You are here

Using Charlie Chaplin samples?

Advice on everything from getting your music heard to setting up a label and royalties.

Re: Using Charlie Chaplin samples?

Postby CS70 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:27 pm

The Red Bladder wrote:A great deal of misinformation here -

The original work is indeed out of copyright BUT you MUST have a copy of the original and take your audio from that and not from some more recent source that has been reworked and therefore has renewed the copyright.

Hm don't think there was any disinformation.. if it's a new reworked version of a work, it's no longer what is in the public domain - that is the original! Don't think many would think otherwise.

As for re-scanning - there's no need at all if you find someone's else scan and they are willing to give it to you. Scanning by itself doesn't create a new work (no more than copying a recording does). The websites listed by Martin appear to do just that: they transfer old film to digital format and provide the result free of charge.

Of course there's plenty sites which don't - and charge people for the work they've done.
User avatar
CS70
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4745
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 1:00 am
Location: Oslo, Norway
Silver Spoon - Check out our latest video and the FB page

Re: Using Charlie Chaplin samples?

Postby blinddrew » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:37 pm

The Red Bladder wrote:And now the knotty question of - Would they really go after some poor schmuck putting out a bit of music on a CD or on YouTube?

The answer is YES. They have to!

They have to, not because they are hard-hearted swine or because they have nothing better to do, but because otherwise the copyright really does fall into the public domain and anybody can then show a reworked and remastered movie and even broadcast the damn thing.

Under US law, undefended copyright becomes public domain property!
I'm sorry but I'd like to see a citation on this. Trademark yes, copyright no. Something only enters the public domain once the duration of the copyright has expired or because it has been deliberately assigned that way, not because it has been widely used.
There are a myriad of options available to the copyright holder to make their work as available or unavailable as they choose. From blanket Creative Commons By Accreditation to writing individual licences for specific uses for free to retaining all their rights and asking for millions of dollars.
User avatar
blinddrew
Jedi Poster
Posts: 8975
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 12:00 am
Location: York
Ignore the post count, I have no idea what I'm doing...

Re: Using Charlie Chaplin samples?

Postby MOF » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:51 pm

Charlie Chaplin died in 1977 so add 70 years and then you can use his works, the ‘mechanical’ rights may have elapsed (?) but the ‘publishing’ aspect hasn’t.
MOF
Frequent Poster
Posts: 587
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2003 1:00 am
Location: United Kingdom

Re: Using Charlie Chaplin samples?

Postby The Red Bladder » Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:24 pm

CS70 wrote:Hm don't think there was any disinformation.. if it's a new reworked version of a work, it's no longer what is in the public domain - that is the original! Don't think many would think otherwise.
Unfortunately, they do! Many punters imagine that if they find a copy of a Chaplin film where the original was made in the 1920s, that copy they found somewhere must be in the public domain - it is not! It is a copy and as such is almost certainly watermarked and processed.

Old films will be put through a digital wetgate and the edits will be reworked and the timing altered and generally cleaned up. That revised version now has fresh copyright.

If push comes to shove and it ends up in court, the defendant will have to prove that they had access to the original or at least a copy that is out of copyright. The plaintiff merely has to show that in all probability, the defendant used a more recent copy for which the plaintiff owns the IP.

CS70 wrote:The websites listed by Martin appear to do just that: they transfer old film to digital format and provide the result free of charge.
It is proving that in all probability that is what was used that is the problem!

Leo Kirch bought up all the copyrights to nearly all Laurel & Hardy films back when they were still in copyright. He also made sure that there were as few 35mm copies of the films knocking about as possible by buying them up as well. He then had the originals lovingly restored and allowed a very few shorts to be broadcast to cover his costs. Yes, there are grot-versions with scratches and noise all over the place but these are taken from old 8mm and 16mm reels that were sold to the public and to film clubs after the war.

Today if you could find a 35mm original and get it cleaned up at your cost (or find a kind soul with a Cintel machine that does this for you) then you are good to go and you can safely ignore that 'cease and desist' letter!
The Red Bladder
Frequent Poster (Level2)
Posts: 2346
Joined: Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:00 am
Location: . . .
 

Previous

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users