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Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 2:31 pm

Over last few days I have resurrected a track I used to do with a band I used to be in. In the original the singer sang in French and the song was about the her being being treated bad by her man. I couldn't sing that so changed the words to reflect how we treat the earth instead so am not sure the title Tu Mon Vier is correct, but it'll do

https://soundcloud.com/acoustimax/tumon0wav

Thanks
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby blinddrew » Fri Jun 04, 2021 2:44 pm

Just had a very quick listen as I'm juggling a couple of things.
First thoughts.
The opening guitar sound is nice but seems a bit over-reverbed to me.
Overall vibe is very nice. French cafe orchestra stylee.
The new lead vocal isn't sitting right for me. It's very narrow and feels a bit plonked on top of the mix, I'd want a bit more of the room reverb on it I think. It might benefit from a more confident delivery for me as well.
The backing vocals come in nicely but round about the 3 minute mark it all seems to get a bit busy and woolly. I think there's space for a couple of instruments to take a breather here maybe.
I like the track though! :thumbup:

Hope that helps, and if it doesn't, have a look at my signature and ignore me! :)
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby Martin Walker » Fri Jun 04, 2021 3:04 pm

Nice track, nice feel, but I tend to agree with most of Drew''s points.

That reverb on the opening guitar does sound overdone, but I'd also be inclined to roll off the bass end of the reverb to make it less 'heavy and doom-laden', and a bit more 'light and airy'.

The main vocal could indeed benefit from being pushed back a little so it sits within the rest of the track, but it's also panned a bit to the right, which sounds odd to me. However, the reason becomes obvious at 2:14 when the harmony vocal comes in, panned a bit to the left, when both are placed perfectly ;) I'd automate the main vocal pan so it sits dead centre when it's by itself, and then revert to the slightly spaced L/R panning when both are singing.

It's definitely too busy later on from about 2:30 when the strings come in (perhaps drop out the accordion or piano during this section?) but at 3:18 it clears up nicely.

Hope this helps!


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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 4:38 pm

blinddrew wrote:Just had a very quick listen as I'm juggling a couple of things.
First thoughts.
The opening guitar sound is nice but seems a bit over-reverbed to me.
Overall vibe is very nice. French cafe orchestra stylee.
The new lead vocal isn't sitting right for me. It's very narrow and feels a bit plonked on top of the mix, I'd want a bit more of the room reverb on it I think. It might benefit from a more confident delivery for me as well.
The backing vocals come in nicely but round about the 3 minute mark it all seems to get a bit busy and woolly. I think there's space for a couple of instruments to take a breather here maybe.
I like the track though! :thumbup:

Hope that helps, and if it doesn't, have a look at my signature and ignore me! :)

Thanks, your comments help a lot and sort of confirm my concerns, well vocalwise at least. The reverb on the guitar is easily dealt with. But I come to the conclusion my vocals just aren't up to the job of doing a proper job of singing :-( I want the vocal line to go beyond the narrow span (1 octave) I can manage, be crystal clear, make things more lyrical, and make it more distinct from the backing vocals which are as woolly as a sheep sheering convention, I just can't seem to get that dynamism and clarity you might get in a classic Motown tune. Oh well, for my next effrot I might try a Leonard Cohen impersonation, and gurn my way through a tune :-)
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 4:42 pm

Martin Walker wrote:Nice track, nice feel, but I tend to agree with most of Drew''s points.

That reverb on the opening guitar does sound overdone, but I'd also be inclined to roll off the bass end of the reverb to make it less 'heavy and doom-laden', and a bit more 'light and airy'.

The main vocal could indeed benefit from being pushed back a little so it sits within the rest of the track, but it's also panned a bit to the right, which sounds odd to me. However, the reason becomes obvious at 2:14 when the harmony vocal comes in, panned a bit to the left, when both are placed perfectly ;) I'd automate the main vocal pan so it sits dead centre when it's by itself, and then revert to the slightly spaced L/R panning when both are singing.

It's definitely too busy later on from about 2:30 when the strings come in (perhaps drop out the accordion or piano during this section?) but at 3:18 it clears up nicely.

Hope this helps!


Martin

Hmmm, some good tips there, it might be salvageable after all. I never thought of using autopan, to get things in their right place. And you're right, by losing the accordian and/or the piano when the rising strings come in won't mean the momentum is lost. Thanks
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby FrankF » Fri Jun 04, 2021 6:43 pm

OneWorld wrote: am not sure the title Tu Mon Vier is correct, but it'll do

https://soundcloud.com/acoustimax/tumon0wav

Thanks

I'm guessing it's "Tu M'en Veux", meaning "you resent me" or "you have something against me".
(Tu Mon Vier means bugger all, but not literally!)

Your vox has a naturally pleasant timbre - reminds me of the bloke in Tears for Tears: I mean the Mad World one, not the Shout! one. :-)

But as others have said, it could definitely do with some reverb. :thumbup:
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:02 pm

FrankF wrote:
OneWorld wrote: am not sure the title Tu Mon Vier is correct, but it'll do

https://soundcloud.com/acoustimax/tumon0wav

Thanks

I'm guessing it's "Tu M'en Veux", meaning "you resent me" or "you have something against me".
(Tu Mon Vier means bugger all, but not literally!)

Your vox has a naturally pleasant timbre - reminds me of the bloke in Tears for Tears: I mean the Mad World one, not the Shout! one. :-)

But as others have said, it could definitely do with some reverb. :thumbup:

You could be right there, though I seem to remember she said the nearest literal translation was “you violate/abuse me” All seemed a bit doom to me, so I just played the chords. I am sure I can find another word to lever in and keep the same alliteration and meaning. Thanks, or should that be “merci” :-)
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:07 pm

OneWorld wrote:
FrankF wrote:
OneWorld wrote: am not sure the title Tu Mon Vier is correct, but it'll do

https://soundcloud.com/acoustimax/tumon0wav

Thanks

I'm guessing it's "Tu M'en Veux", meaning "you resent me" or "you have something against me".
(Tu Mon Vier means bugger all, but not literally!)

Your vox has a naturally pleasant timbre - reminds me of the bloke in Tears for Tears: I mean the Mad World one, not the Shout! one. :-)

But as others have said, it could definitely do with some reverb. :thumbup:

You could be right there, though I seem to remember she said the nearest literal translation was “you violate/abuse me” she might have sung “Tu mi envais” All seemed a bit doomy to me, so I just played the chords. At the time I wanted to write a French sounding tune, but couldn’t speak French whereas the singer could. I am sure I can find another word to lever in and keep the same alliteration and meaning. Thanks, or should that be “merci” :-)
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby FrankF » Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:08 pm

Ah, "tu me violes" would be "you violate me" or, rather darker, "you ra pe me".
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby OneWorld » Fri Jun 04, 2021 9:33 pm

FrankF wrote:Ah, "tu me violes" would be "you violate me" or, rather darker, "you ra pe me".
That’s the phrase she used, and she explained that some might interpret as meaning the ‘R’ word and I thought blimey, that’s a bit grim, but then she said no, the nearest and more common interpretation is violate me, still a bit grim, but I just wrote the chords and melody and let her get on with it. Then the other day I thought I could revive the tune but sing about the planet being violated. Thanks
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby blinddrew » Fri Jun 04, 2021 10:41 pm

Though if you are talking about humanity as a whole doing this it should be plural, so Vous me violez I think.
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby FrankF » Fri Jun 04, 2021 11:07 pm

L'humanité EST / humanity IS, not ARE. Just saying, Drew. :smirk:

I've had a 2nd listen to it, and there's a bit more French, so what is it? "Tu me ....?"

I'm being pedantic because, if you pronounced it (and the first phrase) more correctly, it might have the potential for success in France. The French absolutely love it if you throw in a few French words, and they'd love it even more if the title were French, but it has to be CORRECT French! They are even more pedantic about grammar, pronunciation etc., than I'm being.

So, going into full Mickey Most mode, I'd add some accordeon at the beginning as an intro, which would make a nice symmetry with the sweet accordeon outro.
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby blinddrew » Sat Jun 05, 2021 11:17 am

FrankF wrote:L'humanité EST / humanity IS, not ARE. Just saying, Drew. :smirk:
But we're in the vocative directly addressing a multitude surely?
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby FrankF » Sat Jun 05, 2021 1:21 pm

blinddrew wrote:
FrankF wrote:L'humanité EST / humanity IS, not ARE. Just saying, Drew. :smirk:
But we're in the vocative directly addressing a multitude surely?

"Blessed are the cheesemakers!" :smirk:

Ultimately, I guess it's up to the songwriter how he (or she, if the girl wrote the lyrics) prefers to phrase it, but I take your point. :thumbup:
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Re: Comments a-go-go please

Postby blinddrew » Sat Jun 05, 2021 2:23 pm

FrankF wrote:
blinddrew wrote:
FrankF wrote:L'humanité EST / humanity IS, not ARE. Just saying, Drew. :smirk:
But we're in the vocative directly addressing a multitude surely?

"Blessed are the cheesemakers!" :smirk:

Ultimately, I guess it's up to the songwriter how he (or she, if the girl wrote the lyrics) prefers to phrase it, but I take your point. :thumbup:
Are you suggesting that our grammar pedantry might not be the most important thing to helping the OP sort out their song? :D
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