I've played around with M/S recently with a borrowed AKG blue line set. Though I didn't particularly like the AKG's, M/S seems to provide consistently good results, providing the acoustic is nice in the first place -- good imaging and captures a lovely bloom when the mid mic is an omni. So I was wondering about buying a mic with a figure of 8 pattern.

What mic would you guys recommend for this? I was wondering about Sennheiser's MKH30, which comes up on ebay occasionally. I noticed the frequency response provides no hf rise so might it sound too dull? Or would it work to use a multi-pattern LDC e.g. AKG 414, beyer MC840 or similar? Would the fact that these mics tend to sound brighter on one side of the figure of 8 be a noticeable problem in M/S?

The MKH30 is a good choice, and one I use a lot myself.

Large diaphgram mics can be used, but their polar patterns are not terribly accurate and so you can get some response irregularities across the image. Usually only noticeable in very critical situations, but not ideal nontheless.

Mics with significantly different responses front and back are not acceptable for any kind of quality stereo MS array.

Hugh

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Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

I have 4 MKH 30's, possibly my fav mike.

Its polar symetrical ,has a RF fed capsule,so immune to damp, paddable by 10dB and has LF roll off.
Ie, bulletproof and an ideal MS companion,especially with other MKH.

Also I use it as a fig 8 stand alone ,and it has ribbon like tendancies , but with hi gain output and a mylar diapraghm, so it can be treated to real life without overdue concern.

Its proximity is truely amazing.

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I am the Walrus.

MKH 30 is what I use for MS as well.

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John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons

If you are thinking about buying one I'd highly recommend hiring one from Richmond Film services. Very cheap to hire, I think they were about £5 per day last time I hired from them. You could even try out the MKH20 and MKH30 combo just to see how it sounds on your guitar before making the purchase.

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www.bradleysteenkamp.com

Indeed renting is usually inexpensive. I rented 2 MKH30 for a Blumlein M/S recording one week-end, and really liked them. The only other figure-8 microphone I tried was the one which is included in the Schoeps Double MS system. It is very good too, but I could not compare it directly with the MKH30.

High end ribbon microphones are another option, but you may have some sensitivity matching problems is the M microphone is a recent condenser microphone.

-j

I use an AKG C422 for MS. Too bad it was discontinued.

Like some others, I really like the MKH30. It's a special mic, and I, too, have occasionally contemplated its almost ribbon like quality. Of course the MKH30 is a very high output mic, and doesn't require nearly as much from a preamp.

The AKG414B/ULS figure 8 pattern is really quite good (much flatter and much more uniform polar pattern than most dual diaphragm mic's), and will get you very precise imaging, along with a very extended low end. The low end of the MKH30 is extended, also, but the effect is totally different. The 414 goes lower, but is less full. Among SD figure 8 mic's, the MKH30 has a much flatter and more extended range, and I find it's polar pattern more pleasing than some others-where other mic's brighten, the MKH30 gracefully attenuates HF. The MKH30 is an exceptionally clean "centered" sounding mic. Highly recommended.

BTW, it depends on what you're recording of course, but the MKH20+30 can be the bomb.

414 gets my vote Never used the MKH30 though...

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PA Hire Surrey
Lighting Hire Surrey

Quote TSH-Tim:

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414 gets my vote Never used the MKH30 though...

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The thing about the 414 is that it's a dual diaphragm microphone using back-to-back cardioids to get a figure-8. The two diaphragms are, of course, physically separated.

The MKH 30 uses a single diaphragm, ope at both sides and is a true fig-8 in the same way that a ribbon mic is.

There are only a very few single-diaphragm condenser fig-8s on the market - these are the ones I know of:-

Sennheiser MKH 30
Neumann KM 120
Neumann KM 120-A and KM 120-D
Schoeps MK 8
MBHO MBC KA 800 A
Ambient ATE 208

Both the Sennheiser and Neumann have truly symmetrical polar patterns both front and rear.

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John - Sound-Link ProAudio
President - Federation Internationale des Chasseurs de Sons