Main Forums >> PC Music
        Print Thread

Pages: 1
grab



Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2845
Loc: Cambridge, UK
Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new
      #946665 - 12/10/11 10:14 AM
My desktop PC has been suffering bitrot for some time, and last month WinXP finally turned up its toes, so it was time for a reinstall. My data lives on a separate partition (and is backed up externally) so I could just wipe the C: partition and start over from clean.

Trouble is, my WinXP install is an ancient OEM version. Being OEM, each time I need to reinstall on new hardware, I need to ring up MS and beg for an activation code. And being ancient, it also takes forever to get all the updates. This is pre-SP1, so that's a lot of updates! I don't have any old hardware or software any more, so I decided to bite the bullet and buy Windows 7. Word was that it was a bit slower than WinXP but not seriously so.

Bad mistake. See, my PC is a single-core Sempron 2800 (running at 1.6GHz) with half a gig of RAM. The poor thing now takes an eternity to start up. With nothing at all happening, 10% of the processor is being used - what by, I have absolutely no idea. Just resizing a Windows Explorer window takes 40% of the processor. Playing back a WAV file with nothing else happening at all frequently gets stutters during playback. I haven't tried running Reaper yet, but I have no great hopes for it playing ball any more.

Deep unf*ckingbridled joy. Not.

No constructive reason for posting this, I'm afraid, except to vent a bit, and perhaps to warn anyone with lower-spec machines to stick with WinXP.

Edit: I know, I know, upgrade RAM. I will do. Just a PITA to need hardware upgrades to what was a perfectly useable PC.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Frederick



Joined: 12/12/10
Posts: 72
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #946670 - 12/10/11 10:31 AM
there is a way to strip an xp install of all it's hardware specific information prior to making an image file, so you can have a universal image file (from memory this wrecks your current install, so you will need an image of that with all its drivers etc).

I used to have books on this, but they're gone, perhaps try a Microsoft engineers forum...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #946671 - 12/10/11 10:32 AM
Quote grab:

My desktop PC has been suffering bitrot for some time, and last month WinXP finally turned up its toes, so it was time for a reinstall. My data lives on a separate partition (and is backed up externally) so I could just wipe the C: partition and start over from clean.

Trouble is, my WinXP install is an ancient OEM version. Being OEM, each time I need to reinstall on new hardware, I need to ring up MS and beg for an activation code. And being ancient, it also takes forever to get all the updates. This is pre-SP1, so that's a lot of updates! I don't have any old hardware or software any more, so I decided to bite the bullet and buy Windows 7. Word was that it was a bit slower than WinXP but not seriously so.

Bad mistake. See, my PC is a single-core Sempron 2800 (running at 1.6GHz) with half a gig of RAM. The poor thing now takes an eternity to start up. With nothing at all happening, 10% of the processor is being used - what by, I have absolutely no idea. Just resizing a Windows Explorer window takes 40% of the processor. Playing back a WAV file with nothing else happening at all frequently gets stutters during playback. I haven't tried running Reaper yet, but I have no great hopes for it playing ball any more.

Deep unf*ckingbridled joy. Not.

No constructive reason for posting this, I'm afraid, except to vent a bit, and perhaps to warn anyone with lower-spec machines to stick with WinXP.




That PC is well behind the times. Windows 7 isn't designed to work with single core processors or half a gig of ram. I'm not sure what graphics card you have, but its very likely a museum piece also.

Since you have invested in Windows 7 perhaps its time to spend a few hundred quid and get something modern.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Martin WalkerModerator
Watcher Of The Skies


Joined: 28/02/01
Posts: 17213
Loc: Cornwall, UK
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: johnny h]
      #946673 - 12/10/11 10:48 AM
Quote johnny h:

That PC is well behind the times. Windows 7 isn't designed to work with single core processors or half a gig of ram. I'm not sure what graphics card you have, but its very likely a museum piece also.

Since you have invested in Windows 7 perhaps its time to spend a few hundred quid and get something modern.




I tend to agree with johnny on this occasion

Windows 7 does expect hardware a little more recent than you have, and with an elderly PC I'd stick with an operating system of similar vintage if at all possible.


Martin

--------------------
YewTreeMagic


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Parco



Joined: 25/02/10
Posts: 317
Loc: Hong Kong
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #946785 - 12/10/11 05:36 PM
Please detailly list the hardware configs of your windows 7 computer before everything

--------------------
Cubase 5.1 + Foobar2000 -> ASIO + MMCSS + Windows7 -> SIIG TI chips 1394 PCIe -> Echo AudioFire 4 -> HH MX250 + Wharf Delta70
A native USA style contemporary R&B artist in HongKong


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 5350
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #946798 - 12/10/11 07:18 PM
On the old computer, I suggest you install XP one final time, go through the updates, and then take a backup image of the C: drive. Next time, restoration will be a 10-minute job! If the machine's sufficient for what you need to do on it, fine. Check the price (and feasibility) of a RAM upgrade to 1GB. I wouldn't throw TOO much money at this old war-horse, but if it's cheap, go for it.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Exalted Wombat]
      #946871 - 13/10/11 08:40 AM
Quote Exalted Wombat:

On the old computer, I suggest you install XP one final time, go through the updates, and then take a backup image of the C: drive. Next time, restoration will be a 10-minute job! If the machine's sufficient for what you need to do on it, fine. Check the price (and feasibility) of a RAM upgrade to 1GB. I wouldn't throw TOO much money at this old war-horse, but if it's cheap, go for it.




This will take hours and you will still have a really old, slow machine with tiring hard drives and an old power supply. Time to get the credit card out.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #946877 - 13/10/11 09:10 AM
Hi Grab,
I have some odd sticks of ram about the place so PM me and I give you the numbers, you are welcome to them if they work, I did not buy them!

I agree with the others, time to get a new pc but keeping the old one running on XP is a very good idea. You can network it to the new pc and amongst other things fit a monster hard drive (SATA if you can but it might be even too old for that!) and use that as a "backup, backup" for your music data on the newbey.Plus the clunker can run infernalnet and other office duties.

You say XP takes a while to load back onto the pc? Wait till you have to install W7 from recovery discs!

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #946895 - 13/10/11 09:58 AM
Quote ef37a:

Hi Grab,
I have some odd sticks of ram about the place so PM me and I give you the numbers, you are welcome to them if they work, I did not buy them!

I agree with the others, time to get a new pc but keeping the old one running on XP is a very good idea. You can network it to the new pc and amongst other things fit a monster hard drive (SATA if you can but it might be even too old for that!) and use that as a "backup, backup" for your music data on the newbey.Plus the clunker can run infernalnet and other office duties.

You say XP takes a while to load back onto the pc? Wait till you have to install W7 from recovery discs!

Dave.




I disagree that its worth keeping it running. These old PCs aren't particularly light on electricity. Probably better off with a 1tb external drive to cope with backup duties. Uses much less power, is very cheap, portable and looks a lot nicer too!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: johnny h]
      #946900 - 13/10/11 10:15 AM
Johnny,
In the last 3 months I have had 2 usb drives go TsU on me. One I managed to get the data off whilst it was at about -10C!
The OP cannot email and net with a 1TB external drive! Old pcs not electrically "green"? Maybe not in the days of sodding great CRT monitors but I doubt that todays' processors and hard drives pull much less power than ten years ago (the CPU might be more efficient but it is also more powerful, a 1000hp gas turbine is much more efficient than a 90hp Ford Mondeo engine but uses a stack more juice!) look at the bloody cooling plants we need in modern pcs!

Anyway, all that "wasted" heat goes into the room and cuts thy gas bill!

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
grab



Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2845
Loc: Cambridge, UK
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #946926 - 13/10/11 11:36 AM
Thanks Dave - might take you up on that. Can't remember offhand what flavour of DIMM my mobo likes, so need to check that. Equally, I might invest a few quid into general upgradeyness.

Just a shame this happened the very week when the place I'm working for went into administration, so as a contractor I'm not getting paid for September. (I'll probably get something, but it'll be too little and too late.) So need to cut down on consumption generally. Ho hum.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #947092 - 14/10/11 02:18 AM
Quote ef37a:

Johnny,
In the last 3 months I have had 2 usb drives go TsU on me. One I managed to get the data off whilst it was at about -10C!
The OP cannot email and net with a 1TB external drive! Old pcs not electrically "green"? Maybe not in the days of sodding great CRT monitors but I doubt that todays' processors and hard drives pull much less power than ten years ago (the CPU might be more efficient but it is also more powerful, a 1000hp gas turbine is much more efficient than a 90hp Ford Mondeo engine but uses a stack more juice!) look at the bloody cooling plants we need in modern pcs!

Anyway, all that "wasted" heat goes into the room and cuts thy gas bill!

Dave.



I bet your computer junk room is a real hit with the wife on those cold winter nights.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: johnny h]
      #947096 - 14/10/11 06:22 AM
I don't have a "computer junk room" and I do not see that my wife's opinions have any relavence to this discussion or to you?

My point is that computers have got steadily more powerful and thus consume more energy, unlike say a new fridge where the amount of cooling needed per mtr cube has not changed but insulation materials have and so overall you get the same cooling capacity for less overall electrical input.

You only need to look at the sort of power supplies that are now available, 600,850, 1000watts and all the serious gamer kit has to have a bloody fan on it!

Then, junking a working computer (or car!) means that all that plastic and metal and the energy and feedstocks needed to make it is largely wasted in landfill.

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Parco



Joined: 25/02/10
Posts: 317
Loc: Hong Kong
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #947099 - 14/10/11 07:30 AM
Grab don't worry you may just wait for Windows 8 because it just need around 64MB - 128MB memory
http://networkedblogs.com/okRkB

--------------------
Cubase 5.1 + Foobar2000 -> ASIO + MMCSS + Windows7 -> SIIG TI chips 1394 PCIe -> Echo AudioFire 4 -> HH MX250 + Wharf Delta70
A native USA style contemporary R&B artist in HongKong


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Frederick



Joined: 12/12/10
Posts: 72
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! [Re: grab]
      #947107 - 14/10/11 08:35 AM
johnny, your argument that old computers use more energy is flawed, whilst the psu won't be as efficient as a modern one (more wastage to heat), a sempron will pull about the same from the plug at idle as a modern computer (30-60w) and little more at load (probably significantly less than a modern one with it's many cores and high end graphics).

It is actually far less energy efficient to buy a new computer even if it uses less power, because the energy comsumed in transporting/making a computer component will likely never be eclipsed in the lifetime of it's usage.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Frederick]
      #947118 - 14/10/11 09:51 AM
Quite so Frederick, you have encapulated neatly what I, in my clumsy way was trying to put across.

But there is a problem, The Economy Stupid (nothing personal!). If we cease or slow down significantly the manufacture of "new things" the recession will deepen and millions will be thrown out of work worldwide. Then who are we to deny the emerging nations of the luxuries we enjoy (Air conning Africa is a terrifying prospect!)? But on the other hand we are already using more than the resources of one planet!

Governments (those that give a *hit!) and Economists have had over a century to "get it right" and now have the use of some very potent number crunchers but they seem to be no nearer.

One thing I am sure of tho'. Science and technology were not responsible for the mess we are in, no, that was mostly greed and war, but abandoning S&T is not the answer. The bloody tree huggers (mostly in sunny California) will have us all freeze to death.

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
grab



Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2845
Loc: Cambridge, UK
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #947122 - 14/10/11 11:02 AM
Jeez, what have I started?!

My backup strategy is going to be slightly different. Bcos we've got a netbook (in the living room) and the desktop (in my workroom), the network drive will be the master so that we can get at the files from either. So instead of backing up data from the desktop to the network drive, I'll actually be doing it the other way around. Separately I'll also be doing offsite backup when I get a minute to set it up (probably as simple as periodically FTP'ing to a password-protected area on my company hosting which offers unlimited disk space) so I don't really need a "backup backup". Printer's on Ethernet too so I don't need anything as a print server.

I did go through a phase of hoarding old PC kit about 10 years back, and "computer junk room" fairly accurately described my workroom back in about 2003! But I think I broke that habit when I started acquiring instruments though... I'm still not sure which one my wife would rather put up with, bcos at least the PCs don't make noise late at night.

Wombat, you're right that I should take an image once everything's installed. I always mean to do that - and never do! Trouble is that installing everything is usually an iterative process as they're needed, bcos it's no-one's idea of fun. So typically it drags on for bl**dy months, and by the time I've got most of everything on there, I've forgotten about all my good intentions.

Thing is, the hard drive is about 3 years old, so not exactly worn out yet. The graphics card is no-one's idea of sophisticated, but I never play games on it so it shouldn't really need to be. And whilst the thing as a whole definitely ain't super-fast, I'm still not sure it qualifies as a "museum piece", except in terms of RAM. It's certainly no less powerful than netbooks, for instance, and netbooks seem to have no problems with Win7.

Of course new software is likely to assume more processing power available, but my 2000-issue 800MHz AMD Duron still only needed fractions of a percent of CPU on WinXP when idling. As a software engineer, it bugs me that Win7 burns through so much processing power when doing absolutely nothing. I've got damn near everything turned off, so what's it doing in the background that's using all this processing?


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Pete Kaine
Scan Computers


Joined: 10/07/03
Posts: 3497
Loc: Manchester
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #947127 - 14/10/11 11:50 AM
Quote grab:

Jeez, what have I started?!





Not sure, but I've got some popcorn if you fancy some?

Quote grab:


Of course new software is likely to assume more processing power available, but my 2000-issue 800MHz AMD Duron still only needed fractions of a percent of CPU on WinXP when idling. As a software engineer, it bugs me that Win7 burns through so much processing power when doing absolutely nothing. I've got damn near everything turned off, so what's it doing in the background that's using all this processing?




Skynet is here. What you don't realize is that for every windows machine running, the is actuary an evil super computer network based in the ether siphoning off clock cycles from one and all in the biggest distributed network ever seen. Somewhere in the Nevada desert evil robotic clones are being massed produced and will be invading shortly... Please stand by.

(It's been a hard week, can I go home yet?)

--------------------
Check out our currently running, audio creation competition with a huge selection of prizes @ Scan Velocity 2014


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Martin WalkerModerator
Watcher Of The Skies


Joined: 28/02/01
Posts: 17213
Loc: Cornwall, UK
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Pete Kaine]
      #947132 - 14/10/11 12:14 PM
Quote Pete Kaine:

(It's been a hard week, can I go home yet?)




Certainly not! There's another four hours to go yet




Martin

--------------------
YewTreeMagic


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Martin Walker]
      #947146 - 14/10/11 01:21 PM
Quote Martin Walker:

Quote Pete Kaine:

(It's been a hard week, can I go home yet?)




Certainly not! There's another four hours to go yet




Martin




I, can go home when I like! Oh! I already am!

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Frederick]
      #947159 - 14/10/11 02:57 PM
Quote Frederick:

johnny, your argument that old computers use more energy is flawed, whilst the psu won't be as efficient as a modern one (more wastage to heat), a sempron will pull about the same from the plug at idle as a modern computer (30-60w) and little more at load (probably significantly less than a modern one with it's many cores and high end graphics).

It is actually far less energy efficient to buy a new computer even if it uses less power, because the energy comsumed in transporting/making a computer component will likely never be eclipsed in the lifetime of it's usage.




I think you might have misunderstood my argument. I was responding to the guy who suggested using old computers as network computers for backup; I pointed out that its a lot more space and energy efficient to use a small external drive for these purposes.

These days a laptop will do pretty much everything you need - write emails, go on the internet, record albums ...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: johnny h]
      #947160 - 14/10/11 03:16 PM
Johnny,
This (old, heard it even if you didn't say it!)guy is/was not suggesting people go "totting" for old computers! I merely meant that SINCE the OP had an old pc it made sense to use it and ONE good use is as a secondary backup, my point about usb drives being that I have had them fail,twice in 3 months but I have only ever had one internal HDD fail in 6years and that was only days old! If you have ever had serious problems with a pc you will know how vital it is to have a spare!

I think the power/greeness/tree hugging is done and dusted?

Er? And yes, a laptop can do almost everything EXCEPT run a serious music setup!Laps are also I would think even less planet friendly than big jobs? Hard to fix and batteries you know!

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #947179 - 14/10/11 04:20 PM
Quote ef37a:

Johnny,
This (old, heard it even if you didn't say it!)guy is/was not suggesting people go "totting" for old computers! I merely meant that SINCE the OP had an old pc it made sense to use it and ONE good use is as a secondary backup, my point about usb drives being that I have had them fail,twice in 3 months but I have only ever had one internal HDD fail in 6years and that was only days old! If you have ever had serious problems with a pc you will know how vital it is to have a spare!

I think the power/greeness/tree hugging is done and dusted?

Er? And yes, a laptop can do almost everything EXCEPT run a serious music setup!Laps are also I would think even less planet friendly than big jobs? Hard to fix and batteries you know!

Dave.




Its probably different for film composers and people who record bands, but you may be shocked at the big names who use a MBP for their main DAW! Makes sense too ... can make tunes on the plane, in the hotel, get back to the studio and hook it up to the big monitors. Keep a time machine backup and if you lose/break it you will be up and running again in a couple of hours ...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Scramble
active member


Joined: 11/09/02
Posts: 2091
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: johnny h]
      #947188 - 14/10/11 04:40 PM
My new W7 build uses 1.3 Gb of RAM when it's started up and doing nothing!

So even if W7 can adapt to a smaller system by running less stuff (not sure it can do this) and using a hard drive as virtual RAM, 0.5Gb is going to be something of a challenge.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Agharta



Joined: 30/10/04
Posts: 493
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #947193 - 14/10/11 05:06 PM
Quote ef37a:

I doubt that todays' processors and hard drives pull much less power than ten years ago (the CPU might be more efficient but it is also more powerful, a 1000hp gas turbine is much more efficient than a 90hp Ford Mondeo engine but uses a stack more juice!) look at the bloody cooling plants we need in modern pcs!



A modern computer is much more power efficient than a 10 year old PC whether it is at idle, full load or somewhere in-between.
The fact that it is also much more powerful is actually a benefit as it means that it can perform tasks quicker and therefore return to the idle state quicker which is its most power efficient state.
Modern CPUs consume less power and are more powerful so when combined their efficiency is vastly improved; well at least for Intel.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Agharta]
      #947231 - 14/10/11 08:42 PM
Woah! You will have to give me some numbers on that one Agharta!

It is the total energy comsumption over time that matters (kilowatt HOURS)so a few watts for a long time or a lot for a short one might end up as the same amount of CO2 at the powerstation, and the keepers of said station would far rather you had a steady demand anyway.

And those kW power supplies and kickarse cooling systems are just there for the once in a decade time that the whole shebang has to work its bits off for an hour or so? But we are talking music applications here, not the CPU popping up to crunch your VAT then going back to sleep. Music systems work at the top end of the computers power capability (why laptops screw ya!) or are you suggesting that musicians buy Deep Blue machines and use 1% of them so that they never kick in full welly?

I could well have all that last wrong, not seen the numbers yet but there is still Fredericks' point that it is very unlikely that the energy and resources used in making a new pc will ever be recouped by the (possible) energy savings.

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
ef37a



Joined: 29/05/06
Posts: 6375
Loc: northampton uk
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #947235 - 14/10/11 08:55 PM
http://www.techspot.com/review/452-amd-bulldozer-fx-cpus/

Yeah, looks like you could run that for days on a couple of PP3s.

Dave.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
johnny h



Joined: 24/07/06
Posts: 3093
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: ef37a]
      #947246 - 14/10/11 10:56 PM
Quote ef37a:

Woah! You will have to give me some numbers on that one Agharta!

It is the total energy comsumption over time that matters (kilowatt HOURS)so a few watts for a long time or a lot for a short one might end up as the same amount of CO2 at the powerstation, and the keepers of said station would far rather you had a steady demand anyway.

And those kW power supplies and kickarse cooling systems are just there for the once in a decade time that the whole shebang has to work its bits off for an hour or so? But we are talking music applications here, not the CPU popping up to crunch your VAT then going back to sleep. Music systems work at the top end of the computers power capability (why laptops screw ya!) or are you suggesting that musicians buy Deep Blue machines and use 1% of them so that they never kick in full welly?

I could well have all that last wrong, not seen the numbers yet but there is still Fredericks' point that it is very unlikely that the energy and resources used in making a new pc will ever be recouped by the (possible) energy savings.

Dave.




Pick whichever appeals to you the most





Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 5350
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Scramble]
      #947254 - 15/10/11 12:16 AM
Quote Scramble:

My new W7 build uses 1.3 Gb of RAM when it's started up and doing nothing!





Uses? Or reserves?

But yes, computing power and RAM are cheap these days, and modern operating systems aren't designed to skimp on using them. Why should they?


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Scramble
active member


Joined: 11/09/02
Posts: 2091
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Exalted Wombat]
      #947277 - 15/10/11 09:23 AM
Uses (according to the Resource Monitor).


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Exalted Wombat



Joined: 06/02/10
Posts: 5350
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Scramble]
      #947318 - 15/10/11 04:06 PM
Quote Scramble:

Uses (according to the Resource Monitor).




Doesn't nesessarily follow.

Anyway, what's the use of dead RAM? Every available byte should be used for caching the code you might want next, until the system actuaslly NEEDS that space.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Scramble
active member


Joined: 11/09/02
Posts: 2091
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Exalted Wombat]
      #947345 - 15/10/11 09:30 PM
EW, why are you talking as though I'm some advocate of OS's using minimal RAM? I never said anything about that issue.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Pete Kaine
Scan Computers


Joined: 10/07/03
Posts: 3497
Loc: Manchester
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: Scramble]
      #947493 - 17/10/11 09:29 AM
EW is making a valid point through.

XP was always designed to move data to the swap file in order to keep it memory usage light, even to the point where it would swap out pretty much half a gig at start up just to ensure it would run on older machines with only 512MB of memory.... which on an older machine was fine, but it was just a PITA when you were running a machine with 2GB+ and you knew you had the resources to play with. That was why a lot of power users would just remove the swap file to get speed gains, althrough even then the was bit's of code that would still load and run from drive space rather than hard memory.

Win7 was designed from the ground up to use all the physcial memory it can get it's hands on, and it's one of the primary reasons it feels faster compared with Vista. The point I assume EW was trying to drive home is that Win7 really shouldn't be installed on older machines as they just can not cope with the requirements needed to make the OS run smoothly.

--------------------
Check out our currently running, audio creation competition with a huge selection of prizes @ Scan Velocity 2014


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Dee
member


Joined: 06/02/04
Posts: 421
Loc: IRELAND
Re: Windows 7 - SLOOOOOOWWW!! new [Re: grab]
      #947537 - 17/10/11 12:46 PM
Tetchy time on SOS

I see both sides of the argument. I've had got rid of a few PCs over the last few years and if I had the space I'd have kept one at least as an additional backup. I don't have the space though so I have 2x2tb hard drives and have setup as below.....

What I have done a bit of a rejig at home. My main "lets do everything" PC is now my music only PC - i7, 12gb ram - wifes laptop has now been claimed for surfing, downloading (both connected to 40" monitor) and my netbook is floating around the house now and I don't shout if Mrs Dee wants to use it. Simples

--------------------
Hail Hail and up the VSTs


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Pages: 1

Rate this thread

Jump to

Extra Information
1 registered and 8 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  David Etheridge, James Perrett, zenguitar, Martin Walker, Forum Admin, Hugh Robjohns, Zukan, Frank Eleveld, Will Betts,  
Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled
Rating:
Thread views: 8060

May 2014
On sale now at main newsagents and bookstores (or buy direct from the
SOS Web Shop)
SOS current Print Magazine: click here for FULL Contents list
Click image for May 2014
DAW Tips from SOS

 

Home | Search | News | Current Issue | Tablet Mag | Articles | Forum | Subscribe | Shop | Readers Ads

Advertise | Information | Digital Editions | Privacy Policy | Support | Login Help

 

Email: Contact SOS

Telephone: +44 (0)1954 789888

Fax: +44 (0)1954 789895

Registered Office: Media House, Trafalgar Way, Bar Hill, Cambridge, CB23 8SQ, United Kingdom.

Sound On Sound Ltd is registered in England and Wales.

Company number: 3015516 VAT number: GB 638 5307 26

         

All contents copyright © SOS Publications Group and/or its licensors, 1985-2014. All rights reserved.
The contents of this article are subject to worldwide copyright protection and reproduction in whole or part, whether mechanical or electronic, is expressly forbidden without the prior written consent of the Publishers. Great care has been taken to ensure accuracy in the preparation of this article but neither Sound On Sound Limited nor the publishers can be held responsible for its contents. The views expressed are those of the contributors and not necessarily those of the publishers.

Web site designed & maintained by PB Associates | SOS | Relative Media