Hi folks


i need to advice here.I work in a room about 12ft x 10 - 7 foot ceiling.NO damping or acoustic treatment and recently got bought some genelec 1031a to try as they cam eup for sale locally and i had read they are well regarded.Ive spent 1 month with them and i am not sure about anything , whether i like them .People say these are great monitors but set flat on the back they are bass heavy in the room and when listening to some very good mastered cds i use as reference by other mastering people also bass heavy in relation to a very good hi and lounge space i use ( which is also good acoustics , ok so gets some bass traps and room treatmeant first ? or tweak the eq settings on the back of the unit and lower the bass amount using reference cds which i regard as spot on for my taste?

i have been told by a few people that genelecs may not be what i need and also are an acquired taste , my concern is that they may just be to big for the room but i like to be able to get some bass and dont want a sub in the room and other speakers i look at like the A7 dont go so low ?, i a mainly do very subtle bass end music anyway so maybe this isnt an issue, one guy says try adam A7's as they will translate better and another mate swears by his 1031's and his mastering is superb to my ears.I am currently pondering
selling them and downsizing monitors , should i treat the room first.

My big issue is i have found the speakers quite difficult to mix with after a few hours.

any suggestions ? - acoustic treatmeant is next to sort the bass in the room maybe buut i am tempted to just sell the egenelecs at the same time and get the adam A7's and treat the room.My favourite label uses A7's for mastering and i love there sound , maybe its a no brainer.

Ethan Winer the guy behind real traps, always state that if there is a problem it is always the room and not the speakers.

I would treat the room.

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Alex Ivory
http://www.ivorymastering.com

To get the best from any monitor -- whether the 1031s or the A7s or whatever -- you'll need to treat the room. Your room isn't far off square, which is the worst situation to be in anyway.

Treat the room with proper corner bass traps and broadband absorbers onthe mirror points. If you can do some DIY it shouldn't cost much, and the difference will be enormous. You'll then be in a position to assess your speakers more sensibly.

The 1031 -- all Genelecs, really -- do tend to be a little forward and I find them tiring after a while, but a reverberant room will make that issue far worse. I wouldn't say the 1031s are too big for the room at all, but I wouldn't recommend you go any bigger either!

Hugh

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Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

thanks for the info guys , next stop is the room acoustics , can anyone point to an article on dimensions to make my own absorbers ( i need to make them portable as were in rented space )Ive just got the december article so i will ponder that for a while and then get it sorted first i think.

Hop across to the Studio & Acoustics forum -- this sort of think is the main topic of conversation over there

If you search the Studio SOS articles in the main site, you'll also find several absorber and trap designs described. Try searching for Hilgrove Kenrick +Studio SOS

hugh

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Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

thanks for the link hugh , spot on - just dusting off the woodworking apron . .

I have (had) both, A7s and many Genelecs, I can tell you that the 1031 is a superior monitor, definitely, while the A7 is much more pleasant to work with.
I have been using Genelec for many years, and I consider them amongst the very best, the problem is had to take a break from them, as they are a bit aggressive to my ears, especially as you are getting older, things start to sound a bit harsher and your ears become more sensitive. The A7 are some of the best monitor you can buy for £500, they are cheap indeed. BUT, the 1031s are the better monitors, and not just because they were 4 times the price of the A7. The replacement is the 8050. If I were you, I would keep the 1031, and maybe get a extra pair of A7s to give your ears a rest. To answer your question, the problem is your room, this is why you cannot hear what you should, and the 1031s have an 8' driver + they are powerful, twice the power of the A7s, which is harder to control in a smaller room, you will find that a 6' driver will/might sound 'better', until you treat your room. It's not just the frequency response to look for, in a problem(s), the size of the cabinet, driver and power are all the important factor.
1031 = 2x120 watts + 8' driver
A7 = 2x50 watts + 6.5' driver.
This figure alone should give you some clues.

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-- Fingering the G_string. I play (B)ass Fu(n)k & MIX for the *STARS* http://www.ssradiouk.com/

thats nice advice , i am going to do the acoustics first then do some intensive sessions the genelecs and re adjust my ears to them first with new room acoustics .The extra pair of monitors is actually something i hadnt thought about . .

Also, as a side note, you probably heard of George Massenburg?
He had the 1032s as his favorites, last time I heard from him. Maybe this will help you out to understand better and/or making the right decision.
George is very popular in the Music business, so is Genelec.
Also be aware of people who read to many things, and will tell you that 6' drivers are better for midrange... Certainly not in a two way system.
This is like saying, a 10' sub has better bass response than a 12' one ! (in which room, and treated or not? )
The room is important, yes, and if you treat your room, you can accomodate bigger/better monitors. The 1031s are fine for your room. The Adam A7s is great addition and conbination actually, they are very different monitors.
What I would do in your case, is get the extra set and put them in an other room, as oppose as having two sets of nearfield in the same room.
This is because:
1) you need to learn the monitors and the room, and
2) it's much more productive to check with a second set in a different room, which you should learn how they work as well.

In the end, my persoanl/main advice is:
1) a pair of nearfield - and learn them as well as the room. Stick to them.
2) a pair of auratone type, or current Avantone, yes or
2b) a set of somthing like the JBL 'on tour' (that's what I have, really good).
3) some main (big) three way monitors, and would advice some vintage KEF that you can pickup on eBay (that's) what I did. I use the Kef 105.2 (not the first 105). I can tell you that I can hear + feel how it sounds on the dancefloor, beeing sealed cabinets, the bass response is awesome, and the price, was a fraction of the cost of some 'real' and new main monitors. The
down side is, you need to be prepare to have them seerviced once in a while - yet, a small price to pay for the luxury.
The Kef KM1 was the top of the range, and my 105.2 (which I am very proud of, being a poor man ), were the smaller version of the KM1, as they used the exact same drivers. KEF drivers were used by Harberth, Rogers, the BBC, Meridian and all over the world... Sorry, I slipped off, I fell like going for it



My 'main' monitors/speakers, KEF 105.2 which I am very proud of
Mine have a darker wood, more like the KM1 above (could be due to the light).

In case someone is interested, there is a pair on eBay at the monent, they are the 105, the very first model/version, they used a different bass driver.
http://www.kef.com/history/1970/model105.asp
http://www.kef.com/history/1970/model105_2.asp
http://www.kef.com/history/1980/km1.asp

KEF 105 on eBay

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-- Fingering the G_string. I play (B)ass Fu(n)k & MIX for the *STARS* http://www.ssradiouk.com/

HI, I am in the market for some Genelec 1031s if you decide to sell (p.hoad@ntlworld.com).

good luck.