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It's all over :( :(

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It's all over :( :(

Postby Imran500 » Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:11 pm

My bloody Dell is dying on it's arse - constantly crashing while using Reaper (which incidentally I started using because Cubase was crashing on the new system) and I've had enough of the damn thing.

I should have waited till I could afford something better but I foolishly jumped in to save a couple of months!!!

Anyway it's not the end of the world, I needed to upgrade the USB interface anyway so I might as well do it all properly once and for all.

Can anyone recommend any good companies that make audio PCs - I just want to buy something rock solid and designed for music, made by someone who knows what they are doing.

I don't trust myself to make these decisions anymore
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Thu Sep 17, 2009 3:59 pm

Of course I'm not going to tell you not to get a nice new audio computer but.....


Have you checked for an actual hardware fault in your machine, this is a new machine isn't it so you should be able to replace parts under warranty.

Some stress test such as Memtest86+ and Prime95 would be good starting points.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Imran500 » Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:04 pm

Hey thanks for that! I've run Memtest for an hour but no errors there
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby IvanSC » Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:13 pm

Been following your trials and tribulations... did you buy if FROM Dell?

i`d be asking some pretty searching questions before just walking away from it, if I were you.

Of course, if you bought it at PC World, forget it - just walk away and accept you learnt a hard, expensive lesson.

Will it work as just a plain internetty machine if you replace it as your music computer, or is it a total loss?
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Imran500 » Thu Sep 17, 2009 7:50 pm

Strangely enough it's passing the memory tests and torture tests with flying colours! Good old Dell eh

Super Drummer 2.0 seems to be messing with Reaper in some way - the crashes are related to this VST (I assumed because it's RAM hungry and there was a RAM problem) but not according to these test programs...
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:09 pm

Memtest has to run for around 15 hours! so put it on over night. This should give the system a good work out, any crashes or memory errors and you've got a problem.

Then give Prime95 a good run on all the cores, again give is a nice long time to test.

That should pick most hardware problems, conflicts and DPC and driver issues aren't quite as easy to test for though!

What OS are you on? also 32 or 64bit?
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Jumpeyspyder » Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:13 pm

Hi Imram

A couple of thoughts :-

a/ Have you run a Virus /spyware check ?


b/ Quite often new machines come loaded with loads of free software that likes to run in the background

Do you run temparature monitoring software ?

Do you have a lots of stuff in the system tray ?

How many processes are running when you've just started up the machine ?

I'd be thinking of a nice clean reinstall
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Imran500 » Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:35 pm

I've done all the XP optimisations that SOS recommended and I've booted out a lot of the unneeded software/ processes.

It also never goes on the net (unless registering products) so I'd be shocked if it's a virus but I suppose I'd better eliminate that. I don't use any temperature monitoring software - that was one thing I was worried about with the Dell, i.e. uprated cooling was maybe required?

By the way it's XP 32bit.

Memtest is back on so will leave it over night...

Fingers crossed it's the memory coz at least I can just rip it out and stick some OCZ in or something.

Ivan - it's actually fine unless I run Reaper, it would be fine as an internet PC alhough the Q9300 would be a bit of a waste.

By the way DirectSolutions, your PCs are excellent value. I might look at slightly re-jigging your Producer PC (going Quad + another drive) if the s**t properly hits the fan with this one!!!
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Dan Bo » Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:39 pm

Apple make nice computers for audio

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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:01 pm

Really Dan? i though that they had all sorts of issues with using their own multi core machines at the moment, partly down to the closed nature of their EFI, but lets not get into that hey

Back on topic! When the crash happens is it a system crash as in a restart, blue screen, or is an application quit, lock.

Have you checked the Reaper forums for known issues with that VSTi and Reaper, also when you've got it all loaded how much RAM are you using (check task manager, look at how much Reaper has loaded)? Have you done the /3GB switch?

These are just some things to check out before getting a new machine, because if it's a slight bug between a plugin and the host then you could find the same issue again.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Dan Bo » Thu Sep 17, 2009 10:31 pm

Imran500 wrote:Can anyone recommend any good companies that make audio PCs - I just want to buy something rock solid and designed for music, made by someone who knows what they are doing.

Admittedly my post was in jest but very clearly "on-topic"

Im not trying to start a war just suggesting an alternative and no i dont work for Apple

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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Thu Sep 17, 2009 11:08 pm

Well as this is the PC forum, being on topic could be questioned, just as I wouldn't post in the MAC forum telling someone what spec PC to get when they asked about a MAC.

Anywho, I'm off to bed!
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby jvcandy » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:22 am

Hello

Since both Reaper and Cubase crash on your machine. The app in question could be a vst plug-in. I had similar issues when soft synths from native instruments get a corrupted database.

If you do have many plug-ins, it will be a good idea to move them all to a temporary folder and try both apps without loading them.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Dan Bo » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:40 am

directresolution.com wrote:Well as this is the PC forum, being on topic could be questioned, just as I wouldn't post in the MAC forum telling someone what spec PC to get when they asked about a MAC.

Anywho, I'm off to bed!

I believe PC stands for personal computer but nevermind.



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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Will_m » Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:00 am

Dan Bo wrote:
directresolution.com wrote:Well as this is the PC forum, being on topic could be questioned, just as I wouldn't post in the MAC forum telling someone what spec PC to get when they asked about a MAC.

Anywho, I'm off to bed!

I believe PC stands for personal computer but nevermind.



Dan

Grow up.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby A Non O Miss » Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:03 am

Interesting. Last time I was in need of a computer I was looking for a beefy audio computer but at the end of the day I needed a new mic and compressor so I went ahead and got a DELL. I customized it as best I could and upgraded the RAM and I was skeptical at first with the assumption that it was going to be pretty sketchy.

I must say I have been overly impressed with it. Other then the Vista factor, which I have gotten used to, and all its processes and services you need to disable it has been a super stable machine considering the stuff I throw at it. At one time I was using it for Audio, Video & Graphic/Photo work, flawlessly (knock on wood)

I can get some pretty large sessions going on too and when it is clean and all the settings are tight it operates just fine.

So anyways, I think a specially designed audio machine will be good, but I am shocked at the DELL being complete garbage for you and decided to share my positive experience which doesn't help you very much.

Anyways, carry on!
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Dan Bo » Fri Sep 18, 2009 2:05 am

Deary deary me, some people really do have a bee in their bonnett. Now i suppose the "grown up" thing to do is to explain myself and consider myself suitably chastised for uttering the word Apple in the PC forum (which i think should be renamed to the Windows music forum, but hey what can you do)

My initial post was in jest and directadvert.com responded in jest aswell which is all fine and jesty.
My point is that the OP was about how he has had it with his PC and wants to know of other people out there making good solid Personal computers for audio. I suggested Apple but did not imply he had to use OSX as we all know he could still use Windows on a Mac should he so wish.
As directfella.com has pointed out on this very forum, Apple Macs were for a while just intel based machines with very similar componenets to windows Pc's with a different OS.

As for growing up??? Flattery will get you nowhere young man.

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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby InactiveX » Fri Sep 18, 2009 9:00 am

Dan Bo wrote:(which i think should be renamed to the Windows music forum, but hey what can you do)

Not wanting to divert things further off-topic, but I would like to see this too.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Pete Kaine » Fri Sep 18, 2009 9:03 am

directresolution.com wrote:Well as this is the PC forum, being on topic could be questioned, just as I wouldn't post in the MAC forum telling someone what spec PC to get when they asked about a MAC.

Anywho, I'm off to bed!

Did you wake up screaming in terror at the thought of single button mice?

Dan Bo wrote:
My point is that the OP was about how he has had it with his PC and wants to know of other people out there making good solid Personal computers for audio. I suggested Apple but did not imply he had to use OSX as we all know he could still use Windows on a Mac should he so wish.

So he could find out what's in the mac and then purchase the parts from a shop for half the price and get them to build it?

Anyhow....

OP. When your running Prime95 run coretemp along side it to see how hot your cpu's going. Could be a dust build up/loose heatsink that's causing an overheat and crash on you.

Also goto control panel/sytem click advanced then startup and recovery. Untick "automatically restart" and click ok and exit. If it crashs and then bluescreens it'll display it for you to write down the bsod code. Tell us what it says and we maybe able to help you further.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby grab » Fri Sep 18, 2009 11:49 am

Reaper is currently playing silly buggers with me too. In my case, the problem is that it doesn't play nicely with interfaces when you remove them. If you only ever have one Firewire interface plugged in, then great. But if you head off somewhere to do some recording on a Firewire interface, then come back home and try to switch to the internal soundcard for some mixing, Reaper says "OK, I'll just use this Firewire interface for a minute.... hey, where'd it go?!" and falls over big style. Got a bug report in on the Reaper forum for this, but no reply yet.

I'm also having problems with VST effects. Might not be Reaper's fault, except I never had it happen before I upgraded to the latest version (3.104).
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby marsnic » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:45 pm

Dan Bo wrote:

Flattery will get you nowhere young man.



And all this time I thought Brian Clough was a PC user....and er... also dead
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby jayzed » Fri Sep 18, 2009 12:52 pm

I hope we can all continue to use PC when referring to Windows based machines and Mac when referring to Apple. Yes, I know that PC stands for personal computer but it also stands for the IBM PC, (then IBM PC AT) which were the actual models that started the whole x86 shennanigans. For years people would write 'PC Compatible' as IBM quickly became overtaken by other makers but it's a bit of a mouthful so PC became the standard. I, for one, perfer this two letter abbreviation.

Alternatively, we could also stop spelling 'through' and change it to 'thru' as well as all the thousands of other words the Americans so unsucessfully tried to change a century ago - only a dozen or so stuck and now it's just a hodgepodge. By the way, I also think the metric system is better.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Pete Kaine » Fri Sep 18, 2009 1:38 pm

JohnnyT wrote: By the way, I also think the metric system is better.

Would you rather have a pint of beer or a litre of beer?
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Will_m » Fri Sep 18, 2009 2:33 pm

Dan Bo wrote:Deary deary me, some people really do have a bee in their bonnett. Now i suppose the "grown up" thing to do is to explain myself and consider myself suitably chastised for uttering the word Apple in the PC forum (which i think should be renamed to the Windows music forum, but hey what can you do)

My initial post was in jest and directadvert.com responded in jest aswell which is all fine and jesty.
My point is that the OP was about how he has had it with his PC and wants to know of other people out there making good solid Personal computers for audio. I suggested Apple but did not imply he had to use OSX as we all know he could still use Windows on a Mac should he so wish.
As directfella.com has pointed out on this very forum, Apple Macs were for a while just intel based machines with very similar componenets to windows Pc's with a different OS.

As for growing up??? Flattery will get you nowhere young man.

Dan

As witty and jesty as you are Dan I just don't think your comments were helpful to the OP and although you say they were in jest, to me at least they came across as troll worthy. I'm sure you were expecting a reaction, as I can imagine that the OP is already aware of such fruit branded 'solid personal computers for audio'.

I'll finish with a little smiley, just to let you know I'm all fun and games really.

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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Dave B » Fri Sep 18, 2009 2:43 pm

It's all so odd really isn't it - if you happen to be a prior Windows user who moved to Mac and mention this, you are trolling.

No. Now it's time for you some people round here to grow up and get a life!

It was a valid comment. It was also made light heartedly. If you have neither the wit nor intelligence to take it in the manner in which is was offered then frankly you should only be allowed coloured crayons and safety scissors - let alone access to the internet!

Whilst some people here have very obvious agendas that are pro-Windows, some people here are just users of kit relaying personal experiences. If that offends you then frankly you need to move to a more suitable forum that satisfies your need for such a rabidly closed minded view of the world. After all, you don't see ridiculous arguments, abuse and tears shed over "Fender vs Gibson" in the Guitar Forum ....

Get a grip!
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Imran500 » Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:21 pm

What the hell's going on around here!

Anyway back on topic - 13 hours of Memtest = no errors.

Next will be a good Prime95 workout. Is there any risk to the PC stressing all the cores long term (I'm gonna do another overnighter with this)

Pete - will check on the heat and dust so thanks for that.

Grab - this problem started with the latest version of Reaper, however when I reverted to an older version it seems to have stuck.

At first it started happening when I ran loads of VSTs and FX but now I'm running a test project with only Superior 2 and it's crashing the program.

It's not a hard blue screen crash (although that has happened a couple of times in the past unrelated to this) just Reaper shutting down
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:24 pm

Looking at this with facts though a MAC probably wouldn't solve his problems would it, so itis best if we try identify what the issue is before advising to get a new computer.

The iMAC range would offer a lot less power then his current machine and a MAC PRO is in a much higher price range then the OP is looking at anyway.

Both Cubase and Reaper are more geared in reality towards Windows so OSX wouldn't help.

Running windows on a MAC wouldn't solve any host and plugin compatability issue or 32bit address space issues.

I don't think anyone can argue with that?

So to move forward, we really need a little more information from the OP to pin point the problem. Is it just this VSTi, how does the system crash, is it the application or the OS that is crashing?

DKFHS 2 uses a lot of RAM and could be taking the Reaper/Cubase to over the 1.5GB RAM mark, which without the /3GB switch can cause problems.

If there has been an agenda here by some then it is to stop the OP from spending money without trying some last things to solve his problem.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby directresolution.com » Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:32 pm

took too long to post my last response!

Imran500: have you got the latest updates to superior? also have you checked and posted on the Reaper forum for any known issues with this VSTi. Does it crash straight away or is it while you are loading a big kit?


I would run Prime95 when you can keep an eye on the temperature of the computer using a temp monitor app. Properly setup it shouldn't cause any problems being under full load but best to make sure it doesn't get too hot.
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Pete Kaine » Fri Sep 18, 2009 3:36 pm

Imran500 wrote:

Next will be a good Prime95 workout. Is there any risk to the PC stressing all the cores long term (I'm gonna do another overnighter with this)

Shouldn't be. Make sure you have it set to power off at a 100degrees in bios just to make sure. You shouldn't be seeing more than 70 or 80 in a worst case senario. If you are there's your issue.

It may acutrly be worth getting a paint brush and a hoover and getting inside and getting rid of any dirt that's about anyhow. Should be done every few months really by everyone to prolong the life of parts
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Re: It's all over :( :(

Postby Jez Corbett » Fri Sep 18, 2009 4:17 pm

Dave B wrote:It's all so odd really isn't it - if you happen to be a prior Windows user who moved to Mac and mention this, you are trolling.


If you post something on the mac forum suggesting someone gets a PC rather than a mac you get jumped on.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.
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