The government's UK copyright law site outlines the IPO and Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, the principal legislation covering intellectual property rights in the United Kingdom and the work to which it applies.

Main Forums >> Music Business
        Print Thread

Pages: 1
colin s



Joined: 16/05/09
Posts: 456
who need mucisians!
      #956082 - 29/11/11 09:01 AM
hi guys

just got a email for this awesome new service (as i know alot of others on here did too) - bascially it does away with composes completely! all you do is upload a video and viola!! it puts the music to you're video automatically! i think at long last this puts an end to greedy composes asking for 300-500 quid (and over!) for bespoke music for 60 min docs and does away with recent greedy demands for 'demo fees' of £100 (and more in some cases)

as someone trying very hard to break into the idnustry myself i have found this to be one of the main hurdles so it is refrshing to see a company with foresight - their tagline 'do we still need musisicns' - seen at the end of there promo - shows there a company interested in the future and not the past and it kind of gives us hope in the power of technologogy - the future really is in safe hands with guys like these

its really clever - say you upload a video well it reconizes whats actually on it and just selects a fitting piece of music to acconmapy it - genius or what!??!

check it out and you can even try it for free - its awesome!

http://juke-bot.com/

i might email them and aks if they want to sign me up as i am off this week

--------------------
www.colinskuttler.com


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Jonnypopisical



Joined: 16/07/05
Posts: 1151
Loc: Oakham
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956089 - 29/11/11 09:23 AM
Well the music is rubbish but this looks like a spoof / joke

JP

--------------------
Mac Pro, Logic Pro, lots of software and 17 hard drives!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
The_Big_Piano_Player
active member


Joined: 13/05/04
Posts: 1668
Loc: Lincolnshire
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: Jonnypopisical]
      #956110 - 29/11/11 10:46 AM
Oh well, the money Colin spent on backing, he saved on spell checkers.

--------------------
Touch & Go


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
BJG145



Joined: 06/08/05
Posts: 3411
Loc: Norwich UK
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956151 - 29/11/11 01:09 PM
Great clip. I just wound someone up a treat with that.


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
artzmusic



Joined: 20/05/11
Posts: 171
Loc: usa
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956152 - 29/11/11 01:11 PM
Similarly, I have absolutely no need for the lowly farmer, since I can get all my food prepackaged at a modern grocery.

Rick


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Gone To Lunch
active member


Joined: 11/06/04
Posts: 1017
Loc: London
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956265 - 29/11/11 09:20 PM
I have no direct experience of 'media composing' but....

Initially I thought it was a clever funny wind-up, but now I'm not so sure...In some alarming ways it seems dangerously close to the burgeoning 'music should be free' zeitgeist

If it isn't real, then maybe something like it is nevertheless on the way...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
NunoT



Joined: 19/05/11
Posts: 7
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956851 - 02/12/11 03:28 PM
Well, appart the fact that, at least the bucolic scene with the horses, is indeed quite rubish music. But what interests me the most is how is this music generated, as this is not explained nor in the website nor in the demo video. It explains how your video is analyzed in terms of colours and "rhythm patterns" (I believe this latter should be based on scene breaks), and how, from that analysis, the music that best fits your video, is selected. But where is that (very cheesy) music coming from? Probably it's a horizontal compilation of samples that match together in terms of harmony and general mood. By horizontal I mean that samples are aligned together one after the other (reversely by vertical I would mean that a piano track would be put over say a drum and a bass tracks; but it seamed to me that this was not the case. If this was the case, than you can say that there is a little touch of "automatic composition" on that music... but it doesn't seem to be the case.).

Being easy to find nowadays loads and loads of royalty free samples, the Juke bot, really does not impress me at all. It may be of help for beginners in the video making art, who really have no budget to spend on creating music for a video, and might be satisfied with this kind of "cheesy samples", though. But I still believe that we are still decades away of some software being able to build complex musical patterns to fit some complex image situations.

One other consideration is this: usually, creating a video finalized product (say a short movie of 5 minutes, or a long one of 60m) costs quite a lot more than creating a music piece (5mins) or an album (60 mins, say). But that cost comes for making a video requiring so many people and skills together from the camera-man, through the actors, the director, the huge road production team, to maybe another huge editing team, and so on. And in the middle there is a (or a group of) musician(s), to create a soundtrack. Now, for a video maker to be able to create is first master piece he will probably invest years to get there. Movie after movie he will slightly improve is skills on directing/production/writing/and-whatever-else-he-might-do-for-his-videos. But little learning is done in that process. The Video maker is indeed facing mostly a budget restriction that will usually loosen (budget will increase) with time as he becomes more famous or producess better results. That improve comes from he being able to spend more in a very big and always more skilled team.

Instead, the musician, who probably will do the composing job alone (and besides he could even work mainly with midi and some self made recording stuff and probably be will be able to deliver the final product all by himself), he as probably been investing decades in order to learn how harmony works, how rhythm works, how a melody can be built, how a sound is polished after recorded, how you can create different moods with different combinations of those four essential elements. Decades, my friends, decades. Do you have an idea of how many years have a piano player spent studying and practicing piano before he graduates? And I'm just talking about a piano player not a composer... OK if he got to the point of taking a degree on the art of playing a piano, he probably started early in his life. At least by 10 years old he was already starting but probably he did start at 6 or even earlier. Then he spent 8 years studying the basics of music like solfeggio (how to read a score), music history, music chamber practice, harmony, some basic composing + at least 3 for his degree on piano. I'm assuming the minimum would be these 11 years (it may change depending on the country's musical academic program). A movie maker will probably never face anything related to video before he ends his basic school studies and decide he want to take a degree on movie making or a professional faster course for it. So he will probably spend a 3-4 years studying video making... at most!... And I'm just talking about forma studying of course, because both musician and video maker will probably be studying informally for most part of their lives. So this just to give an idea on how much time was invested in a musician career.

This studying investment plus the technical time to compose and produce a short piece of music will justify a fee of 400-500 $ or € or pounds. It includes years and years of studying and practicing. Besides if you're talking about a 60 mins movie, than that would take probably more than a week to do, and hopefully the musician will ask at least 1/4 of a decent monthly salary as he has to do 4 of those to survive to the next month. So I don't think the prices being asked nowadays are high. I really think they are quite low giving the complex intelectual skils a musician is required to have in order to be able to compose a decent piece of music.

Finally, I would leave two short comments in order to demonstrate and prove how difficult is to compose music, and why one making movies in the era where we got used to assume that music is for free, and probably that music is so easy to do... It is not. And here I leave 2 situations to demonstrate it:

1st. Why is it so difficult for a video maker to explain to the musician what he really wants? Why is it music considered the art of all the arts? That is probably because music is the most powerful human created language and way to communicate and express feelings as no other art (not even poetry or literature using words can do). And yet so poorly known by people. Every one (every single person in the world that can hear) loves music. Every one. Really every one. Do you know any person in the world that claims to hate music? I don't. I don't like all kinds of music, but I do love music in general. This is because while video is kind of "lets make art with reality" making art with what reality can offer. Music instead is like the opposite. It's 100% intelectual. Comes out of you, from your skills to your feelings or mood. That's what makes music so complicated to create. Moreover, if music would be our only way to communicate, we would be leaving in a world where only a few would know how to speak and the most would be only downloading speaches to listen and to be delighet with. Music should indeed be part of every national shool program. And not only a few years playing flute, xylophone, or a tambourine, but really teach everyone how to read a score, and know how to basically communicate with sounds.

The second example is the following and strongly connected to the first. If you ask a musician to create a 5 minutes short movie he will take his camera and as bad as he can be to select scenes and angles and so on, he (or any other person in the world) will be able to find something that may represent a subject or a short story to tell. And even with bad technical quality he will be able to do a coherent output. Now, ask anyone - but for our pourpouse ask a video maker - to play in a piano, or a synth keyboard. For a few minutes he/she will be very excited with this magic way of making sounds. "look if i press this C3 key there's a sound coming from the speakers! Wow... And if I switch this knob it makes it a stranger sound... This is crazy!!!! And so much fun." Now, if you defy him with this "Hey, what about this. I'll pay you 400€ if you create to me a short music of 3-5 minutes and you can take all the time you want. You can delivery it to me in 80 years if you want." He will immediately give up. And that's because he will in a few minutes realize that there is a very big enormous huge difference between having fun on a midi keyboard and actually composing a piece of coherent music of 3-5 minutes, regardless the genre or mood of that music. He will see immediately by playing a bit with that midi keyboard that those Gigabites of mp3 he has accumulated downloading them free from the net, all those Gb add up to Teras and Teras and Teras and Teras and Teras of minutes composing, recording and polishing those Gigas of mp3...

Music is really a very hard thing to create and that is what justifies time and money to who does it. But I will be very glad if one day a software will be able to compose (really composing I mean) automatically some good music. I'll be glad to listen to it and I wont be worried as I do believe that computer automatic generated music will always sound different from a human mind composing music. And therefore there will always be a market for both human and computer. Till then, keep sending your requests to we musicians, because in the end, we do love creating music, otherwise we would spend so much time of our lives learning how to do it, even though we know a priori there will only be one Mozart in history, and we're not the one. ;-)

Hugs to you all video and music people!

NTS
https://www.facebook.com/SoundsRealProductions


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
narcoman
active member


Joined: 14/08/01
Posts: 8516
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956853 - 02/12/11 03:33 PM
brilliant prank!!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
hollowsun



Joined: 20/01/05
Posts: 5582
Loc: Cowbridge, South Wales
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956859 - 02/12/11 03:59 PM
Quote colin s:

all you do is upload a video and viola!!



Do they only provide viola music ... or are other genres catered for? Don't get me wrong, I like a viola as much as the next person but it might not always be the most appropriate instrument for some things. For example, a fast car chase (unless the viola is played by Panini or Ciabatta).

Quote colin s:

its really clever - say you upload a video well it reconizes whats actually on it and just selects a fitting piece of music to acconmapy it - genius or what!??!



What happens if you don't upload a video well? What happens if the video upload is not so good, not high quality or just rubbish?

I liked the one chap's glasses.

--------------------
Website / Music Lab Machines / Blog


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
IvanSC



Joined: 08/03/05
Posts: 7797
Loc: UK France & USA depending on t...
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #956868 - 02/12/11 05:14 PM
is it any good at doing music for pron?

--------------------
Me? But I`m such a loveable old bugger!


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
NunoT



Joined: 19/05/11
Posts: 7
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: IvanSC]
      #956869 - 02/12/11 05:17 PM
As long as they pay you to... :-)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
BJG145



Joined: 06/08/05
Posts: 3411
Loc: Norwich UK
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: colin s]
      #958799 - 13/12/11 06:47 PM
I thought they'd probably be advertising something in the end...

http://juke-bot.com/watch/WsTS4n

(It's a plug for Yooka.)


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
grab



Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2910
Loc: Cambridge, UK
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: IvanSC]
      #958926 - 14/12/11 12:14 PM
Ivan, there's music to it? Never noticed it myself - too busy with the visuals.

Anyway, I suspect someone watching pr0n and thinking "you know, that needs a little more guitar in the mix" is not really getting into the spirit of the thing...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
clisma



Joined: 02/03/06
Posts: 199
Re: who need mucisians! new [Re: hollowsun]
      #958933 - 14/12/11 12:39 PM
Quote hollowsun:

For example, a fast car chase (unless the viola is played by Panini or Ciabatta).




Don't forget about Mozartella, or the sandwich won't sound right...

--------------------
Just a piano and some sketch paper please...


Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator     Back to top
Pages: 1

Rate this thread

Jump to

Extra Information
0 registered and 7 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  David Etheridge, James Perrett, zenguitar, Martin Walker, Forum Admin, Hugh Robjohns, Zukan, Frank Eleveld, SOS News Editor,  
Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled
Rating:
Thread views: 5301

September 2014
On sale now at main newsagents and bookstores (or buy direct from the
SOS Web Shop)
SOS current Print Magazine: click here for FULL Contents list
Click image for September 2014
DAW Tips from SOS

 

Home | Search | News | Current Issue | Tablet Mag | Articles | Forum | Subscribe | Shop | Readers Ads

Advertise | Information | Privacy Policy | Support | Login Help

 

Email: Contact SOS

Telephone: +44 (0)1954 789888

Fax: +44 (0)1954 789895

Registered Office: Media House, Trafalgar Way, Bar Hill, Cambridge, CB23 8SQ, United Kingdom.

Sound On Sound Ltd is registered in England and Wales.

Company number: 3015516 VAT number: GB 638 5307 26

         

All contents copyright © SOS Publications Group and/or its licensors, 1985-2014. All rights reserved.
The contents of this article are subject to worldwide copyright protection and reproduction in whole or part, whether mechanical or electronic, is expressly forbidden without the prior written consent of the Publishers. Great care has been taken to ensure accuracy in the preparation of this article but neither Sound On Sound Limited nor the publishers can be held responsible for its contents. The views expressed are those of the contributors and not necessarily those of the publishers.

Web site designed & maintained by PB Associates | SOS | Relative Media