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christianmurphy



Joined: 25/01/08
Posts: 321
Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new
      #950284 - 30/10/11 12:51 PM
Looking for something to help with feedback on my monitors. Generally just the main vocal monitor, so a mono unit would be okay, but an extra channel is always handy! I know the behringer stuff is uber cheap and not exactly built to last, but how bad can a graphic eq be?

They make the automatic ones sound great in the blurb, but I just can't see how a unit around the £100 mark could sort out such a pain in the a$$ that easy?

Something like the FBQ6200, looks like it would work nicely for me. Ring out the speakers and notch out the frequencies.

Christian.


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aekoi
active member


Joined: 26/06/02
Posts: 1165
Loc: Not of this Earth
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950302 - 30/10/11 02:31 PM
I dont use automatic feedback suppressors, but heres some ideas -

Second hand Yamaha Q series often go for around £100 on ebay, if you keep an eye out you should be able to grab one for even less. Download the Simple Feedback Trainer (free I think) and train your ears. Works for me


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Guy Johnson



Joined: 02/05/03
Posts: 4404
Loc: North Pembrokeshire
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950331 - 30/10/11 06:43 PM
The Behringer anti-feedback units do the job well, but they can latch onto non-feedback stuff. However, carefully set-up, they are very useful.

You can also use a few of their EQs to help with any tonal problems you monitor(s) may have, with some gentle EQ and a couple of notches, and assign these permanently — a handy feature.

As these boxes are cheap, to me it's a no-brainer. the ULTRACURVE PRO DEQ2496 seems to be my units upgraded on a very quick search.

--------------------
Facebok Page for acoustic music PA-ing in smaller venues


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turtles



Joined: 22/10/04
Posts: 244
Loc: Notts, mostly.
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950333 - 30/10/11 07:02 PM
The key comment above is 'carefully set up'.

Two things guaranteed to mess up a mix at an inopportune time, are a badly set up compressor and a badly set up feedback destroyer. Put the two together, and you have a recipe for disaster.

If you have time, a half decent 31band manual eq across your monitor mixes will make things a lot easier on the ear.

The problem I've found with feedback destroyers left on auto is that they notch out one, then another frequency; then things get a little louder, and the destroyer starts 'hunting' frequencies, never quite controlling them but at the same time scooping the guts out of the signal. Alternatively, they can lock onto a repetitive signal ( synth pads are a particlar pain) and knock them out of the monitors.


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Bob Bickerton
active member


Joined: 20/12/02
Posts: 3152
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950351 - 30/10/11 08:53 PM
I used the Behringer Feedback Destroyer units in the past, but never trusted them to run automatically, so having set them up would lock them down, so to speak.

These days I find it much easier and more secure to use a 31 band graphic.

Also my experience with Behringer stuff is that it does fail, so best to get something that's likely to last awhile.

Bob

--------------------
www.bickerton.co.nz


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TSH-Tim



Joined: 21/02/11
Posts: 828
Loc: Guildford
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950364 - 30/10/11 09:41 PM
I found the problem with these ''Feedback Destroyers'' is by the time have have sort of sorted out your problems your not left with any frequencies anyway lol

31 band EQ in the rack or if you have some sort of system controller in the rack like an XTA use this rather than adding more kit into the chain

Good luck

--------------------
PA Hire Surrey
Lighting Hire Surrey


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christianmurphy



Joined: 25/01/08
Posts: 321
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950405 - 31/10/11 09:49 AM
Yup kinda what I was thinking. The FBQ6200 is actually a 31 band EQ. The only 'feedback' part about it, is each of the frequency faders have a small light in, which shines bright red if it is the offending frequency when feedback occurs. Generally makes ringing out your speakers a lot quicker and easier by the looks of things. My only concern was the reliability of the units, but for two channels of 31 band eq with a built in limiter (if i needed it...), and a mono subwoofer output if my crossover ever decides to fail, all for about 130 quid, I don't think there's anything to moan about


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Guy Johnson



Joined: 02/05/03
Posts: 4404
Loc: North Pembrokeshire
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: TSH-Tim]
      #950410 - 31/10/11 10:15 AM
Quote TSH-Tim:

I found the problem with these ''Feedback Destroyers'' is by the time have have sort of sorted out your problems your not left with any frequencies anyway lol

*snip*

Good luck




... Only if forced to do too much, especially with wide notches ...

--------------------
Facebok Page for acoustic music PA-ing in smaller venues


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grab



Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2931
Loc: Cambridge, UK
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950414 - 31/10/11 10:34 AM
I've got the Behringer FBQ3102. Will shortly upgrade it, but it works OK. As usual with Behringer kit, the controls are a bit fragile, so it needs racking and treating carefully. Buying again though, I'd probably go for something a bit better like dbx - their 2x31 EQs start at £160ish which isn't a significant extra for better build quality.

I personally don't find the red lights are much use. If you wait to look at the lights, it's already too far gone! But generally using the regular notching-out routine with EQ works OK.

I've also got an Ultracurve DEQ2496. Frankly it doesn't get much use. It seems great to have all these features in one box, but actually it's a lot less useful controlling an EQ through a buttons-and-menus interface than just fiddling the mini-faders.


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DavidDaly



Joined: 11/09/09
Posts: 17
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950422 - 31/10/11 11:03 AM
I used a Behringer feedback destroyer for a time. It worked as described and never went wrong for me in 3 years of gigging. Agree with all previous comments that it shouldn't be left on automatic. Also using it to "ring out" a system prior to a performance sounds good in theory but in practice makes a lot of unpleasant noise that is not always appreciated. Then the vocalist moves his mic during the show and what you had setup is no longer necesarily correct!

When we upgraded our monitors and mics our feedback problems almost completely disappeared and I sold the feedback destroyer as we no longer needed it. When issues do arrise now it is normally only when there are a lot of reflections (I.e. we are playing in a box!). mostly careful monitor and mic positioning resolves these.

If you really are getting feedback issues on just a single mic and monitor (which it sounded like might be the case from your post) then I would consider checking position of monitor and mic, upgrading the monitor and/or upgrading the mic. Also worth considering is what level you are monitoring at - quieter always being less prone to feedback and better for your hearing!


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shufflebeat



Joined: 09/12/07
Posts: 3289
Loc: Manchester, UK
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #950570 - 31/10/11 10:54 PM
This discussion crops up regularly.

I find the key to making the Behringer box work effectively is to make sure there's a decent level going into it to trigger the filters. This may require turning your (post Behringer box) amp down temporarily so you can push the aux send up to drive the Behrry's inputs properly.

I have a routine which works for me:

Set filter 1 to 'single shot' (auto)
Raise monitor level to induce ringing (see above)
When filter triggers and kills ringing check how much cut it has applied then convert 'single shot' to 'PA' (see manual)
If the filter automatically cut -6db then I'd extend that to -18db
'Save' and do it again with filter 2.

I usually find myself using 3/4 filters per channel. I'm making this sound much more complicated than it is. It's dead easy, quick and reliable.

As a matter of interest I use filters 10, 11, 12 for broad sweep, gentle cuts to remove any obvious hotspots before the above routine.

In my experience the reliability of any piece of Behringer kit is inversely proportional to the number of switches and faders/knobs it has.

--------------------
Onward and outward


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Scatamonky



Joined: 21/02/12
Posts: 6
Re: Feedback destroyers/eliminators/graphic EQs new [Re: christianmurphy]
      #971544 - 22/02/12 01:50 AM
Ive been using an FBQ 3102 for over 3 years now, some of the sliders have disentegrated but the unit still works great and is quick and easy to use to manually notch out the offending frequencies. If it ever dies I will probably just buy another one. (looks good too when the band is playing...ooh, flashy!)

--------------------
"Play one the drummer knows!"


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