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Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

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Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby gigantique » Sun May 04, 2008 10:01 pm

Hi, everybody!!
I need some help about Pro Tools systems.I want to know what is the basic reason,which makes Pro Tools so popular system of all the world,why this system is absolutely leader in the Digital professional audio world?For last 3 years there is a lot off others very good DAW products, like Nuendo,Cubase,Logic...Why those products cannot find so much respection from a lot off world known producers and sound engeneerings? I'm working in Ableton 7.I am using this program just for creation process.I cannot mix in it,because i found my self that the audio engine of Nudeno or Logic is much much better..Now i'm thinking about PRO TOOLS MIX.I heard a lot off diferent opinions about this DAW.Someone even told me,that the same waves plugins have a different sound in Pro Tools,than in other daws..?What it's all about?What is a different between ProTools and other popular audio softwares?
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby narcoman » Sun May 04, 2008 10:09 pm

there is no reason not to do pretty much the same work in any DAW as Protools. The reason Protools is so widespread? - it was the first affordable DAW. It was also well marketed.

Plugins don't sound better or worse in PT - so that is nonsense.

There are PLENTY of high end products on all DAWs - it's just that a great proportion are done on PT.

I have several Protools rigs - some HDaccel and some LE system. I also have a Nuendo setup and recently - Logic. All are very capable and I've used all of them on multimillion dollar projects....so don't sweat it! use whatever DAW you ar comfortable with.

I will add the PT HD is particularly good for tracking - the routing also makes it very suitable for stems etc. TDM is still also very good for tracking situations. Other DAWs have other strengths.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby gingertimmins » Mon May 05, 2008 12:52 am

in my opinion pro tools is the best if you wanna record and mix bands but it's not so good with MIDI. I don't think pro tools is particularly bad at MIDI, it's just that there's something 'lacking' compared to cubase/ nuendo. I also think that cubase/ nuendo lack some of the audio handling finesse that pro tools has to offer, It's just one of those things.
Pro tools did become the chosen DAW of the pro recording industry but I think this was because of it's outboard processing capabilities and not because of anything else.
Imagine if cubase was the first DAW to have dedicated, outboard processors. surely then it would have become the industry standard as it reduces the strain on the host computers own processors.
nowadays though, computers are so powerful and so cheap that it doesn't really matter, it's just down to personal preference I think!
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby narcoman » Mon May 05, 2008 10:10 am

Protools MIDI is actually very good. I prefer editing on MIDI on PT than Cubase. It also locks and syncs better than most DAWs.... But yes, personal preference is the thing.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby sambolino_freeman » Mon May 05, 2008 12:51 pm

search the forums for pro tools... there are many of the same threads - coming up with the same answers, its up to you
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Iwan Morgan » Mon May 05, 2008 5:16 pm

Think of the days before Pro Tools.

Tape machines such as Studer, Otari, Ampex etc.

They were all built on the same basic concept but all had slight differences. I like using Pro Tools because it is very simple to navigate when recording live bands. I love the playlist editing and the editing possibilities.

I have used Cubase, Logic and Nuendo. With Logic and Cubase it feels (to me) that the audio features have been added on to the previous midi sequencing strengths of each system. Nuendo is better and I do really like it, but I am more than happy with Pro Tools.

Could I make arecord on any DAW? I am confident I could.

Would I prefer to make one in Pro Tools? Definitely.

Try before you buy, its the only way.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby G-Doubleyou » Mon May 05, 2008 5:17 pm

Don't confuse PTLE with PT|HD, HD is dominant in Professional audio/video facilities.

But in the prosumer market Cubase has sold the most of all DAWs, and Logic the most on Macs.

8-)
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby John Willett » Mon May 05, 2008 5:46 pm

Just because something is popular doesn't mean that it's good or even the best.

Marketing plays a big part and if your school uses something, you are more likely to use that same thing yourself.

And why did the school choose it? The cheapest, perhaps?
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby fakiekid » Mon May 05, 2008 11:21 pm

Obviously you've never used it.........

If you like midi, stay away, if you track and mix audio, you will love it
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby John Willett » Mon May 05, 2008 11:44 pm

fakiekid wrote:Obviously you've never used it.........

If you like midi, stay away, if you track and mix audio, you will love it

I went a step higher and use Sequoia. :D
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Jack Ruston » Mon May 05, 2008 11:45 pm

Which apparently plays back it's audio in some sort of preview mode that doesn't sound the same as what results from the final bounce...

What's up with that?

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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby narcoman » Tue May 06, 2008 3:02 am

John Willett wrote:
fakiekid wrote:Obviously you've never used it.........

If you like midi, stay away, if you track and mix audio, you will love it

I went a step higher and use Sequoia. :D

until native caught up, this was not a viable option for tracking. I record a lot of orchestral stuff to click (sound to picture) and very often have to have 10 or so mixes running..... I wouldnt want to do this on anything other than one of the DSP systems - plugins are needed and many recalls a day are required. When i first started doing this when we did it all using the consoles facilities we often had 10 days for 30 miutes of score. Now we get two or three days....
PT still has the best routing of any DAW. However, each has its strengths and weaknesses and native technology has pretty much caught up.... I guess its now down to personal workflow - NONE of the DAWs are clearly better than any other - each has its merits and pitfalls.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Pangloss » Tue May 06, 2008 9:36 am

Hi Narcoman,

Just interested why you say that PT has the best routing of any DAW. I use Soundscape and there is nothing I can't do with the routing of the SS mixer. Does PT routing have anything over on SS? Interested to know - thanks.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby narcoman » Tue May 06, 2008 9:50 am

Pangloss wrote:Hi Narcoman,

Just interested why you say that PT has the best routing of any DAW. I use Soundscape and there is nothing I can't do with the routing of the SS mixer. Does PT routing have anything over on SS? Interested to know - thanks.

Soundscape is good - actually so is Nuendo - finally - took enough years. PT has some very flexible routing options - for me most useful is the multiple assignments per track - this can go anywhere - to a hardware output, to a channel, to an aux etc. I also like the Master fader for controlling overall buss level. All of the DAWs have many of the features of PT in this respect - but PT has had it for years and as such is mature and reliable in this department. Ive used soundscape a few times and like it - it's just not what i'm used to and there are several things I do mixing score that aren't there - probably are workarounds but they weren't presented to me !
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Pangloss » Tue May 06, 2008 10:19 am

Yes, I think as you say (and everyone says in these "why Protools?" discussions) it's down to the way you work.

The things you mention (as you no doubt already know) are all possible on SS (although it probably works in a completely different way to the way other DAW users are used to).

However, for general interest, in Soundscape you just insert sends as individual plugins into a channel strip and these can go anywhere you like (h/w out, internal bus etc.). They can be pre/post-fader, mono/mono-stereo/stereo/, EPP etc. and you can put in as many as you like. Similarly channels can take their inputs from anywhere and can be mono/stereo/multichannel etc. (Channel outs also go wherever you like).

Granted, it's quite different to the matrix-style routing functions of some other DAWs (Reaper?) but I like it as it appears to work like an incredibly capable hw console.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Joe_caithness » Tue May 06, 2008 11:40 am

being 21 years old, I am of the generation where Pro Tools is put on some massive pedestal and everyone "needs to know pro tools"

I think it's gonna fall through soon though, the old gaurds arguments for Pro Tools make no sense to my generation, Logic and Cubase are so cheap, and they work with most hardware.. Pro Tools might be trying to open them selves up (by doing the super low range M Boxes) but in an age where I could download a DAW and some VSTs in literally 5 minutes and start making music, I dunno how fussed people are gonna be about even learning about Farm Cards and Digidesign cabling...

this said I do use Pro Tools for mixing, only because it's mixing interface kicks everyone elses ass, think I will always create music in Cubase though
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby Mixedup » Tue May 06, 2008 12:38 pm

Joe_caithness wrote:Logic and Cubase are so cheap, and they work with most hardware..

Well, Logic is cheap, and Cubase works with most hardware. Cubase is arguably not cheap (compared with Sonar and Logic anyway...). And since version 5.5, Logic most definitely does NOT run with most hardware ;)

And in response to an earlier post, some plug-ins do sound better in Pro Tools: I tend to find TDM-only plug-ins sound better in PT than on any other platform :bouncy:
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby narcoman » Tue May 06, 2008 2:53 pm

Joe_caithness wrote:being 21 years old, I am of the generation where Pro Tools is put on some massive pedestal and everyone "needs to know pro tools"

I think it's gonna fall through soon though, the old gaurds arguments for Pro Tools make no sense to my generation, Logic and Cubase are so cheap, and they work with most hardware.. Pro Tools might be trying to open them selves up (by doing the super low range M Boxes) but in an age where I could download a DAW and some VSTs in literally 5 minutes and start making music, I dunno how fussed people are gonna be about even learning about Farm Cards and Digidesign cabling...

this said I do use Pro Tools for mixing, only because it's mixing interface kicks everyone elses ass, think I will always create music in Cubase though

because you making music at home or in your project studio or a s a one man signed act bears no relationship to recording large ensembles or acts or live performance or religious broadcasts or film, TV and video game scoring at the large end - which is where the pro work is. You have to put it in context. Native DAWs rule for the one man or electronic musician. It is a very different game indeed tracking and mixing a movie....the money end of the industry is still very much embedded in DSP - hence Neve 88Ds, Fairlight systems, PT and similar systems.

You can't do my job on a native system - as much as i'd like - you just cannot. That obviously will not always be true but dedicated systems always outperform "one box does it all" methods.

People often quote the Final Cut Pro attack onto Avid and similar systems - go into a TV studio and see what really is used for assembly - try using FCP on a network with 14 editors all using the same files for conforming.
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby redleicester » Tue May 06, 2008 8:58 pm

narcoman wrote:
Joe_caithness wrote:being 21 years old, I am of the generation where Pro Tools is put on some massive pedestal and everyone "needs to know pro tools"

I think it's gonna fall through soon though, the old gaurds arguments for Pro Tools make no sense to my generation, Logic and Cubase are so cheap, and they work with most hardware.. Pro Tools might be trying to open them selves up (by doing the super low range M Boxes) but in an age where I could download a DAW and some VSTs in literally 5 minutes and start making music, I dunno how fussed people are gonna be about even learning about Farm Cards and Digidesign cabling...

this said I do use Pro Tools for mixing, only because it's mixing interface kicks everyone elses ass, think I will always create music in Cubase though

because you making music at home or in your project studio or a s a one man signed act bears no relationship to recording large ensembles or acts or live performance or religious broadcasts or film, TV and video game scoring at the large end - which is where the pro work is. You have to put it in context. Native DAWs rule for the one man or electronic musician. It is a very different game indeed tracking and mixing a movie....the money end of the industry is still very much embedded in DSP - hence Neve 88Ds, Fairlight systems, PT and similar systems.

You can't do my job on a native system - as much as i'd like - you just cannot. That obviously will not always be true but dedicated systems always outperform "one box does it all" methods.

People often quote the Final Cut Pro attack onto Avid and similar systems - go into a TV studio and see what really is used for assembly - try using FCP on a network with 14 editors all using the same files for conforming.

Got there quicker than I could Narcy... can't see Digital Factory, Air-Edel or Todd-AO using Reaper somehow.... :D
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Re: Pro Tools..Pro Tools..-why?

Postby AllyB » Wed May 07, 2008 11:06 am

i just mixed and recorded an album going out worldwide release entireley in ableton..

pro-tools is just like when people say "can you photoshop that" it makes no difference, especially like i do you use powercores or simular...
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