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Fan going like the clappers

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Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 3:02 pm
by kinglouis
Hi all,

I have a 15" 2018 MBP 2.9 i9, 32 GB. I bought it last October.

It was a bit of a pig getting it started, kept crashing whilst initially updating the OS, got there after some hand holding from Apple Support. A month later I had to send it back to Apple as it kept crashing every 20 minutes, regardless of whether under stress or not (ie writing an email or running Final Cut Pro). They replaced the logic board and touch bar.

Since then it hasn't crashed but the fans run hard an awful lot, again regardless of workload. I have it sitting on top of a case, not in it - so as to keep the bottom as cool as possible. It doesn't seem to have an effect on the Mac but its really loud! Which can be problematic in a recording studio.

Are there some tests I can run on it? Is it a known problem with 2018 MBPs?

Thanks very much folks,

Alex

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 3:46 pm
by desmond
Well, the i9's run hot anyway, and all that ram also draws power (and thus generates heat), and the MBP cases of this era are very thin, so cooling is always going to be a problem.

I wouldn't have thought the fans would be working hard when the machine is just idling though - what temperature does your machine idle at? Does you have other processes going on working the CPU? (check with Activity Monitor).

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:15 pm
by kinglouis
According to the Activity Monitor, Logic Pro (43%) and Now tv (70%, watching cricket while writing) are chief culprits.

Other than that, Window Server (13%), kernel-task (9%) then 15 or so under 5%. Can out up a picture if helpful.

how do I find the temperature? Looked on Google but couldn't get a good answer.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:19 pm
by desmond
kinglouis wrote:According to the Activity Monitor, Logic Pro (43%) and Now tv (70%, watching cricket while writing) are chief culprits.

Well yes, if you're working the processor, then the fans are going to spin up. These laptops just don't have enough cooling.

kinglouis wrote:how do I find the temperature? Looked on Google but couldn't get a good answer.

I prefer iStatMenus for this stuff:
https://bjango.com/mac/istatmenus/

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:53 pm
by kinglouis
I've downloaded iStatMenus, really helpful thank you. the temperatures all seem to be pretty reasonable so I guess it is, as you say, just running a thin computer hard.

Bummer though - I had no idea that was the trade-off for an incredibly expensive fast new laptop. My 2012 map was infinitely more stable and quiet, even if it was a touch thicker! I guess I'll look for a cooling matt of some description to sit it on as I can't keep up like this - mixing and recording is getting tricky.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 5:12 pm
by desmond
The super thin laptops are great for the executive who wants to bat out emails and view their spreadsheets on the go, and look good while doing it.

However, they are poor when you want to use them for more demanding tasks, as it seems you're finding out. The new i9 in particular - people were amazed Apple were shoving those into the existing super-thin enclosures.

Hopefully the next generation of laptops, which look to have had some input from Apple's newly formed Pro team, will go someway to improving in this area - thicker, more ports, better cooling etc. I love the laptop form factor, but the fans will ramp up whenever you're doing something remotely CPU intensive (like playing soft synths etc) and it's not that fun anymore...

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2019 5:27 pm
by kinglouis
I loved my tower. Never missed a beat - but it wasn't good for taking to production companies when they want you to work in situ, or taking on holiday for emergency briefs!

What is frustrating is the 2012 mbp I replaced the tower with had everything! Ports, quietness, enough oomph to power 50+ VIs or run a decent sized live recording session. Spend tons more money in 2018... I get a piece of art that sounds like its trying to launch out of the studio, not one port I can use without having to buy an adaptor for, and comparable reliability to my Land Rover.

I'm sure by the time I've paid off this one, Apple will have hammered a piece of graphene to a micron thick, stuck a Touch Bar on it and I'll be happy to remortgage the house to buy it.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2019 2:12 am
by G-Doubleyou
There are stand with fans to help cool your machine.

When my MBP was my primary machine I used a stand that allowed airflow around the laptop.

I ran in clamshell mode with external monitor keyboard, and Magic Trackpad.

moved behind my desk with a small fan on when the internal fans would fire up.

:(

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:49 pm
by torinkrell
Your 2018 MBP will also limit its processing ability when it starts to run hot. It will be able to utilize its significant processing ability and remain relatively quiet as long as it remains cool. Only running the DAW and plugins you need and turning all other processes off will help you realize the full power of your i9 processor by reducing its cooling requirements. The consistent load of extra processes can produce a lot of heat. Perhaps you can run your older laptop along with this one for Now tv and other extra processes while you are writing and recording with a DAW on your 2018 MBP.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2019 6:36 pm
by Eddy Deegan
kinglouis wrote: I guess I'll look for a cooling matt of some description to sit it on as I can't keep up like this - mixing and recording is getting tricky.

Depending on your acoustic reqiurements, an Akasa classic cooler may work well for you. I have both 15" and a 17" versions as I work using laptops all day every day and frequently stress the CPU for long periods of time while doing it.

There is a range of various coolers they do.

They are made of aluminium and have fans that constantly blow cool air onto the base of the laptop. They are not silent, but they are very quiet - certainly a lot quieter than when the internal laptop fans kick off. You can power them from a USB and they provide a passthrough USB at the back so you don't lose use of a USB socket.

Mine have been running semi-permanently for several years now and are still working fine. The top of my laptop can still get quite hot if I'm doing something intense using the graphics card (I like to shoot zombies now and again to relax) but I've never had a crash from overheating and I hate to think how hot it would get if they weren't there underneath!

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:20 am
by Janneman
Hi there, ask this company what is can be.

https://rossmanngroup.com/macbook-repair-nyc/

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2019 4:51 pm
by Rich Hanson
I used to have a cheap laptop that would get very hot under load - I used to sit it on top of those freezer packs you use to keep things cool on a picnic :bouncy:

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Sun Jul 07, 2019 11:56 pm
by Panas1
kinglouis wrote:According to the Activity Monitor, Logic Pro (43%) and Now tv (70%, watching cricket while writing) are chief culprits.
.

Have you tried not running Now TV ? :)

Apple's laptops aren't really "pro" machines anymore. The Mac Mini (at least the ones a few years back) is perfect- many I/O ports and the fan just makes a faint woosh like white noise if it runs at all.

Otherwise, try a cooling stand with the biggest fan and adjustable speed.

I used to have the MBPro running an external monitor in clamshell mode and I'd stand it vertically on the desk between two bookshelf ends, with the vent port facing upward, thinking this is the most efficient way for heat to escape... The cooling stand is a better solution probably.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 12:33 am
by Eddy Deegan
Panas1 wrote:
kinglouis wrote:According to the Activity Monitor, Logic Pro (43%) and Now tv (70%, watching cricket while writing) are chief culprits.
.

Have you tried not running Now TV ? :)

This is a good point. There is no way that watching any streaming service should put a 70% load on the CPU. That's way over normal. You could try a different browser (if it's a browser you're watching it in). If it's a native app then there is something very wrong with that picture.

The figures cited are a little ambiguous. If running Logic Pro you get 43% CPU usage, that's quite understandable if playing a number of tracks while running plugins on them etc.

Is the Now TV 70% on its own, or in combination with something else? If on it's own, then that's definitely not right. What makes that 70% figure up in other words... Now TV on its own or the total system load while watching it (in case what other processes are contributing to that)?

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 4:51 pm
by Panas1
My experience with using a MBP daily is that streaming video through a browser almost always gets the fans going.. to the point where it is unsuitable for watching a quiet film unless you crank the volume up to cover the fan noise.... There's something wrong there and it's high time the consumer base realised they're being taken for a ride with these ovepriced, badly designed for power users, and underpowered machines.
I thnk their power management system is problematic - possibly their batteries too. It may also be that Apple deliberately sabotage 3-rd party browser performance so as to encourage users to go back to Safari and/or Apple TV...

But seriously now, if you use a computer for music production you need to be offline and you need to quit any non-essential apps so that they don't hog RAM and CPU resources.

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:00 pm
by desmond
Panas1 wrote:My experience with using a MBP daily is that streaming video through a browser almost always gets the fans going.. to the point where it is unsuitable for watching a quiet film unless you crank the volume up to cover the fan noise....

Not here, even with Silverlight (Netflix) - and I have a notoriously problemmatic machine for heat issues.

Panas1 wrote:It may also be that Apple deliberately sabotage 3-rd party browser performance so as to encourage users to go back to Safari and/or Apple TV...

:roll:

Panas1 wrote:But seriously now, if you use a computer for music production you need to be offline and you need to quit any non-essential apps so that they don't hog RAM and CPU resources.

Not my experience at all, with my 2011 MBP (or the one I had before that). In fact I haven't *ever* kept my DAW machine offline, even in the 90s...

The real issue as I see it for recent machines is that they just don't seem to be designed for continual hefty processing, and they are too thin and don't have adequate cooling. Fine for business use, but I'd like a real Macbook Pro to be a little more substantial than they have been over the last few years, rather than focusing on being as "thin, light, and true to the simplistic essence" and removing ports...

Re: Fan going like the clappers

PostPosted: Mon Jul 08, 2019 5:19 pm
by Panas1
If you send out MIDI clock from the DAW and you have any network related process running (wi-fi or Bluetooth) , the MIDI clock accuracy will likely be compromised and you'll get increased jitter. This is because of how modern OSs prioritise network over USB MIDI traffic. Browsers are pretty resource-hungry and IMO you should not be asking for help if you're running a browser or video streaming apps alongside your DAW- unless you have tested the issue without them. I don't have the technical info to back these statements but it makes a noticeable difference in my system.