Fortissimo 12P or even the larger 15P would make them happy price-wise. The Yamaha AX range is also attractive. Out of these two what would be the better choice for this acoustic set up ?

JBL Eon is above the budget since I still have to get a mixer, 15 mics, cables, stands, etc...

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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IvanSC



Joined: 08/03/05
Posts: 7791
Loc: UK France & USA depending on t...
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584546 - 25/02/08 12:08 PM
15 mics.
Exactly what lineup of instruments will you be working with?

You might hopefully be able to reduce the overall number of mics by using omnis and just doing general sound reinfocement for the whole stage area.

Mind you if you have sitars you`ll need a fair bit ov level on them against say tablas.

--------------------
Me? But I`m such a loveable old bugger!


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: IvanSC]
      #584572 - 25/02/08 01:21 PM
Sorry, I meant 12 mics not 15 ( 12 mic channels after all..)

Well, the lineup will change, but the overall picture is this:
1. Sitar player + Vocal ( 2 mics)
2. Tabla ( 1 mic)
3. Possibly other drum instruments ( 1 or 2 mics)
4. Sarod ( 1 mic)
5. Tambura ( not confirmed if it'll be a real one or electronic box)
6. And a large vocal group. This is where the trouble beginns. These are 'student' singers mainly, with rather week/timid voices and no mic technique, plus an unshakeble conviction that if they are not given a mic all to themselves, they won't be heard...

The vocalists are sat on this long custom made stage, in a weird sort of shape so I need at least three mics here.

I also need one or two spare mics.

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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Paul Soundscape



Joined: 27/06/06
Posts: 722
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584597 - 25/02/08 02:12 PM
how tight is your budget?
and its just main speakers you need...?

--------------------
Live Sound and Studio Engineer


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: Paul Soundscape]
      #584619 - 25/02/08 03:23 PM
It's tight....
£1000

I have the benefit of some gear I already own, like my two JBL Eon 10 active monitors, speaker stands, lots of cables, several good mic stands, some outboard... 7 of my own mics, so these can be pressed into service too.

But the budget has to be enough for:
1. Two speakers + cables
2. Either, a powered mixer, or an amp and a mixer.
3. Mics
4. A suitable case for the mixer and amp
5. A few more mic cables
6. other bits and bops.
?. Possibly a stage box.

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design

Edited by himalaya (25/02/08 03:24 PM)


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James PerrettModerator



Joined: 10/09/01
Posts: 10697
Loc: The wilds of Hampshire
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584711 - 25/02/08 05:58 PM
For the best value for money you probably want to look for something used or ex-demo. I was going to go for the Studiospares stuff but ended up buying some speakers from a local rehearsal studio and ex demo monitors from Ebay for less than I would have paid for the Studiospares Fortissimos.

Cheers

James.

--------------------
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration.
http://www.jrpmusic.net


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: James Perrett]
      #584715 - 25/02/08 06:03 PM
That is also a possibility. I've been looking around ebay, etc. We'll see...

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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Mike Sullivan



Joined: 31/12/07
Posts: 268
Loc: Ashland, KY, USA
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: himalaya]
      #584740 - 25/02/08 07:21 PM
Yamaha's Stagepas 500 has 10 channels, so you could probably find XLR splitters or something (if they exist, I'm not fully knowledged with this stuff. XD

Yamaha's speakers are good though. We have a pair of S15e's at our school on 75w of power each channel (when the speakers are 250w program, 500w peak) and they can handle a crowd of 1200 in a really (I mean REALLY) small gym, and outside in the stadium (during pep rallies).

I also heard Behringer's good for budget systems, so maybe a pair of P2520's and their PMH2000 should suit you fine. The 2520's have 2 x 15" woofers and a 1.75" horn with the horn going 90* x 40*, so that sounds like a good deal.

Maybe if you have to get another cheap 4-6 channel mixer to go into one of the channels?

--------------------
Ice Cold Productions Live Sound & Lighting
Just your average small town sound guy.


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himalaya



Joined: 25/01/05
Posts: 354
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles new [Re: Mike Sullivan]
      #584853 - 26/02/08 12:23 AM
Well, the stagepass 500 might do if I use my little Mackie 1202 mixer with it. It's not ideal, but it's possible.

Lot's of food for thought. Many thanks to all!

--------------------
www.electric-himalaya.com
VST and hardware synth sound design


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James PerrettModerator



Joined: 10/09/01
Posts: 10697
Loc: The wilds of Hampshire
Re: budget PA for acoustic ensembles [Re: Mike Sullivan]
      #584915 - 26/02/08 10:09 AM
Quote iceman1575:

Yamaha's Stagepas 500 has 10 channels, so you could probably find XLR splitters or something (if they exist, I'm not fully knowledged with this stuff. XD






Just for future reference, you can usually split one mic into two pre-amps but two mics into one pre-amp just won't go. You need a separate mic input for each mic that you want to use.

Cheers

James.

--------------------
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration.
http://www.jrpmusic.net


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