RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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I thought I would just add a short extra review for this new Acoustic Drum Rompler which I
picked up yesterday whilst auditioning mics and preamps.
As to the why I'm
doing this? Well I am typing on the missus' Mum's 'puter this morning as I download 21
critical updates for it and generally tidy it up...
I have also had the
opportunity to give the BFD a bit more of a workout this morning before everybody woke up
to get a better general impression of the Rompler.
Alot of effort has gone into making a product that can
produce a realistic final result. Almost every aspect of how the drums are miked, hit and
mixed can be adjusted in real time and alot of effort has gone into making this work from
the 46 layers of samples rather than simply using effects.
Individual
drums:-
- Can be detuned (FX)
- Hit harder or
softer (Samples)
- Tuned out of the mix both direct and ambient (? Probably a mix of
both FX and samples)
- Direct trim can be altered (Samples)
- Top bottom snare and
front back kick mikes can be mixed (Samples)
- Direct mics can be panned anywhere
(Samples panned)
- You have a choice of stereo or individual drum channels out
(Samples)
Ambient mics
- Can have there width positioning altered (FX)
- Can have their distance from the
drums moved (Predelay FX)
Finally you have Direct, Overhead,
Room, Floor PZM and Master Mixbuses to acheive your overall sound from six kits where you
can mix or match any percussion piece you choose. These setups can then be saved as files
that appear as standard kits for you to use in future. It took me all of 15 minutes to try
this out this morning as it is all fairly intuitive.
The software also comes
with a good selection of built in midi grooves that you can add to from stock grooves or
your own creations and then use as standard parts of your kit from then on. These take
full advantage of the layering which adds to their realism. Further realism if provide by
linear quantise and swing contols and a velocity proabability graph all of which can make
your groove sound pretty d*mned human.
The sample sound excellent but then
again the kit used to record the top quality drums is very impressive...
- Direct - Sennheiser MD421, Neuman KM81 and M49, ElectroVoice Re20,
AKG 451 and Shure SM57s through Custom API premaps.
- Overheads - AKG C12s
through Summit MPC100A tube preamps.
- Room - Neumann U87s through Avalon
preamps.
- PZM - Crown PZM microphones through API preamps and compressed with
Empirical Labs Distressors.
So there's all the good stuff and
mighty good it is too. I like this Rompler alot and will be using it.
On the
minus side even with streaming it is a serious memory (not CPU) hog and needs a fast hard
drive... My Laptop struggled a little at times, especially as I upped the streaming by
allowing more swing and velocity variation and hence requiring more layers. The rompler
basically needs around 0.5MB or more memory to itself to run effectively and any slow disk
drives will struggle with the streaming.
However, as long as your computer
kit is well tuned... Your drum demos will be too. With two expansion kits already on the
market and such a broad variety of control, you need not worry about a unique sound. One
expansion set contains a series of louder kits the other an 8 bit techno set...
A valuable addition to any songwriters toolkit, this rompler will certainly help
with competent demos. You might even be able to sneak it into more serious
recordings...
For more information:-
FXpansion BFD Web
Page
Emusician Review
TraxMusic Review
...or, of course checkout Sound on Sound.
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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In my earlier review, I list three humaisation controls for BFD there are in fact four on
further experimentation with a timing probability graph also being available.
Alot of though has gone into this programming!
Cheers!
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Chickenjohn
Not a chicken
Joined: 08/04/04
Posts: 465
Loc: Kent, UK
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Sounds like decent kit Reg! Unfortunately, i may be looking at something less ambitious,
as my PC has only 512meg and my Powerbook, only 768.
Did you mean the BFD needs
0.5 gig of memory??? 0.5 meg, as you said is hardly a hog these days. Something like a
rock version of Stylus would be good for me.
I think my first try is a sample
CD, and exs-24 perhaps!
-------------------- Chaas
cJ na
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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CJ
9GB to store the samples... 0.5MB of your RAM to stream itat 24bit word
length. You can truncate this to 16bits though...
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Mike C4miles
member
Joined: 22/02/02
Posts: 436
Loc: Whipsnade with frogs
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Its very good; one of my favourite VIs, and the support has been decent for such a small
company. They are currently in testing with version 1.5 which will expand the number of
kit pieces allowed at a time; so for example you will be able to have a full standard kit
plus several percussion pieces running simultaneously. It runs well in ReWire mode, which
I have to use because my DAW doen not yet allow multiple outs from a VI (only stereo). The
included midi files (Grooves in BFD terminology) are useful, as they capture the full
range of articulations; and BFD users have strted posting their own Grooves, made with
V-Drums and the like. All in all its 9/10.
-------------------- If money is the root of all evil, what is money squared?
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Hey mjc,
I'd go as far as to say this is rapidly becoming a favorite to
me...
I like the way that you can put some drums together very quickly. This
ranges from a straight stereo feed from the Rompler to a whole get 14 channels to mix to
your heart's desire including all sorts of room...
For example, last might
this little dry piece took 1 minute to programme - if you don't want to write the beats
yourself which I normally do - and including messing with a vast array of channels around
20 mins to mix with minimal FX...
Express RockFunk Drums
The only other thing I did to this
was to add a little velocity and timing variation within the Rompler to get a more human
feel, then bounced it down in the box...
Very realistic results, very quickly.
You need a good fast DAW to get the best out of it, but the results are niiiccceee!
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Mike C4miles
member
Joined: 22/02/02
Posts: 436
Loc: Whipsnade with frogs
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Pretty funky! It took me longer to listen to it than for you to program! I'd been
recording the Pod and had totally screwed up the audio path on the Mac! Need to re-boot
the cat.
Anyway, I really like the Fxpansion guys' approach. They've developed
BFD using lots of input from ordinary customers, which is good to see. 1.5 should be
spectacular.
Good review by the way!
-------------------- If money is the root of all evil, what is money squared?
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Mike C4miles
member
Joined: 22/02/02
Posts: 436
Loc: Whipsnade with frogs
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Forgot to mention in my first post the BFD XFL expansion kit(s) - another FOUR DVDs worth
of drums and percussions. Some really lovely stuff there - kits by DW, Tama, Ludwig, loads
of cymbals by Paiste, Sabian and Zildjian then loads of percussion pieces. Well worth the
money, and there are extra kits pieces free on the website when you register your
purchase.
-------------------- If money is the root of all evil, what is money squared?
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Well I've since tried out two of the other kits and they are all extremely well recorded.
The nice thing is that you can write a tune / desgin a drum track using the Stereo plug
and midi to keep things tight in terms of workflow and then just paste the MIDI file to a
new session of your DAW then fire up all the direct mics and room, overhead and PZM and
remix the whole from the sample stream as if you had the whole lot recorded. If you
prefer you can bounce down to 14 tracks of Audio and work from there.
Nice...
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jules2005
member
Joined: 14/08/03
Posts: 34
Loc: London
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This makes for interesting reading. I had a little look at BFD at the recent Sounds
Expo and was quite impressed. It was a bit of a crush and I didn't get time to really test
it out.
I've been looking for good Jazz Drum samples / Rompler etc and have so
far not found anything. What do you reckon? Would BFD give me a human / realistic jazz
drum groove? I got the impression that it was quite rock oriented. Are there enough
nuances for jazz?
Your thoughts, as ever, much appreciated!
Cheers
Jules
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Very quick reply Jules as I am away from my normal base of operation and don't have access
at present.
The basic Rompler comes with a variety of kits including some older
ones which might make for nice jazz, but lacks brush samples... I gather the XFL
expansion comes with these extras although I have yet to pick it up so can't comment
specifically on their usefulness.
Standard stores like DV have it on tap...
well the Barnet one does... 
Strongly suggest a listen!
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Silvercloud
member
Joined: 18/01/02
Posts: 176
Loc: Fleet, Hampshire
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I bought BFD recently.
My favourite kit is the Ayotte. It sounds a lot like
XTC's Terry Chambers circa the 'drums and wires' album. Very live and ringy. Excellent
for rock but I did start to worry about the huuuge sound dominating the mix.
Lo and behold along comes version 1.5 for download at fxpansion and the 'ringy' problem
is solved via the new added damping controls. you can now emulate that cardboard thuddy
70s drum sound by applying the damping on full. This now makes BFD an extremely versatile
drum tool.
This is definitely the most convincing non loop based drum
software I have ever used.
-------------------- | Apple iMac 2.4g | OSX 10.5.2 | 4GB RAM | MOTU 828 Mk I | AMT8 | Logic Pro 8.0.1 | Stylus RMX | Ohmboyz | Ampeg SVX
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Yup the update is very welcome.
This has become a standard writing tool for me.
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the clash
Joined: 08/04/05
Posts: 233
Loc: Albion
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Hey thanks for the info, my copy of BFD should be arriving this week. 0.5MB RAM?! Good job
I have just got 2.5GB RAM installed in my new Dual Core PowerMac! BFD will do nicely for
Acoustic Drums but I am also looking for something for Electronic drums, Stylus RMX
perhaps? Im not too keen on Logic's Ultrabeat and I want plenty of of preset beats to mess
about with which Ultrabeat doesn't seem to have. Cheers.
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Glenn Bucci
member
Joined: 28/10/02
Posts: 971
Loc: Pennsylvania
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The BFD software contains a 9 GB library with a total of seven drum kits. The need for so
much memory is clear after hearing how great the drums sound. The XFL edition adds a 22 GB
library on top of the original BFD. To run these smoothly, I'd recommend having a G5 or
Pent IV with a minimum of 1 GB of ram. Thankfully the cost of ram is pretty cheap these
days. My test computer had 1.5 GB of ram and has been smoothly running Cubase SX 3 on my
PC. Using additional programs such as Giga Studio or hungry plug-ins such as Waves IR-1,
it would be helpful to go to 2 GB of ram. Starting up the program there is one main
screen, which is a nice touch and keeps things simple. The Groove Library contains almost
1000 patterns, and is accessed by a pull-down menu bar at the top of screen. The different
types of grooves include many rock, pop, heavy metal, jazz fusion, and more. Drum grooves
can be auditioned before putting them in the either Bank A or Bank B. Additionally, there
are separate slots for drum fills. Once a desired groove is found, drag it into one of the
slots in Bank A. BFD runs with GM mapping and allows for the ability to tune each drum and
cymbal as well as control volume, dynamics, solo, mute, and panning. The mics can also be
moved farther or closer to the kit, which has the affect of controlling how much bleed
come through the mics.
Another great feature is the ability to blend the
different kits together. For instance, if the DWR kit has been chosen as the main kit, but
you want to use a different kick drum, just click the kick drum icon on the left and all
the kick drums of each set shows up. Then each kick drum can be auditioned and and then
selected by double clicking to install that kick with current drum kit. The kits included
are DW, Pearl, Ludwig, Slingerland, Ayotte, Leedy, and Lucite. In order to make the drums
sound more life like, velocity can be adjusted on the hits. BFD can deviate a little or a
lot while playing a groove, which helps to alleviate that monotonous, robotic sound in
which every hit on the snare sounds the same. Additionally, BFD allows for the same
flexibility with the timing, and quantize features. The output of the drum kit includes
Stereo, Groups or All. BFD Stereo mixes everything on a stereo track, while the Groups
give 4 separate outputs of the four main groups. All gives 14 separate outs. This allows
for EQ'ing part of the kit separately as well as adding reverb or compression.
The only problem I found with the BFD was that the drums had a tendency to sound big and
ringy. I tried reducing the room mic level and have more overheads, but it only helped to
a certain extent. Thankfully with their latest update 1.5, it gives the ability to dampen
the drums as well as a cymbal grab choke, giving for even more control of the drums. Drums
grooves and fills can be repeated and looped by holding down the key on a midi keyboard.
The BFD program can also be triggered by the midi drum kits such as Roland V Drums. The
other and less costly method is to work with several different grooves and then switching
back and forth between them with a midi keyboard. Each groove and fill is triggered on a
different key the keyboard. Starting on the far left side of the keyboard, each part of
the drum kit can be triggered separately. You can create your own grooves which can be
saved in BFD. I found a combination of using my own created grooves together with what BFD
offers to be a good way to work. The only other drum program out there that gives such
authentic drum sounds is Toontrack's DFH Superior. One isn't necessarily better, and they
both give excellent results. The only benefit of Fxpansion's BFD is that it includes
grooves and fills which the Toontrack's DFH does not. The average price for the BFD
program and XFL separately is $299. FXpansion has done a great job with this program, and
if you're looking for raw drum sounds, check out BFD.
-------------------- revelationsoundstudio.com
Edited by Blueberry (07/12/05 02:05 AM)
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gerard
Joined: 07/02/05
Posts: 2608
Loc: London, UK
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i'm using Logic Express7 - does BFD work "natively" as an AudioUnit in Logic?
that is, do i need to buy that VST to AU converter thingy?
is about 180 quid (including VAT) a good price in the UK?
thanks!
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Quote gerard:
i'm using
Logic Express7 - does BFD work "natively" as an AudioUnit in Logic?
that is, do
i need to buy that VST to AU converter thingy?
is about 180 quid
(including VAT) a good price in the UK?
thanks!
I think the only real problem child for BFD
is ProTools which can only work in stereo rather than 14 separate channels, but check the
website, it lists the functionality for all platforms...
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Neo-Classical Guitar...
active member
Joined: 07/08/01
Posts: 1590
Loc: Bradford, West Yorkshire
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BFD DELUXE has been out for a little while now and comes on about five dual layer DVD's!
You need to be using BFD v1.5 to be compatible and it costs the same as the XFL upgrade
pack.
http://www.fxpansion.com/product-deluxe-main.php
NCGM
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RegressiveRock
Just half a pint of cherryade for me
Joined: 01/09/04
Posts: 4038
Loc: Knebworth, Herts
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Quote Neo-Classical Guitar Man:
BFD DELUXE has been out for a little while now and comes on about five dual layer DVD's!
You need to be using BFD v1.5 to be compatible and it costs the same as the XFL upgrade
pack.

http://www.fxpansion.com/product-deluxe-main.php
NCGM
Handy info
NCGM... 
(But I do believe you work for the distributors of this fine product... )
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Angus_FX
Joined: 09/08/05
Posts: 6
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Quote:
I think the only
real problem child for BFD is ProTools which can only work in stereo rather than 14
separate channels, but check the website, it lists the functionality for all platforms...
This was true a while
back, but since Pro Tools 6.7 came out, BFD has been able to output all 34 channels to PT.
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www.7161.com
Joined: 02/09/04
Posts: 697
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http://www.7161.com/tr/dancetech_BFD_+_VDrums_Divx.avi.torrent
a torrent link for a video of BFD & VDRUMS together featuring expansion pack 'Jazz
& Funk' drums
-------------------- www.7161.com
Free online music space & Homepages
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keepinthegroove
Joined: 18/07/06
Posts: 1
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I would love to check that video out but can't get it to work. I have installed the Div x
player, but it generates an error whenever it goes to play it.... any tips??
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SparkyG
Joined: 22/01/07
Posts: 202
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Hi BFD users.
I'm yet to take the plunge although it looks likely. I have
one quesion: I'll be using this to create drum backing tracks for live use with my
duo. We currently use a Boss DR5 and hence have loads of midi files we should be able to
feed into BFD. My question though is can I reduce the amount of reverb/ambience on
the sounds to almost a dry sound? I need to be able to do this since we use a BOSE line
array PA (the L1 system) which radiates really wide and hence you get plenty of natural
reverb at most venues (we never need reverb on our vocals). So if I can't reduce the
ambience when you add a natural room reverb as well it could all turn to mush. The demos
on the website would sound terrible in a hall with our system.
Hope you can
help
thanks
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mcguirk
Joined: 08/09/04
Posts: 607
Loc: Wendover, Bucks
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Quote SparkyG:
Hi BFD users.
I'm yet to take the plunge although it looks likely. I have one quesion: I'll be using this to create drum backing tracks for live use with my duo. We currently
use a Boss DR5 and hence have loads of midi files we should be able to feed into BFD. My question though is can I reduce the amount of reverb/ambience on the sounds to almost
a dry sound? I need to be able to do this since we use a BOSE line array PA (the L1
system) which radiates really wide and hence you get plenty of natural reverb at most
venues (we never need reverb on our vocals). So if I can't reduce the ambience when
you add a natural room reverb as well it could all turn to mush. The demos on the website
would sound terrible in a hall with our system.
Hope you can help
thanks
Yes, you can.
When using "BFD ALL", there are separate stereo outputs for the overheads, the
room mics, and the PZMs, so it's totally controllable.
Beware though, the
single kit sounds are *very* dry, so might need some work. That's just how I like it.
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SparkyG
Joined: 22/01/07
Posts: 202
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Cool - Thanks for the response - soinds like it will work just fine.
Hope it
is ok with Pro-Tools LE and Garage Band
cheers
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