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snipsnip



Joined: 07/01/07
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Decent 2 channel ADDA? new
      #859350 - 05/09/10 03:00 PM
Hi Guys,

Ive primarily always mixed on consoles, and have kept fairly up to date regarding multi channel converters (settling in the end for an SSL alphalink because of the reasonable price break).

Now my desk has gone, and Im thinking so should my SSL.

Im looking for a fairly high quality 2 channel ADDA, but cant seem to find much. The obvious candidate was the Apogee Rosetta 200, but it is still quite expensive considering its 2006ish technology, and it has a few features I dont need.

I need it to be firewire (preferably 800)as I will want to use with a laptop.

Is there anything on the market these days for up to around £1500 that does the job? I would prefer to spend around £1k and have a simple feature set.

Appreciate your thoughts!
Thanks
Jake


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JamesSimpson



Joined: 24/12/05
Posts: 1074
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859367 - 05/09/10 05:24 PM
You can get a 2nd hand rosetta 800 for less than a grand, the company who work out of the same building as me sold a rosetta 200 for £800 just the other day.

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EnlightenedHand



Joined: 18/01/08
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859391 - 05/09/10 08:31 PM
It sounds more like you're looking for an audio interface and not just a stand alone converter. But if you were looking for stand alone conversion at that approximate price range you might like the Lynx Aurora 8.

On the pricier side and something with a bit of character to the sound you could pick up the Universal Audio 2192 or a Crane Song HEDD. Both are excellent units.

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Mixedup
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: JamesSimpson]
      #859393 - 05/09/10 08:37 PM
Lavry, Universal Audio, Burl, Drawmer, Benchmark, Apogee, RME... they all do decent products that might or might not suit your needs, as do a few others besides. What is your budget, and do you want ultra clean, or 'flavoured' converters, and one a-d/d-a or separate units for each way?


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Mixedup
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: Mixedup]
      #859395 - 05/09/10 08:47 PM
d'oh! Just re-read and saw the budget. At that price (nothing wrong with that at all!) you're probably looking at Apogee or RME.


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Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 5364
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859403 - 05/09/10 11:12 PM
There are unfortunately signs that Firewire may not be the future.


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JamesSimpson



Joined: 24/12/05
Posts: 1074
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859406 - 05/09/10 11:37 PM
Does that matter? Your current mac pro owners with firewire 400/800 devices will probably be good for another 5 years atleast....

Thats a long time in computer land

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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
Loc: The Orient, East London
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: JamesSimpson]
      #859415 - 06/09/10 06:55 AM
Quote JamesSimpson:

You can get a 2nd hand rosetta 800 for less than a grand




v. unlikely.

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Mixedup
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859427 - 06/09/10 08:37 AM
Bit of a red herring you threw in there, Mr Wombat. Quite aside from the fact that it will be a long time before you can't add FW interfacing to a computer, most FW devices, RME ones included, can also operate standalone once set up. But RME also make dedicated standalone converters, as do Apogee and many many more...


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snipsnip



Joined: 07/01/07
Posts: 875
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859471 - 06/09/10 11:07 AM
Hi Guys,

Thanks for the replies... all the recomendations have given me something to think about and names to go away and research.

Im starting to think that really I actually need a 4 in 4 out solution now, but Im sure all your advice will point me in the right direction.

Im thinking RME may be the obvious choice for a reasonabke price break. I dont think I can afford to go up to lynx + FW card type solution.


Thanks again
Jake


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JamesSimpson



Joined: 24/12/05
Posts: 1074
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859589 - 06/09/10 09:25 PM
I've seen a rosetta 800 go for £1499....... and a 200 for under £900

Admittedly not often, but it's not impossible. Try gearslutz classifieds. Or readers ads, and sometimes ebay, but ebay prices are generally a bit more because of more attention.

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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
Loc: The Orient, East London
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: JamesSimpson]
      #859621 - 07/09/10 06:46 AM
Quote JamesSimpson:

I've seen a rosetta 800 go for £1499




£1499 is not "less than a grand".

ken

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Studio Support Gnome
Not so Miserable Git


Joined: 22/07/03
Posts: 9165
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859630 - 07/09/10 07:58 AM
unless of course, you're talking to the wife.....

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RegressiveRock
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: Studio Support Gnome]
      #859637 - 07/09/10 08:25 AM
Quote Max!:

unless of course, you're talking to the wife.....




In which case it goes "Oh that old thing, I've had it for ages!"


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JamesSimpson



Joined: 24/12/05
Posts: 1074
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859638 - 07/09/10 08:25 AM
Quote ken long:

Quote JamesSimpson:

I've seen a rosetta 800 go for £1499




£1499 is not "less than a grand".

ken





That's because the rosetta 800 has 6 more channels of conversion than the 200 that the original poster required. I was just mentioning it to illustrate the point of shopping around as a new rosetta 800 was more than 2k

Edit:


AHHHHHHHHHHHH I see I wrote rosetta 800 instead of 200 in my first post which was a mistake, I meant a rosetta 200 for less than a grand. No wonder it's confusing. Apologies.

Although that 800 would still come in under the 1500 the original poster stated he could possibly afford........

Edited by JamesSimpson (07/09/10 08:27 AM)


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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
Loc: The Orient, East London
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: Studio Support Gnome]
      #859639 - 07/09/10 08:32 AM
Quote Max!:

unless of course, you're talking to the wife.....






This post has just about made my week!

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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: JamesSimpson]
      #859640 - 07/09/10 08:34 AM
Right! I see now.

I was just about to PM you to find out where I could pick up an 800 for less than a grand!

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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me


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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859643 - 07/09/10 08:36 AM
Quote ken long:

Quote Max!:

unless of course, you're talking to the wife.....






This post has just about made my week!




I'm afraid that, despite much searching, I've yet to come across a girl (at least on who wants to share ...ehem... pillow time with me) that understands the whole gear thing. I've even spent hours trying to explain it to them using common frames of (credit card) reference such as Hermes scarf and Mulberry handbag, but to no avail.


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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
Loc: The Orient, East London
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: RegressiveRock]
      #859647 - 07/09/10 08:44 AM
I always just tell the wife it's something I need to keep ahead of the game. When she asks me the price, I usually say I got a good deal and mumble the cost. I also deduct V.A.T. so as not to shock her too much.



I also sell off smaller bits of gear in the run up to the purchase to make it appear as though I've budgeted properly for it.

I bought a new pair of Levi's for the first time in 10 years the other day so she knows I save in other departments!

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JamesSimpson



Joined: 24/12/05
Posts: 1074
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? [Re: ken long]
      #859649 - 07/09/10 08:48 AM
Quote ken long:

Right! I see now.

I was just about to PM you to find out where I could pick up an 800 for less than a grand!




Ahh, sorry haha, www.toys4noise.co.uk sometimes has some right good deals mind.



Quote RegressiveRock:

Quote ken long:

Quote Max!:

unless of course, you're talking to the wife.....






This post has just about made my week!




I'm afraid that, despite much searching, I've yet to come across a girl (at least on who wants to share ...ehem... pillow time with me) that understands the whole gear thing. I've even spent hours trying to explain it to them using common frames of (credit card) reference such as Hermes scarf and Mulberry handbag, but to no avail.




I've found one that relates to everything to fearne cotton duffle coats. Or trips to New York.... "So I could have 5 trips to New York, or 66 Fearne Cotton Duffle Coats? Or.... You could have that stupid silver thing with knobs and faders?"







My only triumph so far is that she knows what a fader is called.

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The Elf
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859657 - 07/09/10 09:02 AM
Quote ken long:

I also sell off smaller bits of gear in the run up to the purchase to make it appear as though I've budgeted properly for it



LOL! Ditto!

Quote ken long:

I bought a new pair of Levi's for the first time in 10 years the other day so she knows I save in other departments!



I get my jeans 3 pair for a tenner in the dodgy shop off the A64. Then I can justify a new mic each time my jeans wear out!

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. . . Delete This
Here be Dragons


Joined: 23/06/08
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: The Elf]
      #859664 - 07/09/10 09:21 AM
well, we've been married , on and off (it's complicated) , for a little over 20 years..... so i must be doing something right...





(sadly, the something involves NOT buying things i want , unless i can justify a very specific business need, and demonstrate a fairly immediate recoupment of the investment from a specific, pre-booked and deposit paid job..... ... the ONLY thing i miss about the "it's complicated" period.... was being able to go buy whatever the hell i wanted, when i wanted... assuming funds allowed, without having to trade it off against a new pair of fancy boots, or a bathroom suite........ or ......... )


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snipsnip



Joined: 07/01/07
Posts: 875
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859691 - 07/09/10 11:18 AM
Haha. Funny stuff.

Sliiiightly more on topic, what's the deal with FW400? I have never use a FW interface.

There seem to be plenty of apogee ensembles on the secondhand market, but I'm guessing this might not be a good thing and perhaps the fw speed is an issue? Or perhaps the converters are just not so good?

Cheers
Jake


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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
Posts: 4461
Loc: The Orient, East London
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859700 - 07/09/10 11:39 AM
I've got an Ensemble and its very good. Pres are good, converters excellent. FW is not an issue (other than the fact that its 400 on the Ensemble and 800 on the new macs ).

The converters are not as good as the Rosetta series which I also use but there's hardly anything between them.

One thing is the Maestro control software is very bad but if you are integrating it into a Logic setup, its still very good for the money.

I think it was Reid who recommended the Metric Halo to me when I was shopping around. He went from Ensemble to MH and seemed to prefer the routing. I'll try and find the thread...

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Mixedup
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859719 - 07/09/10 12:40 PM
Quote ken long:

FW is not an issue (other than the fact that its 400 on the Ensemble and 800 on the new macs ).




You can use FW400 on FW800 ports with the right cable. (It restricts the FW buss bandwidth to the 400 rate for any connected units though).

Bandwidth on FW400 is not an issue unless trying to run multiple units (DSP processors etc) concurrently: For example, I've been happily running an RME FF800 (10 analogue IO channels) with a Creamware A16 Ultra (16 more analogue IO) via ADAT on FW400 without problems; though running a Focusrite Liquid Mix at the same time didn't make for a happy experience.


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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me


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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859720 - 07/09/10 12:41 PM
Quote snipsnip:

Haha. Funny stuff.

Sliiiightly more on topic, what's the deal with FW400? I have never use a FW interface.

There seem to be plenty of apogee ensembles on the secondhand market, but I'm guessing this might not be a good thing and perhaps the fw speed is an issue? Or perhaps the converters are just not so good?

Cheers
Jake




Plusses for Ensemble:

Plug and play Logic integration
Maestro controller software
Nice "big" pre with oddles of gain

Negatives for Ensemble:

Some reports of problems with monitor volume control on early units
Some users feel that Apogee conversion at this level has a slight timbre to it

Personally with the new Symphony pushing through, if higher end Apogee users start to buy into the new product line you have plenty AD/DA16 and Rosetta units to choose from on the second-hand market.

Ensemble is a nice "bundle", but if Apogee floats your boat a little patience might allow you access to higher end Apogee products at a smarter price, and, let's face it, you don't want to buy an Ensemble and have its resale price driven down by the market flooding with higher end Apogee gear do you?

Reg


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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me


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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: . . . Delete This User . . .]
      #859723 - 07/09/10 12:47 PM
Quote idris y draig:

well, we've been married , on and off (it's complicated) , for a little over 20 years..... so i must be doing something right...





(sadly, the something involves NOT buying things i want , unless i can justify a very specific business need, and demonstrate a fairly immediate recoupment of the investment from a specific, pre-booked and deposit paid job..... ... the ONLY thing i miss about the "it's complicated" period.... was being able to go buy whatever the hell i wanted, when i wanted... assuming funds allowed, without having to trade it off against a new pair of fancy boots, or a bathroom suite........ or ......... )




This is the thing I really don't get: "Every time he/she buys something, I'll make him/her sleep in the bath for a month then I'll hoover up all his/her money: that's bound to help!"

Oops! Sorry need to get back on topic!!!

A Mini-Me plus Mini-DAC combo works very nicely if you've got the love for Apogee and you're not looking for much in the way of whistles and bells.


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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: Mixedup]
      #859724 - 07/09/10 12:48 PM
Quote Mixedup:

Quote ken long:

FW is not an issue (other than the fact that its 400 on the Ensemble and 800 on the new macs ).




You can use FW400 on FW800 ports with the right cable.




Really? I had no idea. I guess I'll take it back out of the box then. Its not broken after all!



My post was referring to the fact that Ensemble is Mac only isn't spec'd with their latest line. What's Ensemble? 2-3 years old? Its more of a dig at Apple who could have alerted designers at Apogee of their intention of dropping 400.

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Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: ken long]
      #859735 - 07/09/10 01:19 PM
Quote ken long:

:

My post was referring to the fact that Ensemble is Mac only isn't spec'd with their latest line. What's Ensemble? 2-3 years old? Its more of a dig at Apple who could have alerted designers at Apogee of their intention of dropping 400.




Apple never alert anyone of their intention to do ANYTHING.


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ken long



Joined: 21/01/08
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Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: Exalted Wombat]
      #859741 - 07/09/10 01:35 PM
...and that's the problem.

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snipsnip



Joined: 07/01/07
Posts: 875
Re: Decent 2 channel ADDA? new [Re: snipsnip]
      #859746 - 07/09/10 01:46 PM
Thanks guys.

Good to know FW 400 has enough bandwidth to handle sensible loads. Also good to know those FW800 > 400 cables work.

I am tempted by the ensemble as it looks like reasonable value. I am in no rush at the moment (depends on how quickly I can sell my alphalink), but if that takes a while it would be v interesting to see if the rosettas come down a bit in price.

Thanks agian for the input. Very very useful stuff.
Jake


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