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Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

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Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby MSUmusician23 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:34 pm

Hey guys!

I'm working on getting gear around to record my first batch of finished songs. I'm super pumped about it, but on most days I'm a dirt poor college kid. I can't afford studio time, and I've got pretty much everything I need for a home studio. I just need drum microphones. has anyone heard of this pyle pro kit? It seems to be getting great reviews on all the sites it's sold on. I'm just not completely sold on it yet.

If anyone has any experience with these mics, or any mic-kit recommendations for under three hundo, let 'em fly.

Cheers!
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby The Red Bladder » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:45 pm

They are (as the price implies) just some badged Chinese rubbish mics.

Sadly ALL these cheap sets are a gross waste of money. The Audix DP5A 5-piece Drum Mic Package is almost certainly the cheapest you will get that actually works. (And don't go for the Audix 'Fusion' set either, it too is rubbish!)
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Beat Poet » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:47 pm

I recommend the AKG Rhythm Pack, though you'll likely need a 57 to augment it.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby grab » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:30 pm

SM57 on snare, AKG D112 or Audix D6 on kick, and a couple of reasonable condensor mics on overheads. Job done.

If you really want tom mics, various people here have recommended the bargain-basement "Yoga" ones as being good enough for the price, until you want to spend proper money on proper mics. Never used them myself - I've got some nice Audix tom mics (which really don't get much use, TBH).
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby James Perrett » Fri Feb 24, 2012 5:50 pm

I'm one of those who recommend the Yoga tom mics to anyone wanting a set of cheap mics. If you can't afford SM57's or Sennheiser 604's then get the Yoga mics rather than anything priced in between.

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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Mike Stranks » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:14 pm

"Yoga 606" is what to look for... I like them too at the budget end of the spectrum. I presume you'll be able to get them in the States.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby shufflebeat » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:21 pm

Wasn't there some talk of a drum mic set from Karma Mics which PW gave such a glowing review to several moons ago?
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby The Elf » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:28 pm

The Red Bladder wrote:ALL these cheap sets are a gross waste of money.
+1

Begin collecting decent mic's (and a couple of SM57s would be a great start) and do the job as best you can - drum mic kits are invariably a waste of money. You'll keep the 57s for life, but the same will not be said of many of the mic's in one of these kits.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Mike Stranks » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:24 pm

shufflebeat wrote:Wasn't there some talk of a drum mic set from Karma Mics which PW gave such a glowing review to several moons ago?
I guess you mean these:

Karma Mic Set

You can also click-through to Paul's review there.

I see that Karma are now also doing a specific set of drum mics, but they look to be no more than variations on the usual Chinese theme. Having tried a pair of the tiny Karma 'Silver Bullets' I think I'd be more inclined to go for the seven-set of those than the 'drum set'. Much cheaper too and they'd always have a use for other applications in the future. A bonus for the O/P is that Karma are in the States so he'd have no problem getting the mics.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby turtles » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:33 pm

Wot the elf said.
Don't go for a whole-drum box-of-mics unless the budget is big- and even then, probably not.
I have used, and am impressed with, the karma silver bullets. They are so cheap that it's not really worth thinking about. Use the rest of your budget for two sm57s and something second hand for the kick.
It's much easier to work with a set of fairly multipurpose 'standards' and redeploy them on guitar cabs etc. if needed... Can't really do that with dedicated drum mics.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Guy Johnson » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:59 am

The Elf wrote:
The Red Bladder wrote:ALL these cheap sets are a gross waste of money.

+1

Begin collecting decent mic's (and a couple of SM57s would be a great start) and do the job as best you can - drum mic kits are invariably a waste of money. You'll keep the 57s for life, but the same will not be said of many of the mic's in one of these kits.


Might I say at this point, Bollox?

I was tempted to leave it there! But ...

~ The questioner needs a mic set for not a lot of dosh, so.
~ Getting drum tuning right, the mic-positioning right, and the room right is much more to the point than any mike!
~ Therefore the money saved on mics can be used for room treatment, gobos etc.
~ With a set of t-bone mics he can record NOW and in many different ways, and really learn stuff with them

Although getting classic mics is deffo better than not, the OP will also have a whole bunch of different mics that will be useful for micing cabs, accy guitars, vocals.

There is somuch folklore in audio about what MUST Be Used (cue angry god effects).

I've been able to get really great sounds, both live and recorded, with various t-boners . Also fab sounds with 'better' mics too of course. I'd rather use the best mics I can, especially for overheads, but mics are subordinate to getting the sound and the mic placing right.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby shufflebeat » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:58 pm

Mike Stranks wrote:...Having tried a pair of the tiny Karma 'Silver Bullets' I think I'd be more inclined to go for the seven-set of those than the 'drum set'.

I stuck a single SB in front of a kit for an emergency multitrack for video the other night. it was the best sounding thing on the recording, and the rest wasn't bad. Not close micing, though.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby The Elf » Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:00 pm

Guy Johnson wrote:
The Elf wrote:
The Red Bladder wrote:ALL these cheap sets are a gross waste of money.

+1

Begin collecting decent mic's (and a couple of SM57s would be a great start) and do the job as best you can - drum mic kits are invariably a waste of money. You'll keep the 57s for life, but the same will not be said of many of the mic's in one of these kits.


Might I say at this point, Bollox?

You can say anything you like. But the OP was asking about 'best drum mic's for value'. In that context I stand by what I said.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Mixedup » Sun Feb 26, 2012 5:33 pm

OP: you'll get this sort of disagreeing thread all day long unpess you can tell us what budget you have available. 'value' means different things to different people. So, low as it may be, can you tell us how much you're prepared to spend?

Am I right in thinking those Karma mics are all omnis? If so, I wouldn't recommend them as a starter kit for many styles as you'll have to learn to work with spill, which s doable, but a big ask for a beginner.

The MXL stuff isn't bad for $ in the US. You could get away with a stereo oh pair and a kick and snare mic. (look up 'recorderman an glynn johns technique). Don't know if your budget streches that far?
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Marcin_Siejka » Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:06 am

Hi...

+1 for "Don't buy drum set mic's"

You did mention your budget:
MSUmusician23 wrote:any mic-kit recommendations for under three hundo...

Is that "£" or "$" or any other currency?

If I were doing firs demo?
I'd go all in ex-demo... (display units open boxes and all that stuff)

- 2x Shure SM57
- 1X AKG D112 or Audix D6 or Beta 52 (take your pick)
- 2x MXL??? or Rode NT1 or Audio Technica AT 20?? or Oktava or SE Electronics SE??? or AKG Perception...

Plus I'd contact Audio Technica (and others) for "Firs Impressions" try-before-buy thing.
That gives you two more (very good) mics to play with for two weeks (free) you'll also get discount if you decide to buy one of their mics

Ohhh and Google "DIY Subkick"...

Have fun!


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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby grab » Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:17 am

Karma have some cardioid pencils too.

Re Recorderman vs Glyn Johns, you'll be fine with Glyn Johns if your drummer doesn't have a clicky kick mic. The first time you meet a clicky kick mic, your kick is going to be way off down one ear, which sounds strange. Recorderman guarantees that your kick stays in the middle of the stereo image.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Tomás Mulcahy » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:00 pm

grab wrote:Recorderman guarantees that your kick stays in the middle of the stereo image.

So does proper stereo miking technique (i.e. not using a randomly spaced pair of cardioids), aka using your ears to position them...

I've found that an XY overhead/ kit setup works far better than recorderman. Can never get recorderman to sit in the mix right.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Sam1978 » Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:02 pm

I've always used the BETA 52A on the kick and I love it. No too expensive and good sound.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Fri Mar 09, 2012 4:41 pm

grab wrote:...you'll be fine with Glyn Johns if your drummer doesn't have a clicky kick mic. The first time you meet a clicky kick mic, your kick is going to be way off down one ear, which sounds strange.

Do you mean a 'clicky kick mic', or just a clicky kick drum?

If the latter, I presume the lop-sided effect is because the floor tom provides some acoustic shadowing of the HF elements of the clicky bass to the left hand overhead in the GJ method.

Recorderman guarantees that your kick stays in the middle of the stereo image.

I guess this is because the left hand overhead is rather higher and can still 'see' the kick drum.

I must admit, I've never used the 'Recorderman' technique, although I have used the GJ technique a few times. I generally prefer XY overheads, though.

In all cases, it is imperative to get the overheads equi-distant from the snare and, unless you roll all the bass out of them (which you should if you're cloemiking the individual drums), equi-distant from the kick too. Failure to do this will produce lop-sided mixes.

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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby grab » Fri Mar 09, 2012 6:44 pm

Could well be the equidistance thing - it's guaranteed with Recorderman, but it's not something I'd met with Glyn Johns.

It wasn't something I noticed with our previous drummer, probably bcos (a) the balanced overhead point was a bit higher, and (b) his kick was deep and woofly. On our current drummer's kit, the overhead sounds better lower and the kick is much more clicky though, and it was very obviously wrong. Unfortunately it was very obviously wrong *after* we'd recorded, bcos I was in a hurry and I'd not checked the overheads in stereo.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Fri Mar 09, 2012 6:55 pm

Oops! easily done, but highlights the importance of spending time getting it right at the recording, and the time consuming difficulty of fixing things afterwards compared to a few minutes during the session.

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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Jack Ruston » Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:33 pm

Off topic but another issue I've come across with 'recorderman' overheads is one where a weird imaging artifact occurs with the crash cymbals. One seems to swing across the stereo image suddenly. It's infrequent, but very strange and offputting. I mentioned this to another engineer who was using the technique and he also had come across the issue. Personally I prefer spaced overheads, XY or mono with stereo rooms.

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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby The Elf » Fri Mar 09, 2012 7:56 pm

Jack Ruston wrote:Personally I prefer spaced overheads, XY...
+1

'Recorderman' sounds inherently very 'roomy' to me - I prefer to add room mic's to taste.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby chew_rocket » Sat Mar 10, 2012 1:27 am

A 'glyn johns method' fan here!

I think its great if your mic cabinet is limited. I'v even gotten great results recording a live band back in the day when i only had 8 inputs. I prefer XY and room mics, though I would pick GJ over just XY with no room mics.

Either way, I find measuring both mics equally from the centre of the snare absolutely essential!
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby humandrums » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:11 pm

I'm a dirt poor college kid.


sounds like the op is on a very tight budget to me!!! i asked this question a while back for an at home setup as i really couldnt justify another expensive (to me) setup like i have in my recording space. the silver bullets were mentioned and some mics off cpc, also red audio mics, as it happened i didnt go for any mics in the end i got another ekit and use superior drummer isntead, so i can keep the neighbours from kicking off lol
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Exalted Wombat » Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:55 pm

humandrums wrote:sounds like the op is on a very tight budget to me!!! i asked this question a while back for an at home setup as i really couldnt justify another expensive (to me) setup like i have in my recording space. the silver bullets were mentioned and some mics off cpc, also red audio mics, as it happened i didnt go for any mics in the end i got another ekit and use superior drummer isntead, so i can keep the neighbours from kicking off lol

If an ekit is considered an acceptable alternative to miced real drums, any discussion of WHICH mics to use seems a minor issue!
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Sat Mar 10, 2012 2:50 pm

Jack Ruston wrote:...a weird imaging artifact occurs with the crash cymbals. One seems to swing across the stereo image suddenly.

I've heard this too, and I think it is caused by the physical movement of the cymbal. Cymbals tend to have a 'null' in their 'polar pattern' which extends on the plane of the cymbal's rim. If the cymbal is walloped and then tilts and swings on its stand, that 'null' may well point briefly in the direction of one or other of the overheads, resulting in a brief dip in level and a corresponding violent image shift.

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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby ronmac » Sat Mar 10, 2012 3:43 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:
Jack Ruston wrote:...a weird imaging artifact occurs with the crash cymbals. One seems to swing across the stereo image suddenly.

I've heard this too, and I think it is caused by the physical movement of the cymbal. Cymbals tend to have a 'null' in their 'polar pattern' which extends on the plane of the cymbal's rim. If the cymbal is walloped and then tilts and swings on its stand, that 'null' may well point briefly in the direction of one or other of the overheads, resulting in a brief dip in level and a corresponding violent image shift.

Hugh

Not to mention them also being an excellent moving reflective surface for everything else to bounce off.
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby mjfe2 » Sun Mar 11, 2012 4:48 pm

Jack Ruston wrote:Off topic but another issue I've come across with 'recorderman' overheads is one where a weird imaging artifact occurs with the crash cymbals. One seems to swing across the stereo image suddenly. It's infrequent, but very strange and offputting. I mentioned this to another engineer who was using the technique and he also had come across the issue. Personally I prefer spaced overheads, XY or mono with stereo rooms.

J

I've noticed the same thing every time I've used GJ method too -- probably the only way to avoid it is 'spot' mic-ing every cymbal with an overhead to avoid the null that Hugh mentioned, but that hardly seems rock n roll! I quite like the swishy effect tbh
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Re: Best Drum Mics for Value? ? ? ? ? ?

Postby chris... » Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:15 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:I've heard this too, and I think it is caused by the physical movement of the cymbal. Cymbals tend to have a 'null' in their 'polar pattern' which extends on the plane of the cymbal's rim. If the cymbal is walloped and then tilts and swings on its stand, that 'null' may well point briefly in the direction of one or other of the overheads, resulting in a brief dip in level and a corresponding violent image shift.
Presumably if mic is well above the cymbal, this shouldn't happen, right ?
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