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Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby DC-Choppah » Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:51 am

Only problem is the ball doesn't come all the way up to the post because the string winding at the ball end don't really fit through the hole. I wonder if this is going to stay in tune with that setup?
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby Wonks » Fri Jul 06, 2018 6:43 am

Probably not unless you can widen the hole. It's very likely to keep getting pulled through under string tension until you get to the point where it's well and truly jammed in,. At which point removing the string could be very difficult indeed.
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby Sam Spoons » Fri Jul 06, 2018 7:56 am

I have ball ended strings on the Aylward at the moment and I haven't noticed any tuning instability (I usually use loop ends).
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby DC-Choppah » Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Installed the Krivo mini based on Krivo's recommendation: https://www.krivopickups.com/store/p7/K ... ument.html

Sounds great and gets rid of the Piezo quakiness, but still sounds like an acoustic. This is cool because it doesn't really sound like a generic magnetic pickup. It does not sound like an electric guitar really. It sounds great. Very clear. Jazzy, but still has the unique woody and bright character of the Gypsy jazz guitar.

So since I now have the Krivo and the Bitgone piezo, I would like to make this more permanent and have only one wire coming out of the guitar. I don't like having the wire just hanging off the guitar.

The Bigtone is installed with the output coming out of the endpin jack where I can plug in a standard guitar cable (TS)

So I was thinking, can I have the Krivo installed so that it shares the end pin jack? I would need a TRS jack so I can have a ground signal, and the Krivo on the ring and the piezo on the tip. Sound right? Will this work? Do they even make a TRS endpin jack?
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby Wonks » Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:17 pm

Yes they make TRS endpin jacks. Look at Allparts. EP-4161-001 (nickel) or EP-4161-002 (gold) for a Switchcraft one.
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby Sam Spoons » Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:28 pm

Obviously you'll need a splitter lead too as mag's and piezo's need radically different load impedances and it's worth deciding which pickup you would use most and put that on the tip so a standard TS lead will still give your favourite pickup.

FWIW I have a Krivo I used to use on my old Gitane and my Aylward has a Bigtone. For me the Bigtone is the best, minimal or no 'quack' because to is encapsulated in the bridge, I believe 'piezo quack' (which I hate) is caused by the piezo transducer being under pressure, compressed between the saddle and bridge of most guitars. The Bigtone does not put the transducer under pressure so no quack. My Krivo, a older one, sounds quite like a Stimer so is authentic for a certain period of Django's career. The ultimate solution, I have discovered, is to use the BigTone and pass it through an 'Audio Sprockets Tone Dexter' preamp. The resulting output is as close to a miked sound as I have ever heard. Listen here :- https://www.dropbox.com/s/mfuyoxbevrghisw/Tone%20Dexter%20Preamp%20Test%202.mp3?dl=0 I recorded four tracks into Reaper, rhythm guitar mic, rhythm guitar TD, lead guitar mic and lead guitar TD. I panned the rhythm and lead mic signals to one side and the TD to the other and rendered the stereo track. i actually can't remember if the mic signal is on the left and the BigTone/Tone Dexter signal on the right or vice-versa but, if you are bothered I'll check the Reaper project and find out.
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby DC-Choppah » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:12 pm

Sam Spoons wrote:Listen here :- https://www.dropbox.com/s/mfuyoxbevrghisw/Tone%20Dexter%20Preamp%20Test%202.mp3?dl=0 I recorded four tracks into Reaper, rhythm guitar mic, rhythm guitar TD, lead guitar mic and lead guitar TD. I panned the rhythm and lead mic signals to one side and the TD to the other and rendered the stereo track. i actually can't remember if the mic signal is on the left and the BigTone/Tone Dexter signal on the right or vice-versa but, if you are bothered I'll check the Reaper project and find out.

Cool, Hot Jazz! Nice

What I hear is the right side is brighter, you can hear the strings hit the frets, and when you strum it has a deeper thunk to it. Left side sounds good, but sounds like it has gone through a bandpass filter and the highest and lowest parts are gone. I assume this means that the right side is a mic.

I actually like the sound of your left side though. Perhaps in a mix it might be preferred actually to the mic sound. It retains the sound of the instrument but gives it more of its own focused place in the mix. And also, the body resonance sound is gone. The rythm strums are cleaner, less boomy.

So you are going direct here right? No amp?
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby zenguitar » Sun Aug 05, 2018 11:36 pm

And it is worth remembering Dave's "Bunch of parts in a tin" mantra here as well.

A small project box with a stereo input jack socket and a pair of mono output sockets will allow you to use any off the shelf TRS Jack-Jack cable instead of a bespoke splitter cable. Much easier if you forget your splitter cable (or if it breaks) for you to buy/borrow a standard cable in an emergency.

And as a fall back option...

If things go wrong and you can only lay your hands on a TS Jack-Jack cable have a thought about which of the two pick-ups is the one you would use if you could only use one. And then make sure that that is the one you wire to the tip connector of the TRS socket.

Andy :beamup:
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby Sam Spoons » Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:01 am

DC-Choppah wrote:
Sam Spoons wrote:Listen here :- https://www.dropbox.com/s/mfuyoxbevrghisw/Tone%20Dexter%20Preamp%20Test%202.mp3?dl=0 I recorded four tracks into Reaper, rhythm guitar mic, rhythm guitar TD, lead guitar mic and lead guitar TD. I panned the rhythm and lead mic signals to one side and the TD to the other and rendered the stereo track. i actually can't remember if the mic signal is on the left and the BigTone/Tone Dexter signal on the right or vice-versa but, if you are bothered I'll check the Reaper project and find out.

Cool, Hot Jazz! Nice

What I hear is the right side is brighter, you can hear the strings hit the frets, and when you strum it has a deeper thunk to it. Left side sounds good, but sounds like it has gone through a bandpass filter and the highest and lowest parts are gone. I assume this means that the right side is a mic.

I actually like the sound of your left side though. Perhaps in a mix it might be preferred actually to the mic sound. It retains the sound of the instrument but gives it more of its own focused place in the mix. And also, the body resonance sound is gone. The rythm strums are cleaner, less boomy.

So you are going direct here right? No amp?

The TD is interesting as it allows you to mix the unaltered pickup signal with the processed signal, I can't remember what I did with that recording, it was a very early test of the TD I had on loan but it was good enough to have me buy one. IIRC the TD signals sounded slightly fuller than the mic. I'll try to work out which is which but I'm away from the studio for a month now so the 'Tone Dexter Project' is on hold.
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby John Egan » Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:57 pm

DC-Choppah wrote:The guitar is an Altamira M01F: http://www.altamiraguitar.com/m01f-2/?lang=en

I would like to try to add a magnetic pickup? Is this possible?

I have a Bigtone piezo bridge pickup and it is great for many tunes, but I would like to get a jazzy magnetic sound too for some tunes. Maybe try blending the two.

Looks like 3/8" height is all there is between the guitar and the strings at the bridge position.

Are there any thin pickups that would tuck in there?

I am told that the thin face of the guitar is part of its sound so I would like to see if it is possible to 'float' the pickup.

I guess I can't be too fussy, but I am looking for a warm jazzy humbucker sound with no hum.

I have been happy in the past with the DeArmond Rhythm chief and the Shadow Atilla Zoller pickups. I don't know their dimensions, but I seem to remember they were both pretty slim.
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Re: Thin magnetic pickup for Altamira F-hole guitar - Is it possible?

Postby DC-Choppah » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:25 am

The Krivo can't go all the way down at the neck position. It interferes with the strings above the 12th fret, and lower if you strum it hard.

Have to compromise and put it about halfway between the neck and bridge so it has no interference. That takes away some of the bass response but actually maybe sounds more even and less bottom heavy.

This Krivo stick-on pickup and dangly wires is not working for me. I step on the wires and rip it off. Thanks for the tips on the end pin stereo jack guys. I need to ask my tech to mount this pickup permanently somehow.

Gonna put the Krivo on the tip and the Bigtone on the ring. So a standard cable will be electric guitar mode. Thanks for that tip guys.
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