Hi

I looking at some new monitors. Ive been using Behringer Truths for the apst couple of years and are getting shot of them, largely because they are just too large for my set up. I’m basically working in the corner of a room with a built in desk unit so want something more suited to that.

I produce house and techno.

I’ve narrowed things down to the following:

1. Focal CMS 40
2. KRK VXT4
3. Genelec 8020a(or b) – both are still available.

All pretty similar on cost and dimensions and all have had good reviews – it would eb really helpful to hear anyone’s opinion on these monitors.

Thanks

Jonathan

Let me narrow it down a little more for you my man..

PMC DB1

Totally reliable bass reproduction at any volume level, top quality.

I think ported speakers should be banned, really i do!

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The most punk thing you can do is stop listening to punk.....
http://www.bandmix.co.uk/iain-hamilton

Welcome!

A simple question before you spend a lot of money on new monitors... have you acoustically treated your room?

If not, that has to be your first priority.

Acoustic treatment is important, but i'd say when dealing with speakers this small, unless your working in a cupboard, it is not your FIRST priority considering you could be spending around a grand on speakers.

All the treatment you would need would cost next to nothing if you use the forum here to help you.

Plus NO amount of acoustic treatment will stop reflex speakers smearing your critical low end. Great for cheap hifi, crap for music production. (IMO i must add, although i shouldn't have to ; )

As you say your working on electronic music, i'm assuming bass is of particular importance to you, and, as you've stated you want small speakers, a sealed system wont do here either. Transmission line speakers are your best best for fullest range from a little box without resorting to troublesome subs and what not.

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The most punk thing you can do is stop listening to punk.....
http://www.bandmix.co.uk/iain-hamilton

Welcome to the SOS Forums Jonathan!

Some good replies there already - if you have no acoustic treatment at the moment you might be surprised how much better your Behringer Truths might sound with some in place, but if you definitely want to replace these with smaller units then the transmission-line approach of the PMC range is an excellent recommendation for a good but un-hyped bass end.


Martin

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YewTreeMagic

Welcome to Sos John baby!



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Samplecraze
Stretch That Note

The passive version of the PMC DB1 seems quite affordable, the active less so.

To drive the passive version, would a decent hifi amp like a NAD do the job ? Or do you need something more exotic like PMC's own amps ?

The Adam speakers used to get good comments. Are they out of fashion now ?

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Instant gratification is actually pretty good. It's fast as well.

... is it because they don't have enough bass extension ?

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Instant gratification is actually pretty good. It's fast as well.

Quote SecretSam:

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To drive the passive version, would a decent hifi amp like a NAD do the job ? Or do you need something more exotic like PMC's own amps ?

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I used to do just this.. Drive my TB2's with a NAD hifi amp. (C340 model, 60'ish watts) And it worked out better than I expected. But this amp was only temporary until I could sort out something more appropriate.
Flying Mole amps had just gone out of production at the time. And Brystons were too much wedge. But being somewhat into DIY, I cobbled together my own Class D amp, built from preassembled Hypex modules (They make superb kit). So I now have a 200+ watt stereo Class D amp for roundabouts the same cost as just one of PMC's 200 watt Class D monoblocks.
It's a rather good amp if I do say so myself

Paul

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Paul

I'm using the Focal CMS 65 sitting on an Ikea Jerker desk in an alcove by the side wall (speakers next to the walls) in a very small 2nd bedroom, with no room treatment at all. Yes I know, I know, about as bad as you can get probably!! (Rented accommodation and I'm going to have to move the stuff to the main bedroom soon to make way for our first baby).

However actually they work pretty well. I fiddled with the DIP switches the other day, upped the low bass slightly and notched the "desktop notch" setting - and actually they aren't sounding half bad. Lots of bass, crisp and clear, not much mud. Perfectly usable actually. I don't think I'd want the smaller ones to be honest.

Being front ported helps an awful lot - my previous JBL LSR4326 (back ported) were just too much and sounded awful in this room (muddy, no bass), now they are on stands in the living room and sound great.

Quote Not For Glory:

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Let me narrow it down a little more for you my man..

PMC DB1

Totally reliable bass reproduction at any volume level, top quality.

I think ported speakers should be banned, really i do!

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I think premature and ill considered dismissals should be banned. I really do.

Whether or not a speaker is useful as a tool to get mixes to translate to the widest variety of playback systems cannot be reduced to an argument about ported cabinets against sealed cabinets. It's not that simple. Having a hole in the box does have it's trade offs, but all speaker designs have their trade offs and there are some ported designs that are quite good as reference tools.

Now whether or not you'd prefer to work with ported speakers is a matter of your personal preference, but it is not fact that simply because there are holes in the box then the speakers can't be sufficient to get the job of critical listening done. I've used ported and sealed cabinet. I tend to like the sealed cabinet speakers that I've used for different reasons than I liked the ported. But I can say that the ported speakers that I like could be fairly recommended to anyone looking for a reliable reference simply because on the whole they are good designs, kind of like the Focal CMS series and the KRK vxt series. Both are excellent designs and the KRK vxt series in particular are an excellent value. I've used PMC stuff too, and their transmission line technology is impressive. But it's not the last word in speaker design by any stretch of the imagination. I don't think it's a sound argument, nor is it fair, to suggest that they are automatically superior to any ported design.

To the O.P.

Have a look at THIS review in Pro Audio Review of several, small ported speaker systems that are considered useful. Maybe you'll get a more reasonable perspective then that of the apparent PMC fan club.

(Nothing against PMC. They are an excellent company, with excellent products that I'm comfortable recommending to anyone. I just don't like the implications of this thread.)

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MIRRORMIX STUDIO
blog

Quote SecretSam:

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...The Adam speakers used to get good comments. Are they out of fashion now ?

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Not really, but this thread could be used to show you how ridiculous peoples opinions can be. ADAM makes some fine speakers for use as reference tools if you like their sound characteristics. But on this thread it's a PMC love fest. Not really a problem. It just means you need to read between the lines a little. In recent times ADAM has become less of a "in" thing to say you own.

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MIRRORMIX STUDIO
blog

Quote EnlightenedHand:

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But on this thread it's a PMC love fest.

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Come on Liz, thats not true. ONE person suggested them, and it's a 'love fest' ? Another person asked a question relating to them, to which I answered. But neither of those 2 posts constitute a love fest either.
I'll stick my hand up and say they are great boxes, sure. But i'll also admit that there are plenty of other good ones to choose from too.

I think a bigger problem with these type of "What monitor?" threads is the inevitable "Get acoustic treatment!" responses.. Ugh..... It is an answer to a question that was not asked. But for arguments sake, lets just say "Yes, that is important too" Then why are these same people not for example, also posting in the synth section here every time someone asks about a new synth, with "Get keyboard lessons first!" Well, erm, yes, that would make it sound better perhaps, but again, it's an answer to a question that was never asked. Anyway, I digress! Pet hate rant over.. Happy Friday 'n stuff..


Paul

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Paul

Quote ~Paul:

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Quote EnlightenedHand:

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But on this thread it's a PMC love fest.

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Come on Liz, thats not true. ONE person suggested them, and it's a 'love fest' ? Another person asked a question relating to them, to which I answered. But neither of those 2 posts constitute a love fest either.
I'll stick my hand up and say they are great boxes, sure. But i'll also admit that there are plenty of other good ones to choose from too.

I think a bigger problem with these type of "What monitor?" threads is the inevitable "Get acoustic treatment!" responses.. Ugh..... It is an answer to a question that was not asked. But for arguments sake, lets just say "Yes, that is important too" Then why are these same people not for example, also posting in the synth section here every time someone asks about a new synth, with "Get keyboard lessons first!" Well, erm, yes, that would make it sound better perhaps, but again, it's an answer to a question that was never asked. Anyway, I digress! Pet hate rant over.. Happy Friday 'n stuff..


Paul

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Dear Paul

As you've taken a somewhat intemperate side-swipe at me in your post I'd like to respond.

I used to be of the "I know my speakers and my room; who needs acoustic treatment?" school (not that I'm suggesting that's your position) until I did some rudimentary experiments with duvets etc. It's not an overstatement to say I was shocked at the changes.

So when people suggest that they're going to spend considerable sums of money on new speakers, surely it's legitimate to seek to help them get the full potential from ANY speakers by suggesting that they spend a small fraction of the price of those speakers on improving room acosutics?

I won't use any of the countless analogies that spring to mind, but is it really unreasonable in a forum that seeks to offer advice to suggest from personal experience that there are other factors that also ought to be considered?

Best wishes. Mike Stranks

Paul baby. Synth thingy analogy is not a funky one m8.

Dude's got Truths. As Martin suggested, and a good cost effective suggestion it is, if the room is treated then the Truths might turn out to be fine.

I am always one of the first to comment on acoustic treatment because it really is the number one priority when auditioning mixes and even more so in this instance as the bass response in house music is critical.

Any other advice on what monitors to get becomes moot if the room is not treated.

But hey, Friday and grumpiness go hand in hand m8.



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Samplecraze
Stretch That Note