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Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby ManFromGlass » Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:29 pm

Sorry to make light of a serious topic but Hugh gets the major guffaw of the day today!
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"Avoid miserable old people telling you what to do"

Brilliant.

But perhaps it should be "avoid miserable old people"
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:49 pm

Eddy Deegan wrote:Equally, there are people who have weighed up the risks/rewards, done nothing as a result and regretted it ever since. I know, or at least used to know, some of them. They are still moaning about how rubbish life is, and how they could, should or would have done this or that. Ultimately they turn into "it's somebody elses fault" mindsets and it's no way to be.

Don't impose that mindset on the youth, they have more ability and drive than you might imagine, even against the odds.

Well said! I concur.

When I was much younger I came across so many miserable old gits with their 'practical realisms' putting a downer on everything. Fortunately, I also found three phenomenal people who became mentors at different stages of my career and they helped and encoraged me to seize the opportunities and push myself beyond my self-imposed boundaries -- directly influencing and enabling the extraordinary career I've enjoyed to date.

I still relish the luxury and priviledge of being asked to help to train young adults in the music tech and broadcast industries occasionally, and I find it both inspiring and rewarding to encourage them to recognise and develop their skills and talents and forge their own unique careers in the new world that awaits them -- a world that is inherently very different from the one I entered 35 years ago.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Wonks » Thu Aug 01, 2019 10:50 pm

ManFromGlass wrote:Sorry to make light of a serious topic but Hugh gets the major guffaw of the day today!
:clap:
"Avoid miserable old people telling you what to do"

Brilliant.

But perhaps it should be "avoid miserable old people"

Are you telling me to do that?
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby blinddrew » Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:08 pm

https://xkcd.com/893/
The scroll-over text is the important bit for this discussion.

And as for a universal income and the concept of people not working, it's coming, best start preparing for it.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby hobbyist » Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:54 pm

blinddrew wrote:https://xkcd.com/893/
The scroll-over text is the important bit for this discussion.

And as for a universal income and the concept of people not working, it's coming, best start preparing for it.


Maybe. They will try. Hope they don't get elected. Or at least that I am on the last train to clocksville out of here first.

Or maybe the world economy will implode before they finish getting that idea working. Anybody who can think logically knows to a metaphysical certitude that it is impossible to achieve.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby hobbyist » Thu Aug 01, 2019 11:59 pm

Eddy Deegan wrote:
hobbyist wrote:I prefer to think that I am realistic and weigh the risks/rewards before doing something.

That only works up to a point, is my point. There are many people who have just gone for it and succeeded in situations where if they had weighed up the risk/rewards before doing something, they would not have done it.

I'm one of them. My current job (I founded a now very viable company and employ a number of bright sparks who are making it go from strength to strength) went against the grain in many ways and no sane backer would ever have invested in it on paper. I went to that meeting, looked them in the eye, promised I could do it and even though some of the things I was saying I had no idea how I was going to deliver, I had faith I'd figure it out and that was tomorrow's problem. And indeed I figured out ways of doing them, with help from people who understood what I was trying to do.

Equally, there are people who have weighed up the risks/rewards, done nothing as a result and regretted it ever since. I know, or at least used to know, some of them. They are still moaning about how rubbish life is, and how they could, should or would have done this or that. Ultimately they turn into "it's somebody elses fault" mindsets and it's no way to be.

Don't impose that mindset on the youth, they have more ability and drive than you might imagine, even against the odds. Also, and especially when you're young, failure is an option. It is this mindset that powered many of the companies with multi-billion turnovers around today. Try it, and if it doesn't work out, shrug it off and try something else. Rinse and repeat. For those of us who are now a little older it's a hard lesson to learn because back in the day things didn't work that way, but it works and more power to their elbow.

Youngsters should be encouraged to throw themselves at anything they want to do. Not at the expense of all else, but to follow their heart regardless. They are way better at bouncing back than older folk are, and they have time to do it too. Plus, now and again they succeed with the craziest plans, which if they'd weighed the odds beforehand they would never have even attempted.

Fear is the enemy.

Some people hit the lottery too. It's the retirement plan for too many people I know as they can't save enough to retire on.

Millions of millenials are living in their parents basement playing video games with a worthless degree.

Who will take care of them after their parents die?
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby The Red Bladder » Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:56 am

Hugh Robjohns wrote:1. Life is what you make of it. 2. If you think you can succeed, or you think you can't, you're absolutely right! 3. Avoid miserable old people telling you you have no chance...
If you take nothing else away from this entire website or indeed the Internet as a whole, take heed of this advice!

Especially point number two!

I'll put that one slightly differently - you are not what I or others think you are - you are what YOU think you are!
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby hobbyist » Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:02 am

The Red Bladder wrote:
Hugh Robjohns wrote:1. Life is what you make of it. 2. If you think you can succeed, or you think you can't, you're absolutely right! 3. Avoid miserable old people telling you you have no chance...
If you take nothing else away from this entire website or indeed the Internet as a whole, take heed of this advice!

Especially point number two!

I'll put that one slightly differently - you are not what I or others think you are - you are what YOU think you are!

Being positive and thinking confidently are good but only go so far as you actually can do it.

The little engine that could was just a kiddy book.

https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/the-li ... 17225248#/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7wQM1LwCCs
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby MOF » Fri Aug 02, 2019 3:10 am

Millions of millenials are living in their parents basement playing video games with a worthless degree.

I did a history degree, I didn’t want to teach it, so on the face of it I was unemployable.
I was accepted as a trainee accountant by a top firm (I thought it best to learn how to manage my money when I became a pop star :D also to please my parents and I thought it was in the family genes, 1981 was not a good time for job hunting, even for graduates) but soon realised I hated it, so by mutual consent left.
I did several jobs I was over qualified for while I got into TV sound.
If those millennials (who to paraphrase Tebbit are more than capable of being very mobile in the jobs market) just sit there with their games consoles and expect the perfect job to land in their collective laps then they deserve to be disappointed, bitter and cynical.
If they use the fact that they’ve got a degree to show to prospective employers that they’re capable of learning new skills, keen to learn and be self motivated then they’ll do well, or maybe they’ll set up their own businesses, not necessarily in the music industry but maybe in a related field.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby awjoe » Fri Aug 02, 2019 4:53 am

blinddrew wrote:
James Perrett wrote:
awjoe wrote:Small is beautiful, but could small work? Does this model of a small, clever team supporting/exploiting the efforts of a small stable of talent exist anywhere else?

I see that sort of thing happening all over the place but usually we're talking about one person working on their own focusing on one aspect. So we have a promoter who just specialises in promoting gigs, a label owner who looks after recordings and usually the artist looks after the other merchandise. The successful labels know their market - some are going to be known for pushing barriers while others are known for a particular genre. Even well known labels are usually pretty small operations.

It feels like there's space for an ecosystem of like-minded people to work together there. Probably not as a formal partnership but as a collection of skills that are working to the same ends.

I'm still trying to answer the original question 'Can someone still make it work?' but from the point of view of the writer/performer, because that's what I do. My stuff comes awfully close to really listenable sometimes, and I'm wondering if it had access to the small company/collective model I described if it would make it any more listenable. I don't think so. It might make it more listened to, but that's only half of what 'making it' means to me.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Eddy Deegan » Fri Aug 02, 2019 9:06 am

hobbyist wrote:
Eddy Deegan wrote:
hobbyist wrote:I prefer to think that I am realistic and weigh the risks/rewards before doing something.

That only works up to a point, is my point. There are many people who have just gone for it and succeeded in situations where if they had weighed up the risk/rewards before doing something, they would not have done it.
...

Fear is the enemy.

Some people hit the lottery too. It's the retirement plan for too many people I know as they can't save enough to retire on.

Millions of millenials are living in their parents basement playing video games with a worthless degree.

Who will take care of them after their parents die?

I don't think anything I said is comparable to winning the lottery in any way and the vast majority of millennials living in their parents basement don't need looking after after their parents die any more than they need looking after now.

I also very much doubt there are millions of people with degrees sitting round doing nothing. Degrees are almost as much about learning how to work at something, almost anything, as they are about an academic subject in and of itself.

The main question of the thread was "Can someone still make it now?". Assuming 'making it' means making a living then yes, someone can and a lot do. A minority of those will make it big, much as has always been the case.

What you're now talking about is apathy, not ability or possibility.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby blinddrew » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:08 am

hobbyist wrote:Millions of millenials are living in their parents basement playing video games with a worthless degree.

Who will take care of them after their parents die?
XKXD continues to provide:
Image

hobbyist wrote:Being positive and thinking confidently are good but only go so far as you actually can do it.

The little engine that could was just a kiddy book.

It would appear that you have already decided your answer to this thread, which would probably be news to the various young producers, engineers and artists featured every month in a certain music technology magazine... ;)
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby blinddrew » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:09 am

awjoe wrote:I'm still trying to answer the original question 'Can someone still make it work?' but from the point of view of the writer/performer, because that's what I do. My stuff comes awfully close to really listenable sometimes, and I'm wondering if it had access to the small company/collective model I described if it would make it any more listenable. I don't think so. It might make it more listened to, but that's only half of what 'making it' means to me.
Ah, so, first question then, what does 'making it' mean to you?
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Eddy Deegan » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:30 am

blinddrew wrote:XKXD continues to provide:

It does indeed! The image link was broken in your post, here it is:

Image
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Fri Aug 02, 2019 11:07 am

I fixed the original link, too! :D
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby ManFromGlass » Fri Aug 02, 2019 1:03 pm

"Still make it now" - yes what does that mean?

In the composer community here in Canada some think you are a success if you don’t have a secondary job to support your composing job. That may mean you are just eking by by composing music for projects with the lowest of budgets and lower production value.

This is probably the furthest a composer can be from landing an A List Hollywood film or tv series on a major network with all the $$ and prestige that goes with that. Not to mention stress levels.
Yet having the bills covered by doing something one is passionate about is a definite form of making it.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby blinddrew » Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:10 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:I fixed the original link, too! :D
Thanks, my browser here doesn't actually let me see the embedded images so I have to guess... :headbang:
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby Wonks » Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:11 pm

blinddrew wrote:
Hugh Robjohns wrote:I fixed the original link, too! :D
Thanks, my browser here doesn't actually let me see the embedded images so I have to guess... :headbang:

It's all fluffy kittens and cute puppies.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby awjoe » Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:21 pm

blinddrew wrote:
awjoe wrote:I'm still trying to answer the original question 'Can someone still make it work?' but from the point of view of the writer/performer, because that's what I do. My stuff comes awfully close to really listenable sometimes, and I'm wondering if it had access to the small company/collective model I described if it would make it any more listenable. I don't think so. It might make it more listened to, but that's only half of what 'making it' means to me.
Ah, so, first question then, what does 'making it' mean to you?

From the point of view of a writer/performer, 'making it' means making a significant amount of money in exchange for producing the music that I really want to make for myself and others with freedom to explore and grow.

Significant amount of money means enough to pay the bills. Not the $.85 I've made on Spotify.

Music that I really want to make means music that I enjoy listening to. Not a niche job in the music industry producing something I'm not personally interested in.

Freedom to explore and grow means like the Beatles did.
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Re: Can someone still make it now? What are the odds? Mixerman says we are all hobbyists now.

Postby blinddrew » Fri Aug 02, 2019 2:52 pm

Ok, based 100% on that definition, i'm going to say that's unlikely. Certainly in the early stages such an ecosystem will have to compromise on some or all of those things until you've established your USP.
But that doesn't mean it couldn't work in the longer term.

I reckon... ;)
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