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New Macs

Postby desmond » Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:38 pm

All I can say is... Apple are going to sell a metric shedload of Macs over the coming year... :shocked:
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Re: New Macs

Postby Agharta » Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:46 pm

Wow. They’ve really knocked it out of the park. Amazing.
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Re: New Macs

Postby nickle15 » Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:53 pm

I've been running on a Late 2012 Mac mini since February of 2013. It's been a beast the whole time but now that I'm really getting into recording on the computer I'm starting to bump up against the limits of what I can get out of it, despite upgrading to SSD and 16GB of RAM (the most that machine will take). I had given up on buying any Apple products even though I enjoy the connected experience with my phone, because they were just so expensive. That may not have changed much but it sure looks like there's a possibility to get a lot more bang for the buck with some of this new technology. Interesting develoment.
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Re: New Macs

Postby Sam Spoons » Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:57 pm

desmond wrote:All I can say is... Apple are going to sell a metric shedload of Macs over the coming year... :shocked:

Sadly not to me... :cry:
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Re: New Macs

Postby desmond » Tue Nov 10, 2020 7:59 pm

I expected them to *not* use the same chips in the iPad - chips based on the same tech for sure, but uniquely optimised for the Mac, not just sticking the A14X in them.

I expected them to be called "M"-something, not "A"-something, and to be differentiated from the iPhone/iPad chips (so, likely not "M14" to line them up alongside the A chips performance wise)

I expected the first Macs to transition would be the lower end / smaller laptops, and I expected there to be at least one fanless laptop, likely the Air.

I didn't expect the Mac Mini to be there at the beginning but that makes perfect sense and is a great small computer for multiple uses.

They might have Osborne'd themselves on the (future) Macbook Pro though... who's gonna buy an Intel one now unless they desperately need one now...? :headbang:
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Re: New Macs

Postby Kwackman » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:09 pm

desmond wrote:I didn't expect the Mac Mini to be there at the beginning but that makes perfect sense and is a great small computer for multiple uses.

The mini looks like a nice choice, although it seems the max RAM you can order is 16GB, the intels can be configured for 64GB.
Not sure how big an issue that is and it's possible I've misunderstood!
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Re: New Macs

Postby desmond » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:15 pm

Yeah that's strange - it's also listed as "Unified memory" meaning it's somehow different from regular ram...
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Re: New Macs

Postby Agharta » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:24 pm

desmond wrote:Yeah that's strange - it's also listed as "Unified memory" meaning it's somehow different from regular ram...
The RAM is on the M1 Chip which is why there's so little.
Gaming consoles have been using Unified memory for years but they use GDDR which are separate chips.
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Re: New Macs

Postby Humble Bee » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:31 pm

Sweet!

It will be interesting to see what kind of performance vs the Intels...
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Re: New Macs

Postby desmond » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:33 pm

Agharta wrote:The RAM is on the M1 Chip which is why there's so little.

Thanks - yes, I'd seen the slides but thought the unified memory they were talking about was some kind of on-chip caching, not *all* the memory.

I'd imagine the still-to-come "Pro" versions will be able to support more memory, they can't release a 16 MBP or iMac that only supports max 16GB...
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Re: New Macs

Postby w oxo cube » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:40 pm

It still appears that you need to spend 70 quid to be able to plug a USB stick into it.
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Re: New Macs

Postby Luke W » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:40 pm

Kwackman wrote:
desmond wrote:I didn't expect the Mac Mini to be there at the beginning but that makes perfect sense and is a great small computer for multiple uses.

The mini looks like a nice choice, although it seems the max RAM you can order is 16GB, the intels can be configured for 64GB.
Not sure how big an issue that is and it's possible I've misunderstood!

I've just had a look and spotted that. I've been considering buying a Mini recently but thought I'd hold off for a while and see if the new CPUs found their way over to it, I wasn't expecting them at the same time as the Macbooks either. Part of my thinking was that the RAM limit may increase so was quite surprised to see it that much lower.

Agharta wrote:The RAM is on the M1 Chip which is why there's so little.
Gaming consoles have been using Unified memory for years but they use GDDR which are separate chips.

Edit - And that explains it then!
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Re: New Macs

Postby Agharta » Tue Nov 10, 2020 8:48 pm

Ironically, the most significant improvement here may well be the memory architecture which is completely separate from the move to ARM.
With the RAM being on the same package as the cores, the improved latency and bandwidth may be very dramatic.
This seemingly explains the performance gains being claimed for a chip with so few performance cores.
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Re: New Macs

Postby Arpangel » Tue Nov 10, 2020 9:35 pm

Sam Spoons wrote:
desmond wrote:All I can say is... Apple are going to sell a metric shedload of Macs over the coming year... :shocked:

Sadly not to me... :cry:

And sadly, not to me either.
Even a simple thing like auditioning multiple audio/sample files in Windows isn’t possible on a Mac, Photos keeps crashing, and the price you pay for the "Mac Experience" doesn’t last long before it’s not supported, plus, Macs aren’t infallible, mine is a 2014 27 inch i Mac top spec, and it’s needed a total nuke twice since I’ve owned it.
All in all, I’d never waste my money on a Mac again, they are good in some respects, but the hardware is massively over priced, and the whole philosophy is a bit of a con.
This isn’t a Mac v PC rant, as I don’t like computers in general, but honestly, if it’s the worst of two evils I’m sticking with PC.
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Re: New Macs

Postby desmond » Tue Nov 10, 2020 9:56 pm

Arpangel wrote:Even a simple thing like auditioning multiple audio/sample files in Windows isn’t possible on a Mac

What? What "isn't possible on a Mac", exactly?

Arpangel wrote:Photos keeps crashing

Can't really help you there.

Arpangel wrote:the price you pay for the "Mac Experience" doesn’t last long before it’s not supported

I'm still using my 2011 MBP...

Arpangel wrote:plus, Macs aren’t infallible

Of course not. Nothing is. If you bought a Mac because you thought you were paying for infallibility, then that's on you I'm afraid.

Arpangel wrote:mine is a 2014 27 inch i Mac top spec, and it’s needed a total nuke twice since I’ve owned it.

I've not needed to totally nuke a Mac since I've owned a Mac, in the mid 2000s. But of course, it's not just the car, it's the driver, and the way it's driven, and where you drive it, that factors in and makes it difficult to make comparisons.

Arpangel wrote:All in all, I’d never waste my money on a Mac again, they are good in some respects, but the hardware is massively over priced, and the whole philosophy is a bit of a con.

Um, well I don't buy a computer for "philisophical" reasons, I buy based on the experience, what it lets me do, and how it lets me do it. I don't know what your expectations were - perhaps you bought a little too hard into Apple's "it's all magic" marketing. It's not magic, it's a computer. I'm not sure where the "con" is.

Arpangel wrote:if it’s the worst of two evils I’m sticking with PC.

To be honest, if going back to the PC is a valid option for you, you're not really a Mac person, and probably either don't appreciate what makes MacOS good, or haven't spent enough time to unlearn your former PC habits - or just don't care that much about the computer experience (this is not a slight, btw - some people genuinely don't care about the computer as long as it works, and runs whatever applications they need to use - and that's fine too). In general though, Mac *is* a platform for people who care about this stuff.

I hated Windows (and Windows software in general) for all the years I had to use it, and it took a little time to transition to Mac and unlearn those PC things, and learn the Mac way of doing things, where they were, and the Mac software/developer aesthetic. The thought of going back to Windows (for me) is not a pleasant one - although it's vastly better than it used to be.

But hey, vive la difference, and all that! ;)
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