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The Doctor's Band

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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Sat Apr 29, 2017 4:24 am

shufflebeat wrote:Punk Freud
:lol: Keeping
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby petev3.1 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 1:57 pm

Hmm. Perhaps book publishing was a poor example. But it's not a question of taking chances on artists. This is self-publishing. The idea would be to charge them up-front. Their success or failure would make no difference to the main fee. It might only be an advisory role or it might be comprehensive management, but it would be a professional service and not a punt on the artist for a percentage.

It may be impractical for various reasons, but as the OP indicates there's a demand.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby blinddrew » Sat Apr 29, 2017 2:15 pm

On that we agree, a more straightforward, transaction-based approach. Not dissimilar to the way you approach studio time.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Sun Apr 30, 2017 2:00 am

Or like we paid the layer guy (our album is a parody of a film), we just paid him his fee and he offered his experience and knowledge.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby gridsleep » Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:02 am

I read the title and thought it was an article about Peter Capaldi and Craig Ferguson getting the band back together.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby CS70 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 9:45 pm

petev3.1 wrote:Going back a bit...

Why is nobody offering bands an expert advice, release and promotion service for a reasonable fee? Why do competent labels not offer to release anything they feel is good for a fee? It worked for Taylor Swift, albeit that was a big money deal. It's almost a no-risk situation for the consultant/label, and with the right contract could occasionally bring in a lot more than the initial fees.

Given the membership here this question should be answerable. The self-publishing market in books is a model, where the publisher does all the stuff the author cannot do and advises them etc. Is this not a potential earner for any out of work ex-A&R exec. or manager?

I would guess it's just the math that doesn't add up? There's gazillions of hopefuls, a few of which making music which has any chance of making any kind of money (by working dozens of live shows per year and attracting enough paying audience to become profitable) and a few of 'em few would actually reaching commercial success.

To have any meaningful returns, any fixed fee would have to be far than reasonable.

It was already a questionable model when recorded music had some economic value, nowadays when most of the returns come from playing live, I guess it'd be a recipe for ending up sleeping on the street.

Just a guess of course, I haven't run any actual math. :)
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Sun Apr 30, 2017 11:13 pm

Earlier in the week I sent a "50quid" message to a blogger, who at the time was chatting live to about 2600 people, on his youtube account (with in total has about 1,000,000 subscribers).

I asked him to come watch our music video, "because it would be cool knowing he'd seen it" and gave him the band name and video name

He read out our band name, the video title and thanked me for the donation to his channel,

that message and donation lead to, within an hour, 200 views from his channel coming over to see our video, and a steady stream ever since, since that playback of his live talk is now up on youtube and being slowly watched by some of the other 1,000,000 people subscribed to his channel.

Mostly, (in fact all) positive, feedback, from these people about our video.


Now that was 50quid well spent, but why isn't there someone I could give 200 quid to , who could, meet us for one hour, listen to the stuff, and if he/she didn't like the stuff they would give us advice for the future, or if they did, pass it on to people of influence?

a GP charges whatever he does an hour. So do specialists in any number of fields. Why hasn't somebody monetized music business consultancy?
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Guest » Mon May 01, 2017 8:48 am

Aurongroove wrote:... Now that was 50quid well spent, but why isn't there someone I could give 200 quid to , who could, meet us for one hour, listen to the stuff, and if he/she didn't like the stuff they would give us advice for the future, or if they did, pass it on to people of influence?

a GP charges whatever he does an hour. So do specialists in any number of fields. Why hasn't somebody monetized music business consultancy?


The music has no direction or energy and lacks a hook, the video is naff, that’s my honest opinion.

Just suppose I’m this ‘specialist’ and the above is my expert opinion, wot you gonna do about it? Cry or improve? how can you improve if you don’t know something’s wrong in the first place?

Nobody can tell you how to do it, writing HITS is not something that can be learnt, only experienced.

As a songwriter you are wot you listen to, if you listen to average music there’s a fair chance that’s wot you’ll produce.

The track lacks so much, it sounds half-hearted and half-done, there could/should be a lot more substance and energy in there.

It needs producing, find a producer, then, if’n when you write & produced a hit between you, just send it to a music Promo company, specialists in fact, you’ll pay ’em 200 quid +, and they’ll get it on the radio etc, then Bob’s yer aunt and Fanny’s yer Transgender uncle, ‘ow ‘ard’s that?

My opinion is it’s not good enough and that you need to do a fair bit better, if you can’t then you need people involved who can.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Tue May 02, 2017 9:23 pm

I think you're misunderstanding the situation Ldash, in several ways.

First off, if you were "this specialist"
The music has no direction or energy and lacks a hook, the video is naff, that’s my honest opinion.
is opinion, not direction.
You wouldn't be "this specialist" for very long if that was the best you could do, paid or unpaid. I given better direction on EDM forums, for free, as a hobby.

Secondly if you were "this specialist" and you were otherwise respected in your field, and had connections in the industry, and had successes in the field too but this was genuinely your best effort. To say that that we were simply beyond directing/advising, and that we just vaguely needed "more enegry and production" before we may ring up and order our fame from "specialists, in fact" for a small fee.

Why, would we, or anyone "cry" about it?

Sorry, but you're advice in general stems from a misguided understanding of the conversation. It's also, in itself quite vague, and even by my own standards, naive and misinformed.
In fact, It serves as a prime example of the kind of stuff we would be avoiding if there were the availability of "this specialist".
No offence.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue May 02, 2017 10:10 pm

Have to say that although my tastes in music are an awful long way from most (dyed-in-the-wool folky with strong leanings towards the traditional end) I watched and listened right to the end of your video, which is most unusual for me. It was well worth it. Excellent.

CC
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Wed May 03, 2017 1:46 am

ConcertinaChap wrote:Have to say that although my tastes in music are an awful long way from most (dyed-in-the-wool folky with strong leanings towards the traditional end) I watched and listened right to the end of your video, which is most unusual for me. It was well worth it. Excellent.

CC
Ha. Nice to hear.
Two of us are actually folk musicians by 'day' I suppose you could say.

I typically earn a living as a folk singer these days, (Mostly Irish and American folk)
and my mate on bass used to be in The Fureys for a few years there, before giving it up last year.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Guest » Wed May 03, 2017 9:22 am

I was pussy footing about pulling me punches, your response tells me I was right to.

Don’t take my word for it, send it to a promo company, they also Um+Ahh tracks, see if they wanna promote it, this is what the Major’s do too.



Have to say that although my tastes in music are an awful long way from most (dyed-in-the-wool folky with strong leanings towards the traditional end) I watched and listened right to the end of your video, which is most unusual for me. It was well worth it. Excellent.

CC

Tastes? I like any 'taste' as long as it's good/great, a good tune's a good tune regardless of genre or century written.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Wed May 03, 2017 12:25 pm

LdashD wrote:I was pussy footing about pulling me punches, your response tells me I was right to.

I don't understand the colloquialisms in this sentence, could you say what you mean in formal english?

Not trying to be smart, It's just I don't know what you mean.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby shufflebeat » Wed May 03, 2017 6:07 pm

Aurongroove wrote:...could you say what you mean in formal english?

+1
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby BigRedX » Thu May 04, 2017 10:28 am

To the OP - Well Done! I really liked that!

The music isn't without precedent. Search out The Hellset Orchestra and Abney Park, also Mew and dare I say it - 10CC? Clever, quirky music that still knows a catchy melody is important.

What to do next? That's the tricky bit. TBH unless one of your videos suddenly goes viral, you are going to have to get out there and gig. I'd suggest that you really need to bring the visual quirkiness of the video to your live performance. Bands who are visually as well as musically entertaining are the ones that get remembered, and consequently the ones that can ask for and get a sensible payment for playing live.

Then you have to make sure that all your merchandising ducks are in a row, and that you have plenty of CDs records T-shirts and other stuff to sell (and someone to sell them for you) at the gigs.

I've found from both personal experience with The Terrortones as well as conversations with other gigging bands that very few people by downloads from independent artists. Our download sales account for less than 5% of our total income from recorded music. The vast majority of it comes form selling CDs, vinyl and cassettes at gigs, followed by PRS royalties from gigs and radio play, and then selling CDs and records mail-order through our web site and Bandcamp.

Income from purchased downloads is by comparison almost negligible and will very likely have been overtaken by streaming on Spotify and Deezer by the end of this year.

Also taking into account the cost of recording as well as the actual production costs of making physical product we have yet to see a profit on any of our releases. On the other hand all our T-shirt designs have gone into profit even thought none have sold out. It's a little bit depressing to discover that audience members are far happier to pay £10 for a T-shirt which probably has a unit cost of under £3 to make, whilst an album on CD or record costing the same to buy and with a much smaller profit margin is less attractive to them.

There are always exceptions to this, but I haven't come across any gigging bands on the same level as the Terrortones that seem to be doing any differently.

I know also as a punter, that at the end of a gig, having had a couple of beers if I have enjoyed the band and have money in my pocket, I'm probably going to be buying a CD from them. Deciding to buy a download in the cold light of the following day (assuming that I remember to do so) is a lot less likely to happen.

That means you need to get out there and play live. And be visually and musically amazing whilst doing it!

Good luck!
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby CS70 » Sun May 07, 2017 1:09 pm

LdashD wrote:The music has no direction or energy and lacks a hook, the video is naff, that’s my honest opinion.

Goes to show you can't please everybody. It's a plus - means your music ain't bland.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Aurongroove » Mon May 08, 2017 1:47 pm

BigRedX wrote:To the OP - Well Done! I really liked that!

The music isn't without precedent. Search out The Hellset Orchestra and Abney Park, also Mew and dare I say it - 10CC? Clever, quirky music that still knows a catchy melody is important.
Sorry mate, I though I replied to this with a big reply full of compliments ages ago.
I must have had the reply all typed out and ready and got distracted by food, and forgot to click 'send'!!


What to do next? That's the tricky bit. TBH unless one of your videos suddenly goes viral, you are going to have to get out there and gig. I'd suggest that you really need to bring the visual quirkiness of the video to your live performance.
Done and done! if anything the video plays down the live shenanigans.

(not going to go on quoting each bit)

Suffice to say, cheers Big Red, we got the green light for a good chest-full of merch thanks to our kickstarter just breaking over 4k, and counting (final few days this week).
Hearing you voice those concerns is a big relief to me, because we've predicted the same concerns and I think we're well ready to tackle them! (well, as ready as we can possibly be) We should have plenty of T-shirts ready to go as well as badges stickers, CDs and Vinyl.

Perhaps some day we'll grab you for a concert. The terrortones seem like great craic (would make an awesome Halloween gig two bands like that, don't you think? people dancing and shaking their stuff in fancy dress).



CS70 wrote:
LdashD wrote:The music has no direction or energy and lacks a hook, the video is naff, that’s my honest opinion.

Goes to show you can't please everybody. It's a plus - means your music ain't bland.
I wouldn't worry to much CS70, I think he was.... "pussyfooting" or something, anyways we'll never know for certain, but I believe he was mostly saying it to make a point.

Anyways, I'm not too worried, he's not the first, and he won't be the last.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Guest » Tue May 09, 2017 8:08 am

I’m trying to be helpful, you state you’d pay for experienced advice, I gave it for free, you’re not interested, I can understand that, let it lie lad.

It’s not a HIT, time alone will tell.
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby Forum Admin » Tue May 09, 2017 8:21 am

gridsleep wrote:I read the title and thought it was an article about Peter Capaldi and Craig Ferguson getting the band back together.

Ah... maybe that's why he quit Doctor Who? [Wrong Capaldi... I'll get me coat. :smirk: ]
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Re: The Doctor's Band

Postby shufflebeat » Tue May 09, 2017 3:50 pm

LdashD wrote:...you state you’d pay for experienced advice, I gave it for free,

No, that was subjective opinion, and worth every penny.
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