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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions.
      #957208 - 05/12/11 09:46 AM
Hello every body.
First let me thank you SOS guys because after working at home for some years I'm finally employed in a professional studio and I think I owe SOS for this employment.
We are about to switch to Protools HD from Sonar X1 for recording. We've bought a HD native card that looks to be also compatible with sonar. This studio have been using sonar for 6 years. I have some main questions before starting to record in protools seriously.

1. Is there any headroom difference between sonar and protools? Note that most daws offer a +6db to increase a track level but protools give you +12db.
2. If there is headroom difference, does it mean that master volume can be louder(after mastering with the same plugins) without clipping between these two(or any other)daws?
3. Is RTAS more quality or quick than VST at all?
4. Is there any dsp difference leading to faster process?
5. Looks like protools doesn't have fast bounce, input monitoring while playback and blend(sound on sound!) recording. Am I right or do I miss something?
6. And the most important question, is there any difference in sound quality?

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957396 - 05/12/11 10:22 PM
well, looks like no one is so moody to answer this number of questions at once! ok. just answer the ones you like.

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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The Red Bladder



Joined: 05/06/07
Posts: 2067
Loc: . ...
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957445 - 06/12/11 09:09 AM
1. I don't know Sonor, but I doubt it, if we are talking about the master out, but you should avoid going over 0dB anyway.

2. Try it and find out!

3 & 4. Both should work in real time.

5. Yes, you are missing something!

6. In theory, no, but again, try it and see - well, hear!

No doubt, somewhere in this thread, someone will start to go off on a rant, bashing ProTools for something. And then all sorts of people will bang on about their favourite DAW, telling you that you should be using Logic, DP, Ableton, CuBase, Studio One, Sadie, Nuendo and Spong.

So let me be the first one - PT is great, but Reaper is better!


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957448 - 06/12/11 09:18 AM
Thank you blader.
Of course the limit is 0db but for each single track there's a +6db gain possibility in all daws and +12db in protools. I wanna know that does this mean anything related to quality? And can 0db in protools(or any daw A) be louder than 0db in others(or any daw B)?
I found out that protools doesn't have fast bounce and bouncing MUST take place in realtime. But input monitoring while playing back the input enabled track is really vital to me so please tell me if protools has it or not.
Thanks.
Waiting for more.

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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James PerrettModerator



Joined: 10/09/01
Posts: 9651
Loc: The wilds of Hampshire
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957494 - 06/12/11 12:19 PM
The +6 and +12 dB thing is just about convenience. Some DAW's will let you set up whatever range you like while with others you will need to use a gain plug-in if you want to exceed the values offered.

I'm fairly sure that Protools now offers non realtime bouncing but I'm not sure that older versions did.

Input monitoring is a fairly basic requirement so, again, I would be surprised if Protools didn't offer it.

James.

--------------------
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration.
http://www.jrpmusic.net


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BJG145



Joined: 06/08/05
Posts: 2155
Loc: Norwich UK
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: James Perrett]
      #957499 - 06/12/11 12:33 PM
Quote James Perrett:

Input monitoring is a fairly basic requirement so, again, I would be surprised if Protools didn't offer it.



Implementation seems to differ with versions, but far as I can make out input monitoring in PT is kind of the same as arming a track, which differs from the Sonar approach where they're independent.

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jan11/articles/pro-tools-9.htm
http://ptuser.blogspot.com/2009/02/auto-input-and-input-only-monitoring.ht ml

I didn't think it had fast bounce though. Not according to this anyway.

http://mcnitefly.blogspot.com/2011/10/pro-tools-10-bounce-export-realtime. html


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: James Perrett]
      #957501 - 06/12/11 12:38 PM
Quote James Perrett:

The +6 and +12 dB thing is just about convenience.
I'm fairly sure that Protools now offers non realtime bouncing but I'm not sure that older versions did.
Input monitoring is a fairly basic requirement so, again, I would be surprised if Protools didn't offer it.




Thank you James. Lot's of my questions is now solved. Yes. I'm running version 9. I will be after installing v10.but...
Did you exactly notice my question about input monitoring? When a track is input monitoring enabled and you press play, you may hear only one of the input signal or recorded clip. And that option in track menu doesn't actually help. Can you hear both of the input signal and recorded audio at the same time in version 10?
Thanks again.

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: BJG145]
      #957512 - 06/12/11 01:25 PM
BJG145's second link exactly explains my issue with monitoring. And the last link confirms that there's no fast bounce even in v10!

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957594 - 06/12/11 09:17 PM
After this discussion let me say that having HD native card installed and compatible with any DAW, I see no need to switch from Sonar. Though I still like the big name and prestige of protools to compete other studios(that I think it's just a result of advertisement, and always bigger and richer companies win advertisement competitions!)I can't deal with it's limitations along a stressful recording operation.

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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James PerrettModerator



Joined: 10/09/01
Posts: 9651
Loc: The wilds of Hampshire
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #957663 - 07/12/11 10:32 AM
I've only once had someone come into the studio and decide not to book it due to the software I was using. Of course, that doesn't take into account people who looked at the website and didn't bother to contact me but I do think that too much is made of big name software/hardware.

I have a copy of AATranslator which can handle sessions from most DAW's if I need to convert from another DAW. However, a set of individual track files that all start at the same point seems to be a universal interchange format now.

James.

--------------------
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration.
http://www.jrpmusic.net


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #958154 - 09/12/11 03:01 PM
Yes James. I'm really after those big names. And that's exactly why I decided to change my daw.
Thanks for comments.

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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Bogmusic



Joined: 03/01/10
Posts: 49
Loc: North Yorkshire
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: The Red Bladder]
      #960871 - 28/12/11 10:54 AM
Quote The Red Bladder:


No doubt, somewhere in this thread, someone will start to go off on a rant, bashing ProTools for something. And then all sorts of people will bang on about their favourite DAW, telling you that you should be using Logic, DP, Ableton, CuBase, Studio One, Sadie, Nuendo and Spong.

So let me be the first one - PT is great, but Reaper is better!




No way is anything better than the mighty Spong! It does everything better than everything else and all the best people use it. If you are not using Spong yet you are only living half a life.

Spong, Spong, Spong, Spong, Spong


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BJG145



Joined: 06/08/05
Posts: 2155
Loc: Norwich UK
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #960879 - 28/12/11 11:26 AM
+1 for Spong


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Hexagon



Joined: 14/03/11
Posts: 158
Loc: Iran
Re: Switching from sonar to protools but with some questions. new [Re: Hexagon]
      #961439 - 01/01/12 08:18 PM
Thanks for all comments. Where is this spong? which company is it a product of?

--------------------
home: HP Probook 4530s,win7,FastTrackPro,Ableton ,Novation SL MKII
studio: phenomeIIX6,12gb-2000,win8,aurora8,SSL X-rack,Neuman U87&184,SonarX2,Genelec&sub.


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