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A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby ramthelinefeed » Tue Nov 05, 2019 12:53 pm

Yeah I have used Max before (the IRCAM flavour in the 1990s, not Cycling 74's commercial version).

Honestly though, all I wanna do is have a Windows app where I can plonk some simple widgets on the screen (sliders, buttons, etc) and map them to various MIDI messages, to actual as a programmer for various old bits of gear.
The thing is that some of my more vintage pieces of gear need this to include SysEx (so when you move the slider, it just changes the data bytes in the SysEx string) ... my Elektron SID Station is the main offender :)
But most of these cheap and simple Windows programs only work with 'continuous controller' messages.

But if I gotta fork out for Max I probably will, I guess.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby Eddy Deegan » Tue Nov 05, 2019 1:52 pm

ramthelinefeed wrote:Honestly though, all I wanna do is have a Windows app where I can plonk some simple widgets on the screen (sliders, buttons, etc) and map them to various MIDI messages, to actual as a programmer for various old bits of gear.
The thing is that some of my more vintage pieces of gear need this to include SysEx (so when you move the slider, it just changes the data bytes in the SysEx string) ... my Elektron SID Station is the main offender :)
But most of these cheap and simple Windows programs only work with 'continuous controller' messages.

But if I gotta fork out for Max I probably will, I guess.

I'd say this is exactly the sort of thing that Max excels at. Not only do you get to design your own interface the way you want it, but you can also get very creative with the MIDI side of things if you're prepared to dive into a little bit of Javascript.

A number of years ago I created an editor suite for the Yamaha XS8 (sadly, never finished due to Max limitations) which relied heavily on Sysex and part of that involved reading and writing bytes directly to/from the MIDI interface in Max using a Javascript widget. It was a lot of fun and very educational as well.

Cycling74 offer a 30-day free evaluation of Max, so that might well be worth a bit of exploration!
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby ramthelinefeed » Tue Nov 05, 2019 1:58 pm

Oh yes, I know Max could definitely do this. It just can do about a thousand other things too, which I'm wary of getting distracted by :) :crazy:
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby n o i s e f l e ur » Tue Nov 05, 2019 2:04 pm

Eddy Deegan wrote:
Maybe you tried the Editor for the Android or IOS device version? I don't think that would work standalone either. The Editor (host) + Device (phoneor tablet) package is a paid app, but trivial compared to the 4-figure sum that the Lemur hardware sold at. Unless something radical has changed since I last looked, you can do all manner of creative and useful things if you have a MIDI interface for your device. I had the IOS version for a while before departing the Apple camp for unrelated reasons.

When I was an active user of it using the Lemur hardware I was always a little frustrated at the seeming lack of willingness on the part of Jazzmutant to address issues of usability and feature set but from the look of the latest versions it's come a long way.

It's a powerful and flexible platform and good stuff, basically.

Yep Eddy, the Windows editor. I was aiming for exercise-in-futility - not demonstration-of-insanity!

The Lemur app has definitely improved over the original hardware in terms of functionality, but the editor software is still a bloody useability nightmare where, if you're not intimately aware of its foibles . . . much lost work awaits.

There's also the many undocumented behaviours of the runtime to contend with.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby n o i s e f l e ur » Tue Nov 05, 2019 2:05 pm

There's always ctrlr;

https://ctrlr.org/

^ To handle the SYSEX, mappable to any touch interface.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby Agharta » Tue Nov 05, 2019 8:35 pm

Do a search for yMIDI on the Windows store.
They have 3 apps which overlap to a large degree seemingly but all come with trials and are under £5.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby n o i s e f l e ur » Tue Nov 05, 2019 9:28 pm

More massive overkill - Usine Hollyhock 4.

https://brainmodular.com/

Pros: Looks like it'll do what's requested and then some!

Cons: Expensive!
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby ramthelinefeed » Wed Nov 06, 2019 3:13 pm

n o i s e f l e ur wrote:There's always ctrlr;

https://ctrlr.org/

^ To handle the SYSEX, mappable to any touch interface.

Oh, that looks EXACTLY like the sort of thing I had in mind.
I don't think it existed last time I was looking.

Thanks very much for the tip! :)
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby Agharta » Wed Nov 06, 2019 3:50 pm

ramthelinefeed wrote:
n o i s e f l e ur wrote:There's always ctrlr;

https://ctrlr.org/

^ To handle the SYSEX, mappable to any touch interface.

Oh, that looks EXACTLY like the sort of thing I had in mind.
I don't think it existed last time I was looking.

Thanks very much for the tip! :)

I looked at it briefly but wasn't sure if it's designed for touch and especially multi-touch.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby n o i s e f l e ur » Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:36 pm

ramthelinefeed wrote:
n o i s e f l e ur wrote:There's always ctrlr;

https://ctrlr.org/

^ To handle the SYSEX, mappable to any touch interface.

Oh, that looks EXACTLY like the sort of thing I had in mind.
I don't think it existed last time I was looking.

Thanks very much for the tip! :)

No problem, glad to help.

As mentioned by Agharta, it may not be multitouch-capable, but for what you've said it's for it should suffice. Oddly, I didn't even consider it as a touch interface in itself but it ought to at least respond to single-touch and for simple sysex editing of parameters that's basically all you're going to need I'd imagine. It's not like hardware MIDI is designed to accomodate vast volumes of realtime sysex anyway.

I should really fire it up on the old touchscreen laptop here and test it for touch just for laughs! Will mean re-enabling the touchscreen but that's no biggie.

Another benefit to this over something like Lemur is it uses an actual scripting language (LUA), so any time spent learning that might have wider application - versus whatever application-specific abomination Lemur interprets.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby Martin Walker » Wed Nov 06, 2019 6:03 pm

I've used a Ctrlr editor for some years now with my steampunk Shruthi synth, and it's wonderful.

ShruthiCtrlr.jpg


However, my experience also is that when working with existing editor templates, the version of Ctrlr you use can be crucial - in fact, so many people had problems trying to get the Shruthi editor to work with more recent builds that I've ended up hosting the particular elderly version it needs on my web site so that other Shruthi owners can download it :headbang:


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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby n o i s e f l e ur » Wed Nov 06, 2019 7:03 pm

Yeah, that's a very good point Martin. I was lucky in that the panel I was most interested in seems to work fine with the current version.

Generally speaking I think it pertains more to the GUI scripting side of the app, so any existing panel that doesn't work can always be cannibalised for sysex formatting at any rate, and applied to a new panel of your own devising.
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Re: A Windows-equivalent for Hexler's TouchOSC

Postby ramthelinefeed » Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:25 pm

n o i s e f l e ur wrote:
As mentioned by Agharta, it may not be multitouch-capable, but for what you've said it's for it should suffice.

Yeah I doubt multi-touch capability real matters - the sort of thing I'd use this for is off-line programming/sound-design (i.e. making patches) - MIDI is a serial protocol so you can only splurge one parameter change down the MIDI cable at a time in any case, particularly when they're SysEx ones.
You're still effectively programming sounds by selecting and tweaking one parameter at a time, just with the single-parameter-access menus they have on the front panel - it's just way quicker to select the parameters and tweak them with they're all set out on a touch screen in front of you.
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