Hey fellas,

I'm currently making a home demo (trying to get a really good sound!), will be recording my friend's bass guitar quite soon. It's the first time I will be recording a bass guitar and I wanted to know the right ways of doing it. I've heard that the best way is to record via the amplifier's DI -> Line in. Or is it the same as doing Bass guitar -> Line in? Also some tips and suggestions to enhance the record? And any nuisances that could occur during the record?

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If you don't mind spending a couple of dollars, the Tech 21 SansAmp Bass driver has served me well. It sounds great, and is really well built, you'll never need to replace it.

Quote Nightredt:

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I've heard that the best way is to record via the amplifier's DI -> Line in. Or is it the same as doing Bass guitar -> Line in?

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Ok, intruments (Guitar/Bass) should not go directly into the "line in" on your recording device, if you are plugging your intrument directly into your recording device it should go into in Instrument input (its to do with balaced and un-balacanced signals, someone will be along to explain this better than i can) or like you have said take the "line out" of the Amp to the "line in" on your recording device. If you have an effects pedal/amp simulator pedal that has a "line out" then you can plug from that into the "line in" on your recording device. Basically "line out" to "line in" to connect devices.

Arguably the BEST way to record is to mike the Amp in a well treated room, but as you are recording at home i realise this may not be the case.

What is your recording setup?

May i add we are not stalking you!!

Dan

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Two interesting facts about me: 1)My Knob is the length of two Argos pens 2)I'm banned from Argos

Hi,

You could try the Line6 Pod Studio...it's about £100 at DV247.com at present.

I wish that product had been around when I started recording my own music. I've been through so much gear....different mics, different amps, different DI boxes, compressors.....

What it enables you to do is record your bass/guitar 'dry' - no effects, no amp sound, nothing. It comes with a VST FX (pod farm) that actually does the job of a guitar amp non-destructively. This means if you don't like the sound you have, you can change it - you can tell it what amp to 'simulate' - e.g. Fender Bassman, Hiwatt 100, etc. If you've recorded distorted guitar with an amp and a mic, you're stuck with the sound.

Many people will argue against this method....and I will admit that my SE 5600 and Focusrite ISA1 sound great on my Ashdown bass amp in a treated room - but I know how to get the sound I want and we're talking about £3000 worth of gear.

So, if you're looking for a low cost way to record guitar/bass, get great results easily, provide flexible options should you change your mind...that's it. And when you're rich, you can try the other option.

Ant.

Most audio interfaces aimed at musicians include at least one instrument input to Direct Input (or Inject) (DI) a guitar or bass pickup signal. This will accept an unbalanced (simple mono jack plug) connection and have a high impedance to preserve the tone of the bass or guitar. It will also have a high enough gain to cope with the low-level outputs from magnetic pickups.

DI is the easiest way to record a bass or guitar because, as mentioned above, you do not need to worry about room treatment, mic placement and so on. However...

A raw DI bass track sounds "brittle" and scratchy as a good part of the electric bass sound we accept as "correct" comes from the amplifier and speaker cabinet smoothing off the sound, especially excessive high-frequency energy. Amplifier and speaker modelling helps re-create the sound we expect to hear. The Tech 21 Bass Driver does this very well but unfortunately costs a bit more than a couple of dollars in the UK. If you can afford one, though, they are exceptionally useful little boxes.

You can use EQ or amp/cabinet modelling in your DAW. We bass players and not nearly so well catered for as guitarists, but many DAWs do include dedicated bass amp models or guitar rigs that are useable for the low end.

I find it best not to bother with any modelling when recording so I can use latency-free direct monitoring (Saffire USB 6 in my case but as suggested Line 6 offer some excellent option that include modelling software). I then just add the modelling at the mix stage using Logic bass models, or even better Pod Farm, which has a few bass amps and cabs included. I have tried miking up my combo and it does sound very good, even in my untreated living room, but with no dedicated studio to hand DI'ing is far more consistent and less prone to domestic interruptions(!).

There is at least one S-O-S article that goes into this in far more detail so that is worth looking up.

Edited by dBerriff (18/09/11 09:10 AM)

More importantly than anything you plug your bass into, you need to make sure the bass is setup well! I have just invested in a very good bass for the sole reason of not being able to make a crap bass guitar sound good (even with Ampeg SVX). So make sure your bass has correct intonation and when it's played watch out for hitting the pups. Strings don't need to be new, but if you put them on say 1 week before recording they will be bedded in.

As for recording I would just plug the bass into a decent DI or interface Hi Z does not need to be uber expensive but just clean with no hiss/crackles. Then use something like this http://www.studiodevil.com/products/virtual_bass_amp/ which costs about £40 which will do a decent job.

If you are inexperienced I would suggest sticking with the DI and once you can get a kick ass sound from that, then think about miking a cabinet.

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There is nothing Grim about this Reaper
We Fell From The Sky

Hey guys,

Thank you for replies. I'm not so concerned about the modelling side of things, as I am concerned of actually receiving a very nice, powerfull 'dry' signal, before I start modelling. I tried to record bass gutiar myself once before. I just used Bass Guitar -> Tascam US-100 USB Audio Interface -> Cubase 5. Even the wave file was more or less constant all the time. All the accents were so unclear, as well as the sound, even after modelling, was very poor (Programmed bass sounded better!!!).
What are the differences between recording the guitar straight to an interface versus "Bass -> Amplifier -> Interface -> DAW" ?

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Quote Nightredt:

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What are the differences between recording the guitar straight to an interface versus "Bass -> Amplifier -> Interface -> DAW" ?

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It depends on the quality of the interface's Hi-Z input compared to the quality of the DI on the amp.

Not all DI's are created equal.

For example, the DI out on my Ashdown amp was okay for gigs but seemed a bit vague when recording, plugging direct into the interface gave a better sound for me. However when I used the DI input on my focusrite ISA One, the difference between the interface and the ISA was night & day.

Therefore, its a case of suck it and see, do 2 recordings one via your amp one going direct in, which one sounds the most solid and focused? Use that one. If neither of them cut the mustard, then maybe its time to think about a proper DI box such as one from Radial, EMO or the Sansamp described above. You will need to spend at least £100 to get a good one, but it will be worth it.

Don't buy a Behringer DT100 and expect it to be better than your interface, its unlikely to be...

A decent DI box is an essential tool for a bass player for exactly the reasons you are describing, but its the kind of tool that you will always find a use for.

Buy once, buy well and you'll never need another...

...and yes I bought a Behringer DT100, though it was good until I hear a proper DI box, then ended up spending more money...

I cannot understand why you did not get a useable DI track going into the guitar input of the US-100, assuming you used a reasonable gain level without hitting overload. The interface is similar to the Saffire 6 usb which I have used with some success.

The difference if you use your bass amp as a front end depends where the amp take the signal from but this is likely to be boosted to line level so you should use the US-100 line input rather than the guitar input. The amp tone controls will probably affect the signal (post eq rather than pre) and in my experience most bass amps colour the sound to some extent even with the tone controls set flat, depending on the make.

This all assumes your bass is working ok and you have the volume pot on a typical passive bass full on or only slightly backed off.

Hope something here helps.

Quote jaminem:

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Not all DI's are created equal.

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Very true. Seems especially true when recording bass.

I had one bass in particular that sounded great when recorded via a stomp box (with the effect turned off - clearly not a true-bypass pedal), and I have also had great results using the line out on a bass amp.

I have several DI boxes and I wouldn't say any sound "better" than others - just different.... which is sometimes better for what I'm trying to record.

No, not all DIs are created equal (Radial, Raindirk, DAV, BSS all seem very nice to me...) BUT no DI or Hi-Z input should result in the sort of problems the OP has described. They sound much more down to bass setup and/or playing technique to me.

I'd suggest (1) make sure the bass is properly set up, and that you're happy with the sound as played through an amp as usual; (2) try recording with finger-picking and then if the sound's lacking attack, try using a pick; (3) make sure your notes aren't ringing on too long - ie it's as much about when the notes stop as it is when they start; (4) experiment with compression and/or transient design plug-ins: enough attack on a compressor to let the initial transient through and then let it clamp down on the signal, without adding loads of make-up gain (which would defeat the point in this scenario). I'm sure there are bassists here (Korff?) who can give you better advice on the setup/playing side of things, but hopefully this will get you closer...

Quote Nightredt:

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Hey guys,

Thank you for replies. I'm not so concerned about the modelling side of things, as I am concerned of actually receiving a very nice, powerfull 'dry' signal, before I start modelling. I tried to record bass gutiar myself once before. I just used Bass Guitar -> Tascam US-100 USB Audio Interface -> Cubase 5. Even the wave file was more or less constant all the time. All the accents were so unclear, as well as the sound, even after modelling, was very poor (Programmed bass sounded better!!!).
What are the differences between recording the guitar straight to an interface versus "Bass -> Amplifier -> Interface -> DAW" ?

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Can you post a sample for us to hear? Might help us help you sort out the problem...

Can't really post anything now, as I was describing an experience from quite a time ago. But thank you for the advice, I will try all the options and check it which is best. Maybe I'll even post some comparison mp3s here for future reference!
Martin

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Regarding the difference between recording guitar and bass directly into an interface, the answer really is nothing at all.

However, if you where to setup your input for a guitar, and then plug a bass into the same input, using the same setting, you may well replicate the issue you had. Bass guitars are capable or producing 8 times the level of a standard electric guitar.

Remember, if your recording 24bit, you can easily allow yourself a peak of say -12db, and not have to worry about losing signal. back the gain right off to record the bass.

After that, there are a couple of good bass modelling plugins that will give you a great bass sound, for very little time / cash investment at all.

Quote jaminem:

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Quote Nightredt:

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What are the differences between recording the guitar straight to an interface versus "Bass -> Amplifier -> Interface -> DAW" ?

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It depends on the quality of the interface's Hi-Z input compared to the quality of the DI on the amp.

Not all DI's are created equal.

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Biiiiiig +1. Get a good DI (Radial maybe?) and run it into a mic input on your interface (mic, not line, because you'll need the gain). It'll do double duty for electric guitar as well.

I have a BBE DI and the same Focusrite unit as jaminem, and either of those sounds much better than the Hi-Z input on any interface I've ever tried.

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