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NT-SF1

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Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:18 pm
by Mike Stranks
The sadness is that these are genuinely pleasant people I'm dealing with. It's just that they have zero understanding of the recording process. I've also had it said that they've seen choirs on t'telly with no mics visible at all... not realising of course that what they saw and what they heard were in two different timeframes which had been overlaid...

Ho hum! :)

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:23 pm
by Hugh Robjohns
Mike Stranks wrote:The sadness is that these are genuinely pleasant people I'm dealing with. It's just that they have zero understanding of the recording process.

Of course, and there's no reason they should know about the recording process... but you'd think they'd listen to the advice of someone who does!

I've also had it said that they've seen choirs on t'telly with no mics visible at all... not realising of course that what they saw and what they heard were in two different timeframes which had been overlaid...

...or via slung mics carefully positioned out of shot. The slung Schoeps mics for The Proms at the RAH are almost invisible to the naked eye, let alone the cameras!

H

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:55 pm
by The Elf
I am definitely interested in this mic for surround recordings (I typically use a pair of ORTFs), but I'm struggling to understand its usage as a stereo mic beyond simply muting a pair of capsules?

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:23 pm
by Wonks
The Elf wrote:I am definitely interested in this mic for surround recordings (I typically use a pair of ORTFs), but I'm struggling to understand its usage as a stereo mic beyond simply muting a pair of capsules?

The idea is that you can create your own pattern microphone, you don't simply mute two mics. So you can bring the included area in tighter, or widen it after recording, whereas with a stereo pair, you are stuck with what you've got. Which if you are experienced, probably isn't a problem, but there may still be times when you might want to reduce the ambient/audience/background noise.

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:25 pm
by The Elf
I still don't really get it. Maybe the subject of a one/two-pager in the mag, Hugh?

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:32 pm
by Sam Inglis
You could think of it as an extension of the Double Mid-Sides array, which Hugh describes here:

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques ... ides-array

The two key differences with the Soundfield mic are that it is three-dimensional rather than two-dimensional, and that the figure-8 and omni components are synthesized from the output of subcardioid capsules, rather than captured natively by figure-8 and omni capsules.

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:49 pm
by ConcertinaChap
Wonks wrote:whereas with a stereo pair, you are stuck with what you've got.

And that's the attraction of this thing. Think of it like compression. You could use it while you're recording but most of us leave it till we're mixing so that we're a) not stuck with a bad choice, and b) can tweak at leisure rather than in a hurry while recording. This mic seems to offer something of the same flexibility when it comes to mic placement. Of course, I don't expect you can fling the thing up any old place and expect to fix it in the mix. I'd expect it to take some experimenting to find the optimum sort of placing for it, but even given that the promise is very attractive.

CC

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:19 pm
by Sam Inglis
I've actually done quite a few experiments with trying to record a whole band around a Soundfield mic, in the spirit of the Cowboy Junkies, and it's bloody difficult, but not always for the reasons you'd expect. Singers have got so used to working with close microphones that the art of controlling dynamics in the performance has been lost; and also, what sounds like a reasonable balance to the 'naked ear' as it were sometimes sounds completely different to the mic!

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:52 pm
by John Willett
The Elf wrote:I am definitely interested in this mic for surround recordings (I typically use a pair of ORTFs), but I'm struggling to understand its usage as a stereo mic beyond simply muting a pair of capsules?

To put it simply ...

It's basically MS with four cardioid microphones in a tetrahedral array.

The output of the four capsules is "A-format".

This is matrixed to "B-format" which is: figure-8 mid / figure-8 side / figure-8 vertical / omni

From these you can get any stereo or surround mic. array you want. :thumbup:

Plus - if you record on 4-channels you can do all this in post production and adjust at will. :thumbup:

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:35 pm
by ConcertinaChap
OK, well here's one particular use case* that I have in mind. Most Tuesdays we go down a local pub to sing shanties and chorus songs very informally with a bunch of like minded people. As time's gone on we're getting good at this we think (here's an example, not a great recording but to show what I mean). We'd love to do a recording that would catch this sort of informal ambience but combined with a better quality of sound and previously I've though of lofting an LSD2 stereo mic in crossed figure-8 arrangement to catch the overall sound and perhaps passing a cardioid mic around to whoever's leading. This mic, maybe, if set up in the middle of the pub, might be just the thing to allow me to change the notional mic setup on a track by track basis as the singing moves round the room.

CC

* I used to use UML in my job and to be honest this sort of usage of the phrase "use case" grates a bit. Just thought I'd use it so as to show I can get down-n-dirty wiv da kidz too.

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:45 pm
by blinddrew
Use cases are old man talk, nowadays it's all about user stories.

And I haven't just made that up.

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:46 pm
by ConcertinaChap
So I'm getting down-an-dirty wiv da OAPz ...

CC

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:47 pm
by blinddrew
:bouncy:

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 10:53 pm
by The Elf
ConcertinaChap wrote:Most Tuesdays we go down a local pub to sing shanties and chorus songs very informally with a bunch of like minded people.
Mate, I would love to come hear that! As long as you are prepared to accommodate a synth nerd!...

Re: NT-SF1

PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:39 pm
by ConcertinaChap
No instruments at the session, that's about the only rule, so for the night you'd be an ex-synth nerd. You'd be welcome to stay the night with us.

Cheers,

CC