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There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

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There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:09 pm

I just got back a mastered track off a mix engineer however the track kicks in immediately, like from 0.00, isn't this incorrect? How could this guy have overlooked it. Or would that be fine to upload to say CDBaby etc
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby CS70 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:13 pm

It's because you've got a mastered track off a mix engineer.. :D

Just kidding. Not a problem at all. You may or may not have a few msecs of silence at start, so long it's an individual track it will work anyways. If it annoys you, ask the fellow to add some.

Different for an album, where the job includes the right amount of silence between consecutive tracks.. but who listens to albums nowadays (present forum excluded)
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:16 pm

CS70 wrote:It's because you've got a mastered track off a mix engineer.. :D

Just kidding. Not a problem at all. You may or may not have a few msecs of silence at start, so long it's an individual track it will work anyways. If it annoys you, ask the fellow to add some.

Different for an album, where the job includes the right amount of silence between consecutive tracks.. but who listens to albums nowadays (present forum excluded)

Hey thanks, it's just if I play any itunes singles there's always a slight silence, however my track it's just straight off the bat. I noticed that on say Soundcloud depending on maybe internet connection or something you can lose the fraction of the start I think this maybe jarring to listeners.
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:19 pm

By the way if I just put the WAV into my DAW and shifting the file half a second and exported would that be a simple fix or am I degrading the master in any way?
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby The Elf » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:21 pm

I always leave a small gap, though I can't say it's an exact science. I do find that playback can be cut off otherwise. Not to do so is asking for trouble IMHO.
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Luke W » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:38 pm

Hazer wrote:By the way if I just put the WAV into my DAW and shifting the file half a second and exported would that be a simple fix or am I degrading the master in any way?

Providing you export out to the same format again, there will be be no difference. :thumbup:
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:41 pm

Luke W wrote:
Hazer wrote:By the way if I just put the WAV into my DAW and shifting the file half a second and exported would that be a simple fix or am I degrading the master in any way?

Providing you export out to the same format again, there will be be no difference. :thumbup:

That's good news thanks
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:56 pm

Reposting as image was not appearing for me - when I put the track into my DAW with the track + master faders at 0.00, it clips! That can't be right either surely? Aren't masters at 0.02 0r lower aren't they

EDIT : On the track itself it seems ok, on the master it's clipping it seems pic is attached ! Should I be concerned

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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby James Perrett » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:19 pm

I normally leave a short gap but nothing like as long as half a second. Usually the gap is around a tenth of a second but I tend to do it by ear - a track that fades in gently may have a longer gap.

As far as the level disparity is concerned - I can see that you have an effect on the main bus because the FX button is green. Click on the on/off symbol in green to remove it.
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:32 pm

James Perrett wrote:I normally leave a short gap but nothing like as long as half a second. Usually the gap is around a tenth of a second but I tend to do it by ear - a track that fades in gently may have a longer gap.

As far as the level disparity is concerned - I can see that you have an effect on the main bus because the FX button is green. Click on the on/off symbol in green to remove it.

:oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: I had a Limiter on there thanks James

I might just set it to 0.25 secs in my DAW and export that sounds ok as it's a raw sounding synth
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby Hazer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:36 pm

Final question here and thanks everyone : I'm going to just add the gap in Reaper and render the file again, however Reaper's default is 24 bit 44.1, and the file is 16 bit, is it ok to render it as it is or should I change the project settings
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby CS70 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:38 pm

Hazer wrote:
CS70 wrote:It's because you've got a mastered track off a mix engineer.. :D

Just kidding. Not a problem at all. You may or may not have a few msecs of silence at start, so long it's an individual track it will work anyways. If it annoys you, ask the fellow to add some.

Different for an album, where the job includes the right amount of silence between consecutive tracks.. but who listens to albums nowadays (present forum excluded)

Hey thanks, it's just if I play any itunes singles there's always a slight silence, however my track it's just straight off the bat. I noticed that on say Soundcloud depending on maybe internet connection or something you can lose the fraction of the start I think this maybe jarring to listeners.

A bit depends on where you expect people to listen.. nowadays is Spotify and the likes, and Spotty in particular introduces a gap, unless the user sets the "gapeless playback" option.. and if for some reason I did, I'd be annoyed to still have gaps :D
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby CS70 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:40 pm

Hazer wrote:Final question here and thanks everyone : I'm going to just add the gap in Reaper and render the file again, however Reaper's default is 24 bit 44.1, and the file is 16 bit, is it ok to render it as it is or should I change the project settings

You have to render exactly at the same word length and sample rate (and no dither!) so change the project settings.
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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:55 pm

A couple of years back I mastered a CD and when I played it back straight through there was no problem but when I told the CD player to jump to a particular track the player would miss a couple of notes at the beginning. That was when I learned to put at least 0.25 secs silence at the beginning of a track because it matters on a CD. So far as I'm aware it doesn't much matter for anything else but if your music is ever likely to end up on a red book CD then put that space in. Since you never quite know where your music will end up nowadays I always put it in on everything.

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Re: There's meant to be a half second gap at the start of a song isn't there?

Postby RichardT » Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:45 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:A couple of years back I mastered a CD and when I played it back straight through there was no problem but when I told the CD player to jump to a particular track the player would miss a couple of notes at the beginning. That was when I learned to put at least 0.25 secs silence at the beginning of a track because it matters on a CD. So far as I'm aware it doesn't much matter for anything else but if your music is ever likely to end up on a red book CD then put that space in. Since you never quite know where your music will end up nowadays I always put it in on everything.

CC

Exactly this! I always add some space at the beginning of my tracks in my DAW before rendering to audio (usually 1 quarter note of space in a 1/4 bar so that the rest of the track lines up to the bars, but it depends on the tempo). This prevents glitches at the very beginning of the rendered file which can sometimes happen if the music starts at the very beginning.
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