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Recording in pubs

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby Sam Spoons » Sat Dec 22, 2018 10:37 am

I'nt this place brilliant, a quick google for Lea Nicholson brought this up...... delightful :D

http://www.nicholsonrandall.co.uk/category/music/
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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby ConcertinaChap » Sat Dec 22, 2018 9:07 pm

Completely agree with that. Good to see Lea doing good stuff again. It's too long since Horse Music.

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:15 pm

The Elf wrote:
Mike Stranks wrote:I do recall a conversation that the Elf and I had a while back now where we scratched our heads about the effectiveness of an omni as a Mid - not that either of us had tried it then... don't know if he has since...
I was thinking that this might be a good option as an audience mic arrangement for my live recordings this year.

I finally got round to trying the omni-centred mid-side approach during a band practice in our living room. The centre mic is a Studio Projects SC4, the figure of 8 is a t.bone SC1100.

As the fiddler I found I had to be about half the distance from the mics as our melodeon player in order to get a fair balance, and I also had to raise the mics close to violin/shoulder height. Doubtless similar issues would apply in a pub full of singers or a session.

The other instruments are Roland pian, assorted percussion and an old and well worked-on Hohner melodeon.

https://youtu.be/w6VYVcn1AeM

We were thinking of doing some demos with crossed pairs and omni spot mics, but I'm now wondering whether results like this won't achieve everything we need.

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby blinddrew » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:26 pm

Those cymbals kind of leap out at you! ;) I'd be looking to get them further from the mic and or get something in the way to attenuate them.
Aside from that things are nicely balanced to me, but as always I refer you to the disclaimer in my sig... :)
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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:37 pm

I'm not sure how we could quieten the tishes but not some other elements of our percussionist's kit - they rather come as a set.

I see what you mean, but I think I'll just have to write them off as just part of the drama of the thing...

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 12:52 pm

It's carolling time once more and, out of curiosity as much as anything, I'm planning a new in-pub recording experiment: mid-side recording using a pair of CAD M179s, with the centre mic set to a wide cardioid and the cross-mic to figure of eight.

Experiments at home suggest it will work well, but we'll see. Wish me luck!

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby ConcertinaChap » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:31 pm

Best of luck, Gavin. I'll look forward to hearing some of it after the event.

Juast getting my kit together for our last big sing of this year later this afternoon in BoA. I do love these carol sings, just a brilliant way of spending an afternoon.

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Sun Dec 22, 2019 1:43 pm

Cheers! I hope yours goes well too. In fact, I'm sure it will!

Well, the recording will be interesting. I feel I'm about to learn something, one way or the other.

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 10:40 pm

Here's a sample of what mid-side recording using a pair of CAD M179s produces.

https://youtu.be/XrGC7VXSB54

There's no eq here, though there probably should be a high pass filter. There are touches of compression and digital reverb.

It doesn’t sound too bad to me - my only complaint is that it favours the voices near the mic. That said, t's noticeable how the figure of eight mic brings in sound from around and further away. Knowing the long distribution of the singers, a member of the family commented that it almost had a compacting effect. The descant singers were perhaps 15ft from the mics.

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:18 pm

forumuser915213 wrote:... my only complaint is that it favours the voices near the mic.

Funny, that... ;)

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:57 pm

Well yes. But the way the figure of eight pulls in the rest of the room to a useful degree was a pleasant surprise, at least to me.

A crossed pair and two omnis is clearly better - but not always easy to accommodate.

I said I expected to learn something!

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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby Mack Prosacco » Tue Dec 24, 2019 9:28 am

forumuser915213 wrote:I'm involved in running some music events in pubs, and had some reasonable results from recording using omnis in AB arrangements along one wall (they have to be against a wall for space reasons and because people may reasonably be expected to move about.)

I haven't tried it, but I'd guess I could use cardioids in xy with a single stand, so long as I got the mics above the crowd.

Here's an example from a project reviving old Kent carols:
https://youtu.be/HtjkeCDqNfE

And here's another of our traditional tunes workshop members playing an old favourite.

https://youtu.be/EhZ7lPnICYU

The recordings were made using a pair of Behringer B5s and a Tascam DR100 mkii.

As some of you will understand from the Youtubes, we have quite a lot of fun.

But this weekend I had some difficulty working out how to record successfully in two settings.

One was in a long narrow room in which people were taking turns to sing or play. The situation was complicated by an open arch half way down tge room through which comes a lot of chatter from the pub's bar. In this setting I used the Tascam's omnis and was disappointed to find (I) the Tascam omnis were a bit on the dull side (and wouldn't take eq very well) and (ii) with the amount of bar noise it picked up. An example... https://youtu.be/Uh-Q7nxukxs

There's no doubt in my mind the B5s would have done a far better job.

But these points also make me think about using cardioids in some stereo arrangement with their backs to the chatter - but I really can't think of anything appropriate. Whatever confoguratio I can think of, I'm going to have people way over to one side or another. Perhaps I shouldn't worry... But still I think there will be bar noise...

Alternatively, perhaps I should use a single omni and not worry about noise.

Does anyone have any ideas please? (We like the venue, btw.)

Also on Saturday night we had a barndance with tunes workshop members and friends playing. With 15 of them, we couldn't all get on the stage, so played from the floor.

I haven't tried recording these evenings before but tried using xy from the front row of the band without success. The stand couldn't be further forward because of the dancers and caller, and the result didn't pic up nearly enough of the widely arranged band.

I didn't realish the idea of booming the mics over the band from the stage for fear of an accident.

Once again, I'm thinking that I would have been better served by using the omnis in AB arrangement again. Unless of course someone has a better idea!

If anyone can help, thanks for your thoughts.

Mics-wise I have a small selection of SDCs and LDCs, including a figure of 8 LDC - though that might be a bit obtrusive in this sort of setting.

Gavin
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It is lucky to read this article. Thank you for sharing.
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Re: Recording in pubs

Postby forumuser915213 » Tue Dec 24, 2019 1:15 pm

forumuser915213 wrote:Well yes. But the way the figure of eight pulls in the rest of the room to a useful degree was a pleasant surprise, at least to me.

A crossed pair and two omnis is clearly better - but not always easy to accommodate.

I said I expected to learn something!


One thing I would say is that I came to this thinking I might find that these LDCs might be an odd choice for this job and could be noticeably poorer in this role than a pair of LDCs.

So I'm pleased, overall.

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