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Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

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Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Kevin Nolan » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:59 pm

Hi,

I found the SOS February review of the Bricasti Reverb very interesting.

I'm particularly interested in reverb units and wonder if there are opinions on this unit. Not that I'm going to go out to buy one any day soon, but I'd like to audition it and am always interested in compelling arguments for/against such outboard processors.

The Bricasti interests me because this article suggests that, having never heard a better algorithm reverb, that it competes with the very top Lexicon and TC Electronic units,
while also offering capabilities that compete with convolution reverbs in character but that exceeds them in editability. It certainly seems to be an incredible unit on the face of the review, and although pricey for a project studio, would seem to offer the very best there is, period, for a none the less competitive price.

I'm also wondering how the PCM 91 fare these days? In my mind it's the pinnacle of 19"-rack reverbs. So does it compete with the Bricasti? It's be incredible if there's a consensus that the PCM 91 can honestly be said to be surpassed in this price range surely?

I'm wonder if any others are equally curiously interested in the Bricasti; and if so why? Is anyone considering it and if so why? And, given a very well spec'd Logic system (or similar DAW) using a convolution reverb such as Space Designer, is the likes of a Lexicon PCM 91 or this new Bricasti needed? Can the Logic Sound Designer(or other soft-reverbs you care to mention) offer top-end reverbs across a range of challenging scenarios that can compete with the PCM 91, M3000/M4000 and Bricasti; or are the reverbs that come with Logic and other DAWs of obviously poorer quality?

I had always envisaged getting a top end reverb (I still use a TC Electronics M2000 and honestly absolutely adore it). But I had abandoned the idea more recently given the range of software options; but now find my curiosity tweaked by the Bricasti review.

Any and all thoughts appreciated!

Cheers,
Kevin.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Studio Support Gnome » Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:09 pm

sorry but he PCM91 is simply not in the same class as the Bricasti, OR indeed the TC4000 , which itself is a bit special.... (and way beyond the 3000) (IMHO)

the 91 is old technology, comparatively noisy, and very much due an update..... (enter the PCM96)

and last time I checked, being cleared on something of a Buy one(PCM81, get one free(PCM91) deal by Harman....

if you want to hear the bricasti, you'll have to speak to Garry Robson (Stirling) and arrange a demo... but be prepared not to be able to demo it for more than few hours.... it's hot property.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Kevin Nolan » Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:31 pm

Hi MAX,

You've essentially answered the important queries I posted and given a very succinct pointer as to where the various processors sit and how much interest there still is in such processors.

It's amazing what you say about the PCM 91 - just how many world class music releases across every genre must use it, and yet it's now old and outmoded. Incredible.

Thanks again,
Kevin.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Tui » Thu Jan 31, 2008 10:39 pm

Kevin Nolan wrote:I still use a TC Electronics M2000 and honestly absolutely adore it


I don't know how the M2000 compares with the M3000. I used to have a PCM 90, but got frustrated with its metallic ringing reverb tails on larger spaces (smaller spaces were fine). I sold it and got a M3000 instead.

Software based convolution reverbs are not in the same league with decent hardware units. Convolution often sounds a bit flat and unexciting.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Kevin Nolan » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:21 pm

Thanks Tui.

I'm really surprised by these responses, but accept them. It's refreshing to hear that such dedicated hardware reverb units still occupy such a dominant position and are still sought after.

I must now seriously re-examine my priorities on this one. I have to say the Bricasti looks very exciting, but the M4000 and PCM96 also look very interesting.


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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Tui » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:37 pm

I can only suggest, before you spend that kind of money, that you demo the units, preferably side by side. You need to get a feel for what they do. All of these reverberators sound good, but you may find that with some, you arrive at usable results quicker than with others.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Jack Ruston » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:31 am

Well a very well respected producer friend of mine demo'd the Bricasti recently. He said that it was just amazing. He'd never heard anything like it. He told me that it made Altiverb sound rather artificial and phasey in comparison.

I now don't want to hear this unit, because it'll make me covetous and miserable.

J
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Matt P » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:48 am

I've not seen the latest issue yet (really need to renew my subscription!). What's the price tag on this chappy?

Struggled to find that particular piece of info on either the Briscati or Stirling sites.

Or am I simply being naive? Is it one of those 'if you have to ask...' moments?
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Jack Ruston » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:50 am

It's 'about' 2k

J
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Matt P » Fri Feb 01, 2008 12:52 am

Well that's not bad at all if it really lives up to the hype.

(He says as though he has £2k burning a hole in his pocket...)
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby Zukan » Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:06 am

The Producer Formerly Known As Jack wrote:
I now don't want to hear this unit, because it'll make me covetous and miserable.

J

Keep away from the light J, keep away from the light.
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Re: Bricasti Reverb, PCM 91 and DAW Convolution Reverbs?

Postby narcoman » Fri Feb 01, 2008 11:45 am

Tui wrote:
Kevin Nolan wrote:I still use a TC Electronics M2000 and honestly absolutely adore it

I don't know how the M2000 compares with the M3000. I used to have a PCM 90, but got frustrated with its metallic ringing reverb tails on larger spaces (smaller spaces were fine). I sold it and got a M3000 instead.

Software based convolution reverbs are not in the same league with decent hardware units. Convolution often sounds a bit flat and unexciting.

sure, can see why you might say that. However, my only point of comparison here would be with an EMT 140. I have a real one, the TC4000 emulations, their PT equivalents and the TL Space convolution version. The EMT itself is by far the best but for the EMT plate, convolution is the next best. Ive found the same with springs. As far as real space modelling is concerned - nothing Ive heard comes close to VSS4 - and that includes the Bricasti, as excellent a unit as it is. That, of course, is just personal opinion.
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