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Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ken long » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:10 pm

10 year old thread on a timeless debate gets revived!

Where is the popcorn emoji?
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby blinddrew » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:50 pm

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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby The Red Bladder » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:02 pm

What most of these pin-heads who think you can download a sample pack and just use them 'as-is' do not realise, is that they are copyright material and for most of them, the 'Terms and Conditions of Sale' require special permission if they are to be used for anything other than for hobby music making.
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ManFromGlass » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:43 pm

Blinddrew - if you would have posted a person eating hobnobs I would have peed myself!
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby blinddrew » Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:49 pm

Dammit that would have been a much better option!
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ManFromGlass » Mon Aug 13, 2018 1:27 pm

as for Terms And Conditions for pinheads (!)
I haven't looked lately but most of the EULA's I have come across state, yes, they own the copyright but they give permissions for the material to be used for productions including professional use. There used to be a clause that said one can not use the material for release on someone else's loop collection for sale, or some such wording.

I would think not allowing material to be used professionally would be the kiss of death for sales, but the music biz is a strange one so I could be wrong. Don't tell anyone but in a pinch I have used the occasional Apple loop in my music cues.
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby Wintersun Project » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:13 am

Sample loop packs are there for people who cant create something original.
Agree with the concept or not, thats a personal thing.
It's never been for me, ive always been under the impression that if i sounded the same as everyone else, ive kind of missed the point in the first place.
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:20 am

Wintersun Project wrote:ive always been under the impression that if i sounded the same as everyone else, ive kind of missed the point in the first place.

Of course loops form no part of my music, no judgement in that statement, just the way it is. But for my money this is spot on for pretty well any music making. Even in folk and traditional music you're always striving to bring your own feelings and interpretation to the piece.

CC

PS Re-reading that I can think of some exceptions, tribute bands, for instance, and orchestral musicians who place their own individuality at the service of the conductor. But as a general point I think it still stands.
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ManFromGlass » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:49 pm

Lately I've been of the mind that -
Give 10 people the same loops you will not get 10 identical tracks.
Give 10 people an acoustic guitar and have them play Mr Tambourine Man and you'll get 10 different interpretations.

Even the most skilled tribute bands will not sound identical no matter how close.

Our humanity (can't find a better word right now) always injects itself into our creative endeavors, even in the tiniest way.

Whether you like the end result is another topic.
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:05 pm

ManFromGlass wrote:Our humanity (can't find a better word right now) always injects itself into our creative endeavors, even in the tiniest way.

I don't think there is a better word. An interesting thought.

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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby Martin Walker » Tue Aug 14, 2018 2:04 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:
ManFromGlass wrote:Our humanity (can't find a better word right now) always injects itself into our creative endeavors, even in the tiniest way.

I don't think there is a better word. An interesting thought.

Yes, very thought provoking MFG

Although I suspect having listened to some music that the creators do on occasion manage to leave their humanity out of the equation ;)


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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby ManFromGlass » Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:48 pm

this might be too all encompassing or an easy dodge to your comment -
but even the choices of what is left out of the track is part of the human element. And then there are the individual choices made at mix level. Even if a robot did the mix, the programmer of the robot would not have been able to avoid some injection of human.

Then there is chance music or choice by dice etc. the person who rolled the dice made a human decision to accept the results of the roll. Where am I going with this? I don't know - I've managed to overload my brain! :headbang:
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby redlester » Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:14 pm

Just read this entertaining thread for the first time. All I will add is;

I find sometimes a musical loop can give me inspiration to begin a new track, based around maybe a harmony in my head (one for the Buzzcocks fans...) or some other idea it triggers in me. I've done this in the past and found that the original loop gets discarded at some point along the way and doesn't make the final track.

Drum loops I find useful when playing around with ideas like searching for a chord sequence etc. just to get something quickly done without distracting me.

As for the post about Motown being loved 40 years on... Kraftwerk's The Man Machine is now 40 years old. That fact just sends me into all sorts of philosophical thought! :beamup:
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby FrankF » Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:03 pm

Great article in the Graun on this very subject:
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/ ... -pop-music

Aah, the CompuRhythm CR-78!
JAPAN, Foxxy John, delicious Debs, Vienna, Enola Gay etc. etc.
Didn't realise the 78 referred to the year it was "born":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roland_CR-78

A far more important question I want to know the answer to is:
Do Androids Dream of Gemma Chan?
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby The Bunk » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:36 pm

Wintersun Project wrote:Sample loop packs are there for people who cant create something original.

Well I'll put my head above the parapet here and say that sounds like me! Or...either I can't create something original, or I have absolutely no confidence that I can. I've started buying monthly music mags that have sample CDs with them and try and make a "song" from the samples provided (and only the samples provided, nothing more). More as a sort of challenge really...and the finished product never goes public either!

Other than that, what I think I can do is do a decent and different take on someone else's original...er...Noel Gallagher anyone?
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Re: Producing electronic dance music using ready-made 'loop packs' - Cheating?

Postby Argiletonne » Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:37 am

Samples vs Recording Instruments.

The age old question.

Who is right vs who is wrong.

I'm the electronic guy, deeply well informed and classify tracks better than mixmag.

As for Beatport, that website is a scam and all tracks are required to sound similar in production quality and must be repetitive and flat. Also you cannot get your music on beatport without an in from a label or record executive.

Using sample packs to make freestyle jazz, interesting, how do you pull that off?

I've never heard of using sample packs to make rock n roll but more power to ya if you can.

A guy that makes music no one wants to hear but owns lots of expensive equipment resorts to selling his samples because no one will buy his music works when the person buying the music doesn't own all the expensive hardware recording equipment to make the music samples themselves.
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