You are here

Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

For anything relating to music-making on Windows computers, with lots of FAQs. Moderated by Martin Walker.

Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:15 am

I am getting no love out there in tech support land... perhaps the imminently more helpful souls here in the SOS forum have some sage advice for me... (the UAD support forum is kind of sad)

This maddening little problem crept into my DAW world sometime in the last year or so. My set up was fully functional and stable.. even on Vista 64 back in UAD version 5.3 land and then at some point not. I wish I knew at what point things went sideways... (i have a suspicion... more on that in a bit) but I was running very light mixes for a while and didn't notice at what point the UAD-1s stopped being usable.

Currently, as soon as I enable/install my UAD-2 Solo my 3 UAD-1 cards stop working. They show up fine in the meter and in windows... but no plugs will run on them. It seems like it might be authorization problems... The error messages in Reaper seem to suggest this... but it could just be where the error catch shows up...

I tried the full re-install of drivers/cards from the Windows UAD FAQ to no avail.... I had the 3 UAD-1s working in a mix.... and then added the UAD-2. All the plugs in the mix jumped to the UAD-2 card and the UAD-1s quit. I had been using the meter to force most older plugs to the UAD-1s and keep the UAD-2 free for things like the EMT250 etc etc but now I just get a total fail on the UAD-1 cards.

I am running Windows 7 64 SP1 Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 running 8GB of low latency RAM at 1066MHz front side bus on an Intel DP35DP mother board. My DAW is Reaper 32bit. The latest UAD 5.8 software downloaded yesterday.

So... After a very unsatisfactory conversation with UA support it occurred to me I have always had troubles with my plug-in activations... I have ALWAYS had to get UA support to reset my demos; And then something changed. The problem with demos went away. In hind sight I think that is when my setup may have broke. I am not sure; my spyder sense is tingling. Not much has changed on my end... my DAW is pretty stable and doesn't change much. Basically... i don't want to waste a ton of time going down a zillion rat holes... particularly if other folks have any ideas. UA was really blunt about saying P*O. *sigh*. No love. No hints. I begged them... maybe they will respond with a hint. I was looking at a Quad card... but how long before THAT becomes a boat anchor? If there are no other ideas I will abandon the 3 UAD-1 cards... but that really smarts in the pocket book. Anyway... anyone?

Thanks guys.
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby desmond » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:30 am

UA support told you to piss off? I find that hard to believe.

Unless you've perhaps got some really odd hardware/motherboard issue. PC's are such a crapshoot in this regard - I've had PC's where something that should be faultless just gave no end of problems, until I got a new motherboard, and boom the issue was instantly fixed.

Now I'm Mac, this kind of hardware issues don't really happen anymore, thankfully.

You've done all the usually PCI swapping dancing? Tried a variety of drive versions? Told the control panel which plugins to run on which card type? etc..

UA forums are not crap either just because no-one has your exact issue. Sometimes it really is just you with these kinds of hardware issues, unfortunately...
User avatar
desmond
Jedi Poster
Posts: 9921
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 1:00 am
mu:zines | music magazine archive | difficultAudio

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:52 am

desmond wrote:UA support told you to piss off? I find that hard to believe.

Of course not. They were very polite. But it was just a stock copy and paste answer... "we don't support that". They changed something in the software... I am a programmer and a support guy. I know a brush off when I get one. And actually I meant something far ruder... but not for this forum.

desmond wrote:
Unless you've perhaps got some really odd hardware/motherboard issue. PC's are such a crapshoot in this regard - I've had PC's where something that should be faultless just gave no end of problems, until I got a new motherboard, and boom the issue was instantly fixed.

This EXACT hardware config was famously stable. It DID work... all 4 cards. I have mixes I can't run now that obviously were fine before.

desmond wrote:
Now I'm Mac, this kind of hardware issues don't really happen anymore, thankfully.

You'll get yours mate. :-) I used to use Mac; been happier with Windows. Enough said on that subject.

desmond wrote:
You've done all the usually PCI swapping dancing? Tried a variety of
drive versions? Told the control panel which plugins to run on which card type? etc..

Some. That would be the rat holes. Again; This config was fully functional not so long ago. I am looking for experience and advice beyound my own with UA and the various versions of their drivers. Some one out there knows what has happened... I need to find them. It seems a pretty obvious incompatibility problem has crept in to my mix.

The real question: It is solvable? Or do I just have to spend money?

UA in not so many words is saying 'your stuff is old and we don't support it. spend money.'

desmond wrote:
UA forums are not crap either just because no-one has your exact issue. Sometimes it really is just you with these kinds of hardware issues, unfortunately...

Actually they are crap. Just look at the dates on the posts... obviously no one pays much attention and there doesn't seem to be a lot of real answers there. Just official speak. No real substance. But I don't want to fight that fight... so lets not go there too much. Not all forums are a success. Other forums are more helpful... however if I get an answer on there I will happily eat my words.
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Combo » Tue Apr 12, 2011 2:39 am

Jadoube wrote:They were very polite. But it was just a stock copy and paste answer... "we don't support that". They changed something in the software... I am a programmer and a support guy. I know a brush off when I get one. And actually I meant something far ruder... but not for this forum.
But that is the answer you are gonna get from any software house when you ask for support for a product that is no longer supported. UAD has decided that it is no longer worth their time to test the UAD 1 cards on all the many configurations of computer that are out there. Your options are basically the rat-holes or the rubbish bin.

If its any consolation, the UAD 1 had a long run as computer parts go. Its quite likely that the UAD format has still got plenty of life left in it, as well.If you don't think its worth the gamble, there are plenty of very fine native plugins out there that can do the job. Most of them are much cheaper than UAD ones, or even free.

This EXACT hardware config was famously stable. It DID work... all 4 cards. I have mixes I can't run now that obviously were fine before.

desmond wrote:
Now I'm Mac, this kind of hardware issues don't really happen anymore, thankfully.

You'll get yours mate. :-) I used to use Mac; been happier with Windows. Enough said on that subject.

desmond wrote:
You've done all the usually PCI swapping dancing? Tried a variety of
drive versions? Told the control panel which plugins to run on which card type? etc..

Some. That would be the rat holes. Again; This config was fully functional not so long ago. I am looking for experience and advice beyound my own with UA and the various versions of their drivers. Some one out there knows what has happened... I need to find them. It seems a pretty obvious incompatibility problem has crept in to my mix.

The real question: It is solvable? Or do I just have to spend money?

UA in not so many words is saying 'your stuff is old and we don't support it. spend money.'

desmond wrote:
UA forums are not crap either just because no-one has your exact issue. Sometimes it really is just you with these kinds of hardware issues, unfortunately...

Actually they are crap. Just look at the dates on the posts... obviously no one pays much attention and there doesn't seem to be a lot of real answers there. Just official speak. No real substance. But I don't want to fight that fight... so lets not go there too much. Not all forums are a success. Other forums are more helpful... however if I get an answer on there I will happily eat my words. [/quote]
User avatar
Combo
Frequent Poster
Posts: 805
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2002 12:00 am
Not an expert.

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:27 am

britney wrote:
But that is the answer you are gonna get from any software house when you ask for support for a product that is no longer supported. UAD has decided that it is no longer worth their time to test the UAD 1 cards on all the many configurations of computer that are out there. Your options are basically the rat-holes or the rubbish bin.

If its any consolation, the UAD 1 had a long run as computer parts go. Its quite likely that the UAD format has still got plenty of life left in it, as well.If you don't think its worth the gamble, there are plenty of very fine native plugins out there that can do the job. Most of them are much cheaper than UAD ones, or even free.

Well. Upon reflection... UA has never supported Reaper. So that could be the problem right there. Maybe Reaper broke it.

Basically I am bent out of shape because I want to work on music and instead I am doing frickin computer tech support... which is what I do all day in the day gig. I am pretty careful with my DAW to avoid this exact problem but obviously I missed something breaking. And I am disappointed with UA support. They didn't give me any clues at all. Nothing. I know someone over there can do better. I didn't get any notes about my stuff being "unsupported" when I entered my credit card when I want the latest plugin they model :-) It sure looks supported to me on their site. So it's a huge frustration. It's maddening. I love the sound of the plugs and so far as I can see I disagree with you that any native plugs that can do as good a job... but that's just me. I would be ok with it if I just knew what broke. Software mixing is completely stupid that way. Rat holes. Re-install Vista? Downgrade Reaper? Downgrade UA drivers and lose my newest plugins? Aieeee!

But none of any of this really matters... I was simply hoping my problem might resonate with some experienced users on this or any other forums so I can get back to music. I apologize for the bitter overtones... but we have all been there! DAMN COMPUTERS! I have also had the same problems with a loose Neve console strip and a Studer motor that won't come up to speed correctly and a Rickenbacker that won't hold intonation etc etc etc. It's the part of recording I really really hate some days. Today is one of those days.
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Stan » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:57 am

Found this on Gearslutz
UAsupport wrote: (Hi Everybody!)...

From the driver side of things the UAD-1 and UAD-2 cards will run just fine together. This being said the one variable is your expansion chassis. We do not have any official test data on UAD-1 in an expansion chassis running alongside a UAD2 card in the host system... The tests we have done would relate to UAD-1 and UAD-2 cards installed directly in the host computer. The chassis could effect the performance (depends on the chassis being used).

One last thing to consider... You could sell the chassis and the UAD-1 cards and get yourself a UAD-2 Quad card. This would be very close to an even trade and at the end of the day the Quad = 10x UAD1 cards so you would have more than three times the dsp capacity by replacing the chassis/ 3x UAD-1 cards with a single UAD-2 Quad card.

If you have any other questions on this please give me a call and we can talk about it further!

Universal Audio Customer Support
Monday through Friday, 9am to 5pm PST

Telephone Support
USA: 877-MY-UAUDIO [877-698-2834]
International: +1-831-440-1176

General Inquiries: info@uaudio.com

Regards,

Dan Becker

Customer Service
Universal Audio
Universal Audio | Analog and Digital Audio Products and Plug-Ins
User avatar
Stan
Regular
Posts: 483
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 1:00 am

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Billum » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:34 pm

This does resonate with me in fact - just last night I noticed exacty the same phenomenon, and I'm using Cubase which is definitely a UAD supported platform. Most plugins (with Cambridge EQ being the notable exception) object strongly to being run on the UAD1 cards and, despite having the option to run on the UAD1, will only initialise themselves on the UAD2 card, which meant that my big-hitters like EMT140, Fatso, Maximiser wouldn't fit on it! Extremely frustrating, as I had loads of spare capacity on my two UAD1s and a busy project to mix!

I started to download v5.7 of the software to check if it had just been introduced with v5.8 (I suspect it had), but as the downlink was slow (and I was using the G-series buss compressor) I started to render/freeze tracks instead.

Let's see if it's put right in v5.9 which I think is due out soon. It could just be a bug in the card-switching logic.
Billum
Regular
Posts: 287
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 12:00 am
Location: London
 

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:21 pm

Billum wrote:This does resonate with me in fact - just last night I noticed exacty the same phenomenon, and I'm using Cubase which is definitely a UAD supported platform.

Thank the software Gods for that Billum :-). Well... ok "curse them!"... but I glad it's not just me. I was thinking last night I should install my Cubase dongle and see if it's Reaper that is the problem... but it appears to be the UA drivers. Today I'll downgrade to 5.7 and report back if that helped. Cheers!
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Billum » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:32 pm

Yes, I'll be interested to see if that works too...
Billum
Regular
Posts: 287
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 12:00 am
Location: London
 

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 12, 2011 5:18 pm

Stan wrote:Found this on Gearslutz
UAsupport wrote: (Hi Everybody!)...

From the driver side of things the UAD-1 and UAD-2 cards will run just fine together. This being said the one variable is your expansion chassis. We do not have any official test data on UAD-1 in an expansion chassis running alongside a UAD2 card in the host system... The tests we have done would relate to UAD-1 and UAD-2 cards installed directly in the host computer. The chassis could effect the performance (depends on the chassis being used).

One last thing to consider... You could sell the chassis and the UAD-1 cards and get yourself a UAD-2 Quad card. This would be very close to an even trade and at the end of the day the Quad = 10x UAD1 cards so you would have more than three times the dsp capacity by replacing the chassis/ 3x UAD-1 cards with a single UAD-2 Quad card.

If you have any other questions on this please give me a call and we can talk about it further!

Universal Audio Customer Support
Monday through Friday, 9am to 5pm PST

Telephone Support
USA: 877-MY-UAUDIO [877-698-2834]
International: +1-831-440-1176

General Inquiries: info@uaudio.com

Regards,

Dan Becker

Customer Service
Universal Audio
Universal Audio | Analog and Digital Audio Products and Plug-Ins

Hey Thanks Stan. This post refers to an expansion chassis... which most users probably don't have. And I am thinking it might be from quite a few years back.

Once I get over this hurdle I will seriously look at replacing my 3 UAD-1s and 1 UAD-2 Solo with something bigger. They have a good deal where you can buy a Vintage UA channel strip and get a free Quad card. If I can figure out how to finesse the accounting I may just do that. I just wish that UA were a bit more forth coming about whats NOT working... but in litigation crazy California... no one will ever publicly own up unless they have to. It's not worth the risk. IMO.
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Mixedup » Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:16 pm

I'm happily running 4xUAD1 in a 7-slot 32-bit Magma expansion chassis, alongside a UAD2 Quad plugged directly into the motherboard without any problems.

I find it funny that anyone could think that 3 or 4 UAD1s + an expansion chassis could fetch anything like as much cash as you could get a UAD2 Quad for, though! What would that lot fetch, maybe £600 without the plug-ins you'd want on your Quad? The Quad's definitely worth it though...
User avatar
Mixedup
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4411
Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Cambridgeshire, UK

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Billum » Wed Apr 13, 2011 8:25 pm

Hi Mixedup, that's interesting - are you on Windows or Mac? And running UAD v5.8? And your plugs, like the Neve EQs and Moog filter, are happy to run on your UAD1s?

(Hey, I could be the next Parky! I'll start by working on a groovy yet retro post-jazz theme tune...)
Billum
Regular
Posts: 287
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 12:00 am
Location: London
 

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 26, 2011 3:49 pm

So... to conclude... I await the arrival of my UAD-2 Quad card sometime today. :-) I'll keep one of my UAD-1's for "nigel" and sell all the rest on eBay.
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Billum » Tue Apr 26, 2011 4:00 pm

Nice option - not one I can afford at the moment, so I'm still hoping there's some resolution of this prob in v5.9...
Billum
Regular
Posts: 287
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 12:00 am
Location: London
 

Re: Installing a UAD-2 causes my UAD-1s to stop working.

Postby Jadoube » Tue Apr 26, 2011 4:53 pm

no doubt. wasn't my first choice that's for sure... but I just can't afford the downtime to sort out what might be un-sortable. computers are great until they break! then they suck your soul dry...

I was reading an interview with Jack White... he doesn't allow them in his studio. Or cell phones. I think he is on to something there... :-) Now I just need that 2" 8 track...
User avatar
Jadoube
Regular
Posts: 370
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Calgary, Canada
_________
David

Next