Quote hollowsun:Quote Off duty BBQ lighter AKA Idris:
that's bullshit .
It's a rare thing for Johnny H and I to agree but I'm afraid he is correct. Arturia's CS80 is an excellent software synth with excellent graphics, etc., but I've done A/B tests between the real thing and the plug-in and there really isn't any comparison. The 'real thing' really does move more air than the emulation... and it moves air in a different way, a more engaging way.
Not just that but (as discussed earlier) the polyphonic aftertouch was a key to the real CS80's sound and expressivity which is simply not possible today unless you have something like an old Ensoniq SQ80 but even its poly AT is not a match for the CS80's 'natural' and 'organic' AT with its wooden and weighted keyboard and totally smooth control voltage (rather than a stream of stepped MIDI controller values).
It's the same with their Moog modular...
It sounds great but it can't compare with the real thing which is a living, breathing beast.
I have a Synthesizers.com modular sitting right next to me ... real analogue, discrete(ish) components for the flow of electrickery ... and it's a monster sounding thing. It should carry a health warning and as I say, is living and breathing and almost with a life of its own and I liken my relationship with it to my daughter's symbiotic relationship with the wooden thing she scrapes called a violin and gets such emotive, living tones from with such astonishing subtlety and which can take your breath away.
I'm not knocking Arturia's stuff - far from it - because they make great stuff and they are terrific software synths in their own right but they don't/can't compare with the originals (apart from their Minimoog emulation is actually very good and quite close - they got something right with that ... and I've done side by side A/B tests).
I have found this myself - I've sampled valve/tube oscillators, analogue oscillators and digital oscillators. You'd think a sine's a sine's a sine ... but they're not - there's 'something' about a sine wave generated by valves or by transistors or digitally generated 100110101s ... they all look ostensibly the same on a scope but they ARE different and sound different - the valve/tube waveforms are very 'organic' and engage with you as do, to a slightly lesser degree, the discrete transistor versions but the digitally generated 100110101s? Sorry - no comparison.
And when you compare a digital emulation of the CS80 (or whatever) with its perfect voicing compared with an original and all the vagaries of discrete voices each with their own vagaries due to component tolerance and wear and flaws and non-linear distortions and subtle discrepancies (different for each voice card), well... there is no comparison...
And that's before you even factor in the poly AT and the smooth voltage control.
It's a bit like comparing an orchestral or solo violin sample library with 'the real thing'. The sample library will be good but no replacement for a real orchestra or violin soloist, both of which have a life and expression of their own.
Like the CS80!
The vids that Mr H put up cannot convey the true might of a real CS80 on full tilt - it can be overpowering .... and then you lean into just one note and it sings over the others and tears your heart out!
The videos were the first few things that came up in youtube... but even so, there is a night and day difference between the vst and the real thing. Even with the lowest quality 240p youtube coming out of some tiny laptop speakers! Play them together on a good system and its like comparing a stradivarius with a general midi violin.
Much as I disagree with Hollowsun about current affairs, I always respect people who use their ears and have a genuine passion for sound. It upsets me greatly every time I hear such total nonsense such as 'xxx vst sounds indistinguishable from the real thing, and 'people don't care, they only listen to mp3s out of a tin can, they are happy with the sound of a penny whistle recorded into a soundblaster 16'.
The thing about music lovers, is they love music. It seems there is a sort of snobbery on here, the attitude that 'I have great monitors, I know EQ ranges and how to use a compressor, therefore I know more about music than the great unwashed'. Its not true. Musical people appreciate great sounds, whether they know the internal workings or not. And lets be honest, anyone who will stand up and put their professional opinion on the line and say the CS80v is a reasonable emulation of the CS80 needs to change careers immediately!