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(Sorry) Yet another PC build

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(Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Will_m » Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:20 am

Its that time again for me to put together a new computer. I think I have the spec sorted but it'd be great if someone could give it a check over.

I'll be using it for music composition, heavy track counts (150+), lots of Kontakt instances (75+) and a fair few effects as well.

CPU: AMD 3900x
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/amd-ryz ... uswraith-p

MOBO: Asrock Taichi x570
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/asrock- ... e-wifi-usb

RAM: 2 x 32GB Kits
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb-2x ... -amd-ryzen

OS Drive: Samsung Evo 970 500GB
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/500gb-s ... ite-480k-5

CPU Cooler: Be Quiet Dark Rock Pro
https://www.scan.co.uk/products/be-quie ... ipes-amd-t

PSU: EVGA 650w SuperNova G2 (already owned)

GPU: GTX1060 (already owned)

I have a few SSD's already to add in and a USB Pcie card.

My main concerns are the RAM, is this the right kit and speed for the rest of the spec? Also the motherboard has a little fan on it that seems like it might be a source of noise and a potential failure but I can't see any boards that don't have it.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Agharta » Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:15 am

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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby ef37a » Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:08 am

"Also the motherboard has a little fan on it that seems like it might be a source of noise and a potential failure but I can't see any boards that don't have it."

At this level of MOBO sophistication this PC numpty thinks the fan would be controllable?
If not you can maybe unplug it and arrange a much quieter one to blow at the relevant hot bit? I did this for a passive graphics card that got hotter than I liked.

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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Pete Kaine » Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:27 am

Agharta's correct, the LED kit won't fit under the cooler from what I recall.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb-2x ... -amd-ryzen is what I use and looks to be the same kit as the Amazon link.

The fan is controllable by the firmware Dave, in that most boards I've seen wil spin up/down as required but the end user doesn't tend to get access to it. It's pushing air over both NVMe slots and the PCH from what I've seen at least on the better boards, although that would suggest that heavy drive transfers would be as likely to spin it up as a busy bus controller.

You could remove the heatshield and mount something else, but you're also removing the heatshield for the M.2's as well, so be prepared to either try and cool the whole lot somehow (hard with limited space to work with) or see data transfer slowdown on the drives if you don't find a suitable replacement.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby ef37a » Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:48 am

PC numpty has grabbed his coat...

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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Will_m » Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:56 pm

Agharta wrote:I'd consider this RAM:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Corsair-Vengea ... 082DH1FZR/

Thanks!

ef37a wrote:At this level of MOBO sophistication this PC numpty thinks the fan would be controllable?
If not you can maybe unplug it and arrange a much quieter one to blow at the relevant hot bit? I did this for a passive graphics card that got hotter than I liked.

I think it is BIOS controllable so hopefully with enough case cooling I can keep it low or off, just slightly concerned that if I have it too low it will kill something on the board.

Pete Kaine wrote:Agharta's correct, the LED kit won't fit under the cooler from what I recall.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb-2x ... -amd-ryzen" target="phpbbpopup is what I use and looks to be the same kit as the Amazon link.

Thanks Pete, as I'm going for 64GB is there any issue with using two of those 32GB kits? I've also seen 64GB kits that are 2 x 32GB sticks and 4 x 16GB sticks. From your previous advice I know to go for the Ryzen tuned kits but the 64GB kit at 3600 is quite pricey.

Seems to be some availability issues with a few of the kits as well. I'll be buying at the end of the month so not too much of an issue.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Trevor Johnson » Thu Feb 06, 2020 1:42 pm

Also the motherboard has a little fan on it that seems like it might be a source of noise and a potential failure but I can't see any boards that don't have it.

The Gigabyte X570 Aorus Xtreme has a passively cooled chipset and no fan, but is extremely expensive at about £700 /750 ish.

And if you want a fanless MB for the Ryzen Threadripper sTRX4, you're out of luck, I think, as all the MBs that I have looked at, have an onboard fan.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Agharta » Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:45 pm

Pete Kaine wrote:Agharta's correct, the LED kit won't fit under the cooler from what I recall.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb-2x ... -amd-ryzen is what I use and looks to be the same kit as the Amazon link.
The Amazon ones are CL16 v CL18 for the Scan ones.
£30 more though so do you think it's worth it as I recall you saying hoe important low latency is for Ryzen?
3600 CL16 seems at a decent point in the price/performance curve for ~£171/32GB.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Pete Kaine » Fri Feb 07, 2020 5:46 pm

Will_m wrote:Thanks, Pete, as I'm going for 64GB is there any issue with using two of those 32GB kits? I've also seen 64GB kits that are 2 x 32GB sticks and 4 x 16GB sticks. From your previous advice I know to go for the Ryzen tuned kits but the 64GB kit at 3600 is quite pricey.

Seems to be some availability issues with a few of the kits as well. I'll be buying at the end of the month so not too much of an issue.

Well, I doubt it's going to get any better in the short term, we're being told that they are not permitting staff to return to work at the moment across most of China, so if there is anything in a components supply chain coming from there... well, expect further delays.

Two kits work fine together, no problem with that.

Agharta wrote:
Pete Kaine wrote:Agharta's correct, the LED kit won't fit under the cooler from what I recall.

https://www.scan.co.uk/products/32gb-2x ... -amd-ryzen is what I use and looks to be the same kit as the Amazon link.
The Amazon ones are CL16 v CL18 for the Scan ones.
£30 more though so do you think it's worth it as I recall you saying hoe important low latency is for Ryzen?
3600 CL16 seems at a decent point in the price/performance curve for ~£171/32GB.

It's a good price, I didn't take the CAS figures into mind when Iooked it over, I should have noted it.

Ok, so the situation is that it needs to be "good enough" to close the hole, getting it better than that isn't going to do a whole lot more. for audio, although anyone doing video can probably find gains going tighter.

The problem I had was up to 20% of the performance is lost by the CPU when the memory doesn't respond fast enough. The CPU memory data bus is 3733 having it slower is causing performance loss due to lack of optimization, but it mostly manifests when we deal with close to real-time scenarios like those tight ASIO buffers.

The solution it appears in my testing that getting the RAM under 80ns seems to close the hole. I've not noted any major gains going from 80ns to 70ns (for instance) although I guess it's not to be sniffed at in this case.

The RAM firms or at least Corsair with their AMD optimized kits are making up packs that can manage that 80ns or better figure without you having to overclock and tweak your RAM. I was taking off the shelf stuff with 120ns figures, spending a morning and getting it to maybe 75ns. The pack I linked when used with a 3900X is giving me 70ns and the 3700x is giving me 80ns, both with no tweaking other than ticking the XMP box in the BIOS.

I can probably get them lower with some tweaking but probably only marginally and as it is, it's good enough to allow for no data performance loss in testing, so I'd rather take stability at this point than push it harder or add more voltage.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Will_m » Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:52 pm

Trevor Johnson wrote:The Gigabyte X570 Aorus Xtreme has a passively cooled chipset and no fan, but is extremely expensive at about £700 /750 ish.

And if you want a fanless MB for the Ryzen Threadripper sTRX4, you're out of luck, I think, as all the MBs that I have looked at, have an onboard fan.

Ah yes thanks Trevor, I thought there might be one, its too much of a premium for me though and I wouldn't use any of the other features. Think I'll stick with the Asrock and tweak the fan speed in BIOS.

Pete Kaine wrote:Well, I doubt it's going to get any better in the short term, we're being told that they are not permitting staff to return to work at the moment across most of China, so if there is anything in a components supply chain coming from there... well, expect further delays.

Two kits work fine together, no problem with that.

Ah makes sense thanks Pete, I think I'll go with the 2 32GB kits once everything is back in stock.

Will post an update for everyone once I've put the system together.
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Re: (Sorry) Yet another PC build

Postby Will_m » Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:44 pm

Just a quick update and a few questions. I've now mostly built the new system, just need to tune the fans some more and then start installing software.

The onboard fan is ok, I have it turned down to about 1500rpm, when I'm sat a metre from it you can't hear it. The SB does sit at around 60c though. The MB runs about half that.

The 3900x CPU also runs hot compared to what I've had before, about 45-50c at idle. I used Intel burn test which it completed fine, got up to high 70's though. The fans didn't turn up much at all so I'll probably tune them higher for when its really pushed. At the moment I've just got the bog standard case fans in but will probably replace them with my Noctua ones.

I'm not really sure what I'm doing in the AMD BIOS though, there's a list of things I'd normally do on Intel boards like speedstep/halt states etc. The only thing I've done so far is enable XMP for the memory and disabled the onboard audio and wifi.

Can anyone point me in the direction of some BIOS tweaks for audio? Is there anything else I should take care of before installing my interface / DAW software?
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