You are here

MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

For current or would-be users of Apple Mac computers, with answers to many FAQs.

MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby Blott » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:50 am

I've recently added a brand new SSD to my Mac Pro tower and used the opportunity to do a fresh installation of all my music software including the new version of Logic 10.4.
All is fine and dandy apart from MIDI Learn.
I've a few knobbly synths (Prophet 12, Rev2 & Studiologic Sledge and I wanted to be able to map the knobs of those synths to control the plugins I use in Logic.
The problem is it doesn't seem to work properly.
For example, if I create a new song in Logic from a new empty template add an instance of the ES1 synth, press Command & L for MIDI learn.
Put it into expert view and create a 'zone' called Prophet 12.
Next in the mode column, create a 'mode' called ES1.
Now click the cutoff of the ES1 and click 'Learn' and you'll get prompted to assign a knob...so far so good.
However when done the control isn't saved to the ES2 mode or even to the Prophet 12 zone, but instead gets put in a 'Global Views' zone under a mode of 'None'???Grrrr!!!!
Is this just a bug in 10.4, or am I losing my marbles.?
As you can see in the video I already successfully assigned the ES2 synth just moments before.
A video showing what I mean can be viewed here...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bcv35sjjb5vd4vc/Logic%20Midi%20Learn%20Problem.mov?dl=0
Any ideas would be much appreciated.
Thanks :)
User avatar
Blott
Regular
Posts: 409
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:00 pm
Location: Nottingham UK
http://soundcloud.com/blottuk
http://blottuk.bandcamp.com

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby desmond » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:59 am

Blott wrote:The problem is it doesn't seem to work properly.

By this do you mean that the behaviour in 10.4 is different to the behaviour in previous versions in this regard, or do you mean that Logic (in general) is not doing what you expect it to do?

Blott wrote:For example, if I create a new song in Logic from a new empty template add an instance of the ES1 synth, press Command & L for MIDI learn.
Put it into expert view and create a 'zone' called Prophet 12.
Next in the mode column, create a 'mode' called ES1.
Now click the cutoff of the ES1 and click 'Learn' and you'll get prompted to assign a knob...so far so good.
However when done the control isn't saved to the ES2 mode or even to the Prophet 12 zone, but instead gets put in a 'Global Views' zone under a mode of 'None'???Grrrr!!!!
Is this just a bug in 10.4, or am I losing my marbles.?

I just tried this in 10.3.3, and it worked as expected for me. I can't try 10.4, unfortunately.

If it's a new bug in 10.4, then you could always, as a workaround, either create your assignment and then move them to the correct mode afterwards, or do the mapping in 10.3.3 instead..?

You could try temporarily moving your control surface prefs to the desktop, then starting Logic so it creates a blank empty set, then retry the assignments again there - if it works, that might indicate some form of preference corruption with your main set perhaps...
User avatar
desmond
Jedi Poster
Posts: 7969
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:00 am

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby Blott » Sat Feb 10, 2018 3:07 pm

I can't be entirely sure that the behaviour is different to previous versions of Logic, as in the past I haven't gone through the trouble of permanently mapping all of my synths to plugins. With it being a fresh install on a brand new SSD it felt like a perfect opportunity to set up everything properly.
A bit tedious and laborious, but hopefully worthwhile in the long run - at least that was my thinking at the time.


It worked as expected for me too....for the first plugin.
So I was able to map a set for the ES2 absolutely fine literally 5 minutes before, the trouble seems to start when trying to map a second plugin.


I've jumped from Logic Pro X 10.2 as I was on OSX Mavericks (10.95) and 10.2 was as late as I could go with that OS.

I'll try your suggestion about deleting the preferences, but it's a fresh install so I feel it's unlikely to be a corrupted file at this point. That said stranger things have happened I suppose and no one would be happier than me if that resolves it. :)

I've still got my previous system on another HD, so I'll try booting back into that later and see if Logic Maps correctly in that version.
Not sure how I'd copy those settings across though?

I'd be quite happy to move this misfiled assignments to the correct mode manually, but as far as I can see there isn't actually any way to do that, as click and drag does not appear to work.

Thanks for your suggestions, I'll post back when I've tried everything and let you know if it works. :)
User avatar
Blott
Regular
Posts: 409
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:00 pm
Location: Nottingham UK
http://soundcloud.com/blottuk
http://blottuk.bandcamp.com

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby desmond » Sat Feb 10, 2018 4:06 pm

Blott wrote:Not sure how I'd copy those settings across though?

Your control surface prefs are the file:
~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic.pro.cs

Blott wrote:I'd be quite happy to move this misfiled assignments to the correct mode manually, but as far as I can see there isn't actually any way to do that, as click and drag does not appear to work.

Copy/pasting works fine.

Question: You seem to be setting up Modes for each instrument plugin. Is there a specific reason you are doing this? Or are you just doing it because you think that's what you need to do?

(Note, I have mappings for *many* instrument plugins in Logic - in fact, it was only until LPX that I could do this successfully, due to long standing bugs in the controller assignments handling (I'd wanted to do this since LP7...) - so I can tell you how I do it, if you like.)

But if you have specific reasons for doing it the way you're doing it, then I'll shut up...! :headbang:
User avatar
desmond
Jedi Poster
Posts: 7969
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:00 am

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby Blott » Sat Feb 10, 2018 4:46 pm

desmond wrote:Question: You seem to be setting up Modes for each instrument plugin. Is there a specific reason you are doing this? Or are you just doing it because you think that's what you need to do?
Both really.

I thought it was the way you had to do it tbh, but also the order and neatness of having separate Modes satisfies the OCD streak in me! :)

I thought it'd be wise since I'm going to be mapping the same plugins to three different synths. The idea being that that whichever one I'm sat in front of I'll still have the same control of my soft synths regardless (or at least that was my plan).

If you just did them all under one Mode I just thought it'd be messy. I thought that was the point in having the option for multiple Modes?


desmond wrote:(Note, I have mappings for *many* instrument plugins in Logic - in fact, it was only until LPX that I could do this successfully, due to long standing bugs in the controller assignments handling (I'd wanted to do this since LP7...) - so I can tell you how I do it, if you like.)
If you know of a quicker, more reliable way i'd be very grateful - thanks. :)
User avatar
Blott
Regular
Posts: 409
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:00 pm
Location: Nottingham UK
http://soundcloud.com/blottuk
http://blottuk.bandcamp.com

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby desmond » Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:09 pm

Blott wrote:I thought it'd be wise since I'm going to be mapping the same plugins to three different synths. The idea being that that whichever one I'm sat in front of I'll still have the same control of my soft synths regardless (or at least that was my plan).

Ok, this means that to control your target synth, you need to load that synth, and then press a button to select the desired mode for that synth, before the controls will work. Not optimal, really. You call up your EVB3, and then before the controls will work, you've got to remember to hit button 17 on your controller which is the button you've mapped to select the EVB3 mode... :headbang:

Blott wrote:If you just did them all under one Mode I just thought it'd be messy. I thought that was the point in having the option for multiple Modes?

Not really, but kind of. The point of modes is to be able to reuse certain controls for different purposes. If you look at a Mackie Control (which is a kind of reference implementation for the controller assignments, as this what what they were built for), the soft knobs along the top - sometimes you want them to be pan controls, sometime you want them to be aux send controls, sometimes you want them to be instrument edit knobs, sometime you want them to be plugin edit knobs. This is a good example of how to us Modes - the MCU has an "EQ" button which puts the Knob zones into EQ mode, and there is a "Pan" button which puts them into Pan mode, etc...

But you don't need to do this for the purpose of targetting different instrument plugins to edit.

Try this (and this is how my instrument assignments are done):-
Forget about Modes and Zones for the sake of this test, do any test assignments in the default "No Zone" and no Mode to keep thing simple.

- Load an ES1.
- Assign the knob you want to use for Filter Cutoff to it's cutoff parameter.
- Now replace that with an ES2.
- Learn *the same knob* to the ES2's cutoff parameter.
(These should all be directed to "Selected Channel Strip" BTW).

Ok. So what happens now? Any channel strip can only ever have one instrument loaded on it. So, load the ES1, and twiddle your cutoff knob. It works. Replace that with an ES2 and twiddle the same knob - it just works.

There is no extra step of having to put the controls into the correct mode for each different synth you want to control - you can learn the same control to parameters of multiple synths - the assignment remain unique to that instrument, and only the ones that match the loaded instrument will apply at any given time - the rest are ignored.

I have about 16-30 assignments for each of probably over 50 plugins assigned this way. It works great, the correct controls target the correct parameters based on what instrument is on the selected channel strip.

(This is what never used to work reliably in previous versions of Logic - you could make the assignments, but after about 7 or so instruments, the mappings would get flakey and unreliable and misbehave).

No modes involved at all - i just works, transparently, once mapped, and you don't have to do anything else (at least for this application).

And this is all without factoring LPX's Smart Controls into the process, which is another way of setting this up...
User avatar
desmond
Jedi Poster
Posts: 7969
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 12:00 am

Re: MIDI Learn Problem in Logic Pro X 10.4?

Postby Blott » Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:17 pm

Thanks Desmond, will give that a try and let you know how I get on. :)
User avatar
Blott
Regular
Posts: 409
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 11:00 pm
Location: Nottingham UK
http://soundcloud.com/blottuk
http://blottuk.bandcamp.com


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users