"I consider it to be an artist's duty never to give up, for laziness is a very strong human trait. Nothing is worse for the artist than to submit to it. Nor should he wait for inspiration... she presents herself to those who summon her." - Tchaikovsky

Quote James101:

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"I consider it to be an artist's duty never to give up, for laziness is a very strong human trait. Nothing is worse for the artist than to submit to it. Nor should he wait for inspiration... she presents herself to those who summon her." - Tchaikovsky

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Indeed - it's the old 1% inspiration, 99% perspiration angle. Never wait for inspiration before going into the studio, just get in there.

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http://anotherfineday.bandcamp.com/ http://anotherfineday.co.uk http://apollomusic.co.uk

But on the other hand it is a virtue to know/accept/realise when you're flogging a dead horse.

....like this thread!!??

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My head hurts!

Quote Neil C:

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But on the other hand it is a virtue to know/accept/realise when you're flogging a dead horse.

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Wow, what a great idea for a song.

Must...

fly...

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Ohm's Law states, "Your PA isn't as powerful as you think it is".

Last year I wrote over a hundred pieces of music. This year I've written 5 pieces... So, yeah creating output is a discipline. It's like practicing creativity.

But this year is all about learning sets for gigs for me. I'm gigging in 3 musical situations...

I'm a huge fan of the Russian composers. And Tchaikovsky is a fav.

Sadly we're unlikely to ever know enough about Tchaikovsky - he carries the unique position of being virtually a saint in Russia, having produced so much of its fine orthodox church music, and being a gay man who died from syphilis caught from a boy prostitute in the docks. As a result his writings have been kept largely secret to protect the public.

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Daniel Davis
Edinburgh Recording Studio Windmill Sound

I agree with the sentiment in the quote however it doesn't mean that we're obliged to go hell for leather at new compositions on a daily basis.
If you summon the muse she will present herself but unless you're diligent she'll be a semi literate slapper wearing hoop earnings and a tracksuit.
Generally I allow ideas to accumulate (I save them to my phone) then write them all down and try to cobble something out of them.
If I'm writing to order though I sit down with the music, play it through a couple of times until I have a rough melody, and free associate phrases to that melody until I'm bemused.

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http://soundcloud.com/anthony-wall/sets/audio-reel
http://songsforvoiceandpiano.com/

Well, I like hoop earrings and you can always get a tracksuit off. What that means in terms of musical inspiration, I'm not so sure, but I know I've written pieces that are the musical equivalent of cheap and tarty. They're my popular ones ... There must be a musical equivalent of big knockers.

Quote Octopussy:

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Last year I wrote over a hundred pieces of music. This year I've written 5 pieces... So, yeah creating output is a discipline. It's like practicing creativity.

But this year is all about learning sets for gigs for me. I'm gigging in 3 musical situations...

I'm a huge fan of the Russian composers. And Tchaikovsky is a fav.

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Is there any chance that those 5 are better than any of the 100 ?

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I've got rhythm, I ain't got pitch

Being old has it's advantages! It means that my taste and benchmarks are well established. And so writing all those pieces was a chance to write in different styles from Drum n' Bass, Prog, Metal, String Ensemble to experimental collages of noise.

The writing this year has been a mixture of writing out the things I hear in my minds ear and having directed writing got the development and changes in style from my main band.

But to answer your question aspects of the new pieces where achieved more easily and quickly and I feel like I'm able to write more involved and complex compositions whilst retaining clarity and presenting the hooks. Hmm what I'm trying to achieve is for the music to communicate and the audience decides or shows me whether I'm on the right path.

I guess living as a practitioner of composition every day for extended periods strengthens your ability to complete tasks, build complementary ideas quickly and to identify and decern the ideas you want to keep or replace in the search for satisfactory results.

Quote Daniel Davis:

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Sadly we're unlikely to ever know enough about Tchaikovsky - he carries the unique position of being virtually a saint in Russia, having produced so much of its fine orthodox church music, and being a gay man who died from syphilis caught from a boy prostitute in the docks. As a result his writings have been kept largely secret to protect the public.

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I thought he died of cholera.

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Ohm's Law states, "Your PA isn't as powerful as you think it is".

Quote shufflebeat:

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Quote Daniel Davis:

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Sadly we're unlikely to ever know enough about Tchaikovsky - he carries the unique position of being virtually a saint in Russia, having produced so much of its fine orthodox church music, and being a gay man who died from syphilis caught from a boy prostitute in the docks. As a result his writings have been kept largely secret to protect the public.

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I thought he died of cholera.

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Me too. I'm sure I read he drank water knowingly from an unsafe source = suicide.

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http://piethaag.bandcamp.com/

Quote Soundseed:

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Me too. I'm sure I read he drank water knowingly from an unsafe source = suicide.

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Well that's the Ken Russell version, and as we all know Ken Russell's was meticulous in his historical accuracy. I still have very fond memories of the scene in Lisztomania where Liszt attacks an electric-guitar-playing Frankenstein's monster dressed as Hitler (the monster, not Liszt) with an aircraft made from giant organ pipes, each one containing a naked lady. Gives a whole new outlook on musical history.

To return to the plot. My partner, the composer of the pair of us, maintains a daybook where she writes down any tunes that come to her. Subsequently if work comes in then she has a resource she can find an appropriate tune to work with.

CC

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Put the fun back into dysfunctional.
Mr Punch's Studio

Quote Soundseed:

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Me too. I'm sure I read he drank water knowingly from an unsafe source = suicide.

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Although he did try once to drown himself in the Volga, i dont think his death was suicide. He had just completed a successful tour of the US, premiered his 6th and had everything to live for.
He was one of my favourites when i was a child.

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.. is this thing on?

Well, I'll stick my neck out

Some of my best ideas have come quite unbidden at around 3am. I have to do something with these immediately or they are gone forever.

Having said that, there was only one tune I never had to do anything with after a first recording.

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It wasn't me!
(Well, actually, it probably was)

Can just imagine Tchaikovsky's mom... give it over, you'll never make a penny out of that silly piano thing, playing the same thing over and over

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www.dragonlogos.co.uk

Quote Folderol:

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Some of my best ideas have come quite unbidden at around 3am. I have to do something with these immediately or they are gone forever.

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Did you see "Acoustic at the BBC" on BBC4 last night? Amongst the various gems was Keith Richards explaining how he came to write "Satisfaction". Apparently the riff came to him in the middle of the night when he was asleep or dozing, he picked up the acoustic guitar that was by his bed, strummed it out and went back to sleep (probably helped by imagining counting vast amounts of pound notes that were about to come his way.....).

There was also on the same programme some great footage of a young lad called James Page playing skiffle. Dunno what happened to him, he looked half handy....

Great discussion!

Per Tchaikovsky, there's a few glitches with that summoning. First (& revealing of my mystical side ), setting up a summoning ritual is FAR more than just reading out an invocation. You have to be prepared in mind & body & spirit, often with much meditation & fasting.

And any fool can summon the Muse, & even get Her to appear... then be unable to recognise She's arrived. Or, so doing, be unable to gain anything useful from the meeting.

Years back, I participated in a discussion of musicians & artists. In my turn, I said that, as a writer, I find the distractions of the mundane world make it harder to get back into the groove. When I get some time for the keyboard, I may have to free-associate for an hour or more, just to "scrape the crap out." What comes initially is often trite, obvious, derivative. Much the same happens when I sit down to focus on the guitar or piano.

So, IME at least, I'd have to say there's a marked need for persistence & discipline, so long as I'm selling my soul to a day-job. YMMV

Quote Tony Raven:

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Great discussion!



So, IME at least, I'd have to say there's a marked need for persistence & discipline, so long as I'm selling my soul to a day-job. YMMV

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first off, you're not selling your soul, you're surviving... if it helps, envision yourself leaving the house for work with small leaf coverings and a spear in your hand screaming hunting chants...

anyways...

i found she didn't like coming around much when i had a day job... of course that may have been my inexperience in summoning her, however, i tend to look at it a bit differently... it isn't about summoning or some ritual, it's about freeing yourself and creating the atmosphere she desires... it's about leaving yourself open and ready to accept her at any time and to never be upset over when and where she decides to appear... she often likes to come around when i'm in the car, which to some is inconvenient and they get upset, and to those few passing me on the highway, probably a little concerning as i swerve around illegibly writing on a notepad, but to me, i'll take her anytime and anyplace, she is always welcome... i've ducked out of parties or gatherings without me saying anything to anyone, no one knowing, because she decided to come calling then... i don't argue with her, but you bet i keep her on her toes, and knees

Persistence and discipline is extremely important, but has nothing to do with her... sometimes getting away and relaxing is the best thing to do, so long as it doesn't eat you away thinking you're being lazy...

a good book that has a lot to do with the initial premise of the thread is the War of Art, great read... i found it didn't say anything i didn't know, but was delivered in a different way that helped some stuff get through a little better...

as far as the distractions of the mundane World, well, live in la la land and create your own World, sure works for me...

Wise words, & reassuring.

The job was okay for four years. I work in heavy industry, helping build city transit buses. I'm quite good at tasks in general, & I could almost do my work from muscle-memory reflex, to a very high standard. More often than not, I'd head home ready to create something, having hardly used my brain all day.

Two months ago, they suddenly shifted me to the "finish line," where I'm one of a handful of generalists, tasked with (1) ferreting out any previously undetected problems & (2) figuring how to fix 'em. Turns out I'm quite good at it, & my skill's so appreciated they now work me 50-60 hrs/wk. I leave there exhausted mentally & physically.

This site's an intellectual highlight of my day -- how sad is that?

I'm certain it'll get better as I adapt, & at least the pay's good, but my Muse has been occupied elsewhere since June. But it's pleasant to hear an occasional "it'll get better"!!

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resident troublemaker, http://forum.frugalguitarist.com/

Quote ConcertinaChap:

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Quote Soundseed:

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Me too. I'm sure I read he drank water knowingly from an unsafe source = suicide.

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Well that's the Ken Russell version, and as we all know Ken Russell's was meticulous in his historical accuracy. I still have very fond memories of the scene in Lisztomania where Liszt attacks an electric-guitar-playing Frankenstein's monster dressed as Hitler (the monster, not Liszt) with an aircraft made from giant organ pipes, each one containing a naked lady. Gives a whole new outlook on musical history.

CC

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By chance I came across the book I read this in... Edward Garden (D.Mus, FRCO) Tchaikovsky from the Master Musician series, edited by Sir Jack Westrup (Professor Emeritus of Music, Oxford University)... so definitely not Ken Russell.

The book states he drank unboiled water despite specifically being advised of he risk of cholera. The closing movement of the 6th symphony was about "death", and at the time rumours were "rife" about his "suicide". We'll never know but it is plausible.

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www.piethaag.com

yeah, I've never in my life heard that Tchaikovsky died of anything other than cholera.

Reading his letters, he seemed to continually stress and chide himself, trying to get work done - bordering on the neurotic.
When he was trying to complete his first symphony, he got so stressed out he was hallucinating!

It really is high time The Music Lovers came out on BluRay.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~

I'm glad Tchaikovsky kept going - he was doing fantastic stuff all the way, right up until his death. In fact my fave thing of his is Op.72 No.2, a wee ambient satie-like solo piano piece.

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~~~ A weasel hath not such a deal of spleen as you are tossed with! www.feline1.co.uk ~~~

Quote James101:

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"Nor should he wait for inspiration... she presents herself to those who summon her." - Tchaikovsky

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That's bang on that is. When I'm struggling - which is often cos there's only so many choons you can come up with - I lock myself down in the studio and just work through a crap idea. Sometimes something appears that doesn't fit in the crap idea but sows a seed of a better idea. It's like searching for a walnut whip in a big tub of blancmange innit.