You are here

"It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

For everything after the recording stage: hardware/software and how you use it.

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:50 pm

Will Bailey wrote:Sorry forgot to address the previous post! :headbang:

The connector will look like a connector with wire jumpers accross all the pins. it depends how neat your soldering is! if you get a connector that comes with a casing it will look like a plug stuck in the back of the unit.

The pins given are for the I/O card so in fact on the uni they are reversed (outs become ins) however, this doesnt make any difference to what you are doing, routing analog signals that would have been sent to an A/D converter to a line in that would have been expecting analog signals from a D/A converter. you're just cutting out the middle man.

Will

Thanks for hanging in there with me, Will. It should be me :headbang: , not you!

It finally clicked in my very dura capitus. I will have one of those made up!

Thanks again -
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Tue Jan 29, 2013 8:11 pm

I just thought of something - I wonder if all the above means that the audio is unbalanced (since the "outs" and "ins" are all each on one pin, instead of a pair). Yes, I'd guess ... :headbang: ??
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Will Bailey » Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:04 am

yeah i think they are unbalanced on that port. I'm not sure about the other I/O. it will probably say in the manual i think?

Let me know how you get on.
Will Bailey
Poster
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:00 am

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:43 am

Hello - well it's only two years later, and I am now ready to make this modification of a D-Sub pin.

This is the M-Audio Omni I/O Break Out Box (which connects to the Delta 66 PCI Card) , Image .






Two final questions please - is a male-to-male like this what I need to buy and have one end soldered (the "computer end" of the breakout box is a female 15-pin) ?
Image

And in the end, finally, and obviously critically - in Will Bailey's post, he references "Pin 1", "Pin 2" ... "Pin 15". How do I identify which number is assigned to which pin ... I'm guessing there is a numbering/naming convention?

Thanks, and Will Bailey though I haven't seen you posting in a while - thank you!
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 6:01 am






https://www.accesscomms.com.au/reference/dsub/da15.htm
Image






Image <<<--- ("This appendix contains cable pinout information for the port located on the back of the Challenge S server. The figure shows the connector pin assignments, not the cable pin assignments. http://techpubs.sgi.com/library/tpl/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?coll=... "

Not sure what that means ... but this looks like the female version of the picture above?)


Are these sources reliable? And if the wrong pins are soldered to each other, I'm guessing I could fry my Omni I/O? :?
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:11 am

It's really not as difficult as you fear, Alexis! ;)

It appears that the D-sub connector on the breakout box is a female socket. That being the case, you just need to buy a matching 15-pin male D-sub plug (and the shell to cover it).

The pins numbers are marked on the plastic substrate of the plug, and you have the diagrams above too. (Just pay careful attention to whether the diagrams are showing you the solder side or the visible front side of the plug, because the two are obviously opposites of one another! The pin layout of a 'front view' of the socket is the same as the solder side of the plug...)

All you need then need to do is solder short wire links between the appropriate pins on the plug, as detailed above, to 'loop-back' the analogue outs to the analogue ins, effectively bypassing the normal route via the computer.

With the wire links soldered in place and carefully checked (it's easy to get solder bridges between adjacent pins if you're new to soldering D-subs), you can fix the shell over the plug. The shell gives you something to hang on to when installing or removing the loop-back plug, as well as providing some screening (assuming it's a metal shell) for the wires inside.

Does that help?

H
User avatar
Hugh Robjohns
Moderator
Posts: 28326
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Worcestershire, UK
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:22 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:It's really not as difficult as you fear, Alexis! ;)

It appears that the D-sub connector on the breakout box is a female socket. That being the case, you just need to buy a matching 15-pin male D-sub plug (and the shell to cover it).

The pins numbers are marked on the plastic substrate of the plug, and you have the diagrams above too. (Just pay careful attention to whether the diagrams are showing you the solder side or the visible front side of the plug, because the two are obviously opposites of one another! The pin layout of a 'front view' of the socket is the same as the solder side of the plug...)

All you need then need to do is solder short wire links between the appropriate pins on the plug, as detailed above, to 'loop-back' the analogue outs to the analogue ins, effectively bypassing the normal route via the computer.

With the wire links soldered in place and carefully checked (it's easy to get solder bridges between adjacent pins if you're new to soldering D-subs), you can fix the shell over the plug. The shell gives you something to hang on to when installing or removing the loop-back plug, as well as providing some screening (assuming it's a metal shell) for the wires inside.

Does that help?

H
Yes, thank you Hugh. I think I need to go to an electronics store and lay eyes on a plug to fully understand. Right now I see 15 pins plugged into the 15 sockets of the breakout cable (obviously). After that's where it gets fuzzy. I can't see those same pins having solder on them, so (cue imagination) I see the back end of the same 15 pins visible at the back end of the sub - with that being where the soldering takes place and ultimately the shell is positioned. If that is incorrect, it will be immediately apparent I'd guess when I actually hold one of these things in my hand.

What about the danger to my Omni I/O , if the above assignments are incorrect? The original source info is difficult to obtain (I'm asking on the M-Audio forum now), and there's always the possibility of a typo, etc.
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Thu Mar 05, 2015 1:50 pm

alexis wrote:I think I need to go to an electronics store and lay eyes on a plug to fully understand.


Here's a 15-way D-sub from the pin side:

Image

...and here's the solder side:

Image

And you'll also need a shell to cover the back of the plug:

Image

Right now I see 15 pins plugged into the 15 sockets of the breakout cable (obviously).


yes.. or plugged straight into the back of the Omni box, rather than the cable (which would be neater!)

I can't see those same pins having solder on them, so (cue imagination) I see the back end of the same 15 pins visible at the back end of the sub - with that being where the soldering takes place and ultimately the shell is positioned. If that is incorrect, it will be immediately apparent I'd guess when I actually hold one of these things in my hand.


You just need to solder four linking wires inside, something like this:

Image

(I've simply illustrated the wiring suggested above -- the colours are simply to differentiate the wires, and I've not checked the pin numbers are accurate)

What about the danger to my Omni I/O , if the above assignments are incorrect?


It would be worthwhile finding out if there are power rails on any of the pins, because you won't want to get shorts on those, but other than that it seems pretty straight forward.

H
User avatar
Hugh Robjohns
Moderator
Posts: 28326
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Worcestershire, UK
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:03 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:
alexis wrote:I think I need to go to an electronics store and lay eyes on a plug to fully understand.

Here's a 15-way D-sub from the pin side:

Image

...and here's the solder side:

Image

And you'll also need a shell to cover the back of the plug:

Image

Right now I see 15 pins plugged into the 15 sockets of the breakout cable (obviously).

yes.. or plugged straight into the back of the Omni box, rather than the cable (which would be neater!)

I can't see those same pins having solder on them, so (cue imagination) I see the back end of the same 15 pins visible at the back end of the sub - with that being where the soldering takes place and ultimately the shell is positioned. If that is incorrect, it will be immediately apparent I'd guess when I actually hold one of these things in my hand.

You just need to solder four linking wires inside, something like this:

Image

(I've simply illustrated the wiring suggested above -- the colours are simply to differentiate the wires, and I've not checked the pin numbers are accurate)

What about the danger to my Omni I/O , if the above assignments are incorrect?

It would be worthwhile finding out if there are power rails on any of the pins, because you won't want to get shorts on those, but other than that it seems pretty straight forward.

H

Thank you, Hugh!!!

I'll keep trying to find out about the pin assignments. Finally (I think!) - do the "shared ground shields" get soldered to the appropriate mate also (pin 11 to pin 7, pin 9 to pin 14)?
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:19 pm

alexis wrote:do the "shared ground shields" get soldered to the appropriate mate also (pin 11 to pin 7, pin 9 to pin 14)?

No, there's no point. They are internally shared grounds anyway, and the extra wiring would clutter up the plug for no benefit.

H
User avatar
Hugh Robjohns
Moderator
Posts: 28326
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Worcestershire, UK
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 2:32 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:
alexis wrote:do the "shared ground shields" get soldered to the appropriate mate also (pin 11 to pin 7, pin 9 to pin 14)?

No, there's no point. They are internally shared grounds anyway, and the extra wiring would clutter up the plug for no benefit.

H

Beautiful, thank you Hugh.

With any luck I'll get a confirmation on the pin assignments from M-Audio before the weekend, and then I'll be well on my way.

Thank you again!
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Wonks » Thu Mar 05, 2015 3:21 pm

I'm just wondering if it's really worth all the trouble. I used to have a Delta 66 and Omni I/O. It was a useful little unit, but when I changed to a MOTU Traveller, I did notice a big improvement in the pre-amp quality, especially in the level of detail in the recorded sound. You could now pick up a used unit that's fairly recent and cheap that will have better pre-amps than the ones in the Omni and will be easier to interface.
User avatar
Wonks
Jedi Poster
Posts: 10889
Joined: Thu May 29, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Reading, UK
Correcting mistakes on the internet since 1853

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Thu Mar 05, 2015 6:02 pm

Wonks wrote:I'm just wondering if it's really worth all the trouble. I used to have a Delta 66 and Omni I/O. It was a useful little unit, but when I changed to a MOTU Traveller, I did notice a big improvement in the pre-amp quality, especially in the level of detail in the recorded sound. You could now pick up a used unit that's fairly recent and cheap that will have better pre-amps than the ones in the Omni and will be easier to interface.

Thank you for your response, oh leporine one!

I actually have another interface which is my primary one ... this is just to make some use of the Omni I/O rather than have it sit on a shelf - live use, another headphone output, etc.

Thanks again!
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby alexis » Sun Mar 08, 2015 3:01 am

I am almost there! :lol:

I bought the D-pin, and a digital electrical tester. No live power on any of the pins, as far as I can tell.

Then just like Hugh and others suggested, I sent signals into each of the Omni I/O's analog inputs, and checked which socket on the D-pin the signals appeared on. Conversely, I sent signals into each socket to determine which analog outputs on the Omni I/O the signals appeared on.

For the record, the pin assignments noted above by Will Bailey are correct, i.e., no typos, etc., as far as my unit is concerned, and all units I would guess.

So the next step is to connect in1 to out1, in2 to out2, ... in4 to out4 on the diagram below, then finally put a shell on it as Hugh has pointed out.





Last question (famous last words) - the back of my D sub pin looks just like the one Hugh posted above (with the colored lines connecting), i.e., with little "tubes" sticking out the back. It almost looks like the tiny tubes would be ready to accept really tiny pins attached to tiny wires that could make the connections, instead of soldering. Is that possible, or is that just what things that need to be soldered look like?

For reference, for me or anyone else down the road:

Image

Finally just for anyone else: The purpose of all these shenanigans is to convert the Omni I/O two preamps and multiple routings (2 independent headphones out, Direct Outs 1-4, Monitor/Record outs, S/PDIF outs, and FX send/returns) to something that can be used stand-alone, i.e., independently of the PCI card/computer. For example, as a preamp for live use, an extra headphone amp (x2), etc.

Thanks again!
User avatar
alexis
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 3688
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Location: San Antonio, TX USA
Cubase 9.0.1; i5-4570 3.2GHz,16GB RAM;W10 64bit on Samsung SSD840 Pro256GB;Seagte 1TB SATA600 Audio;UR28M;Motif8;UAD2Solo;Jamstix 3.3;BCF2K;TC Helicon VoiceOne;RevoicePro3.2

Re: "It's not possible to use Omni I/O as a stand alone unit, not connected to a computer" - just checking to see if true …

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Sun Mar 08, 2015 11:21 am

alexis wrote:the back of my D sub pin looks just like the one Hugh posted above (with the colored lines connecting), i.e., with little "tubes" sticking out the back. It almost looks like the tiny tubes would be ready to accept really tiny pins attached to tiny wires that could make the connections, instead of soldering. Is that possible, or is that just what things that need to be soldered look like?

No, the 'tubes' are where you place the wire and then solder. There are no 'plug pins' and attaching them to the wire would be harder than simply soldering the wires into the holes anyway!

H
User avatar
Hugh Robjohns
Moderator
Posts: 28326
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Worcestershire, UK
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

PreviousNext