maiki
Joined: 08/08/08
Posts: 52
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Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
#970375 - 16/02/12 04:03 AM
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I have seen on the net tables with suggested speaker cable gauge based on the length of
the cable, for instance at: http://www.audioholics.com/education/frequently-asked-questions/speaker-ca
ble-gauge-distance The table on that page recommends for less than 30 feet--16 gauge,
for 30-50 ft.-14 gauge, and for 50-100 ft. 12 gauge. I have seen similar tables on other
pages. When reading more info at the link above, and elsewhere, it is
discussing what is needed in connecting an amplifier to speakers. When using
active speakers, however, the amplifier is in the speaker cabinets. Therefore the cables
only go from a passive mixer to the powered speakers. In that case (with
active speakers), do the same gauge recommendations apply? Or for example, in connecting a
passive mixer with active speakers with a 50 ft. cable, would 16 gauge be OK? Or still
necessary to get 12 gauge? Interested in hearing your opinions about this.
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Bob Bickerton
active member
Joined: 20/12/02
Posts: 2523
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970380 - 16/02/12 06:15 AM
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NO. You do not require, nor is it recommended to use speaker cable to connect
between a passive mixer and an active speaker. Standard balanced Mic/Line
cable (generally XLR to XLR) is all that is required and the run lengths you are talking
about will be no problem at all. Bob
-------------------- www.bickerton.co.nz
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mick.n
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 344
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970401 - 16/02/12 10:37 AM
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+1
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grab
Joined: 08/07/07
Posts: 2626
Loc: Cambridge, UK
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970427 - 16/02/12 12:26 PM
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With passive speakers, you have a wire from the mixer to the separate power amp. You then
have another wire from the power amp to the speaker.
With active speakers,
you have a wire from the mixer to the power amp that lives in the speaker. The speaker
has its own wire from that internal power amp to the speaker.
So whatever
cable you'd usually use to connect from a mixer output to a power amp, you use the same
cable to connect from a mixer output to an active speaker. Usually this will be a
standard mic cable.
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maiki
Joined: 08/08/08
Posts: 52
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970560 - 17/02/12 07:48 AM
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Thanks for the info. Good to know that.
Is there any advantage to using
balanced cable with XLR connectors over TRS 1/4" connectors?
Aren't most
speaker output jacks from mixers 1/4"?
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Chevytraveller
member
Joined: 13/05/00
Posts: 658
Loc: London
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970561 - 17/02/12 08:13 AM
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If the connection are electronically balanced, you will get better noise rejection from an
XLR connection. In addition to that, they are more secure sockets as they latch and
you can connect multiple cables together if you need to extend the cable. 
-------------------- MBP 17", PC 100(Nubus Protools) Motu 896, X-Station, Logic9, Reason6, Korg legacy, ACE, Alchemy, Emax II, E-Synth, Evolver MEK, Waldorf Pulse and Blofeld, AS Telemark, AS Leipzig-S
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Mike Stranks
active member
Joined: 03/01/03
Posts: 3066
Loc: Oxford, UK
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970566 - 17/02/12 08:52 AM
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Quote maiki:
Aren't most speaker
output jacks from mixers 1/4"?
Have another look at grab's excellent explanation of the differences in getting signal
to unpowered and powered speakers.
You need to move away from thinking about
'speaker outputs'. With powered speakers you connect the main outputs from the mixer to
the inputs of the speakers. These main outputs can be on either XLRs or jacks.
The main output of a mixer without onboard amps will produce typically a voltage of
about one volt as long as the mixer meters are in the green/yellow area.
A
mixer/amplifier (a mixer with onboard amps to drive unpowered speakers) will produce
upwards of 50-volts at the speaker ouputs. If you connect those outputs to a powered
speaker's input there will be some "interesting" pyrotechnics and smells followed by
silence. 
So, I think you need to be absolutely sure you know what output
you're intending to connect to what speaker. Otherwise the learning-experience will be
expensive.
In terms of the quality of the connection: balanced is balanced and
it doesn't matter whether the cables are TRS or XLR. However, if you're buying rather than
making you'll probably find it easier to get XLR cables rather than true balanced TRSs.
And I agree 100% with the comment about jacks being easier to inadvertently disconnect by
pulling/snagging a cable.
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Hugh Robjohns
SOS Technical Editor
Joined: 25/07/03
Posts: 18401
Loc: Worcestershire
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: Chevytraveller]
#970573 - 17/02/12 09:46 AM
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Quote Chevytraveller:
If the
connection are electronically balanced, you will get better noise rejection from an XLR
connection.
Really? I'd like
to see the science to support that idea!
The XLR plug has the advantage of a secure latch to prevent accidental disconnection,
but that's about it. Neutrik make a latching TRS socket too, but most aren't latching. But
the TRS quarter-inch jack plug is still a three-pole connector and supports the balanced
interface just as well as the XLR connection.
The important point -- and
perhaps this is what you meant -- is to use balanced cable with balanced inputs and output
for best interference rejection, but whether you connect physically with XLR or TRS
doesn't make much practical difference.
You will need to avoid two-pole mono /
tip-sleeve / TS plugs, of course.
Hugh
--------------------
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound
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Hugh Robjohns
SOS Technical Editor
Joined: 25/07/03
Posts: 18401
Loc: Worcestershire
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970574 - 17/02/12 09:50 AM
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Quote maiki:
Is there any
advantage to using balanced cable with XLR connectors over TRS 1/4" connectors?
Not really. XLRs will latch to prevent
accidental disconnection where as most TRS sockets have no latch, and all XLRs have a
decent internal cable grip whereas some RS plugs are pretty poor -- so stick with Neutrik
TRS plugs if you have a choice as they're more robust and will last longer!
Quote:
Aren't most speaker
output jacks from mixers 1/4"?
The main outputs that you would normally use to drive the FOH amps or powered speakers
are generally on XLRs, and the local monitoring is on TRS sockets... but different mixers
vary in their facilities, so best to check with the actual equipment you plan to use.
Hugh
--------------------
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound
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Bob Bickerton
active member
Joined: 20/12/02
Posts: 2523
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: maiki]
#970580 - 17/02/12 10:08 AM
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It's just occurred to me that the original poster may have a powered mixer! Please tell us what model of mixer you have. If it has it's own amp then do not connect
the speaker outputs to your powered speakers. As has been said above, you'll do permanent
damage to them!!! If you're not clear, talk to us or someone who knows
first! Bob
-------------------- www.bickerton.co.nz
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Hugh Robjohns
SOS Technical Editor
Joined: 25/07/03
Posts: 18401
Loc: Worcestershire
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: Bob Bickerton]
#970582 - 17/02/12 10:10 AM
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he was talking about connecting 'passive mixers', so I think he means standard line-level
output mixers... but you're right, some clarification of the specific equipment involved
would be helpful.
hugh
--------------------
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound
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Bob Bickerton
active member
Joined: 20/12/02
Posts: 2523
Loc: Nelson, New Zealand
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Re: Speaker Cable Gauge for Powered Speakers
[Re: Hugh Robjohns]
#970604 - 17/02/12 11:37 AM
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So he was............... the reference to speaker output jacks gave me a lightbulb
moment!
Bob
-------------------- www.bickerton.co.nz
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