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Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby BJG145 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 6:20 pm

CS70 wrote:The difference between jazz and fusion is between falling asleep and trying to, but the goddamn noise doesn't allow you to

:clap:
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Johnsy » Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:36 am

Sam Spoons wrote::D :D :D :D

Actually you're both wrong, the difference between jazz and fusion is whether you need ear plugs or not.

Nope... 'fraid that hasn't helped distinguish between them for me. :?
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Stratman57 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:46 am

Fusion = Synthesisers and distorted guitars.

At least on the fusion albums I have, mainly from the 70's.

Regards, Simon.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby DC-Choppah » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:10 am

RIP Mr Holdsorth - The John Coltrane of the electric guitar.

Frank Gambale is keeping that fire going still.

Scales are too sequential and imply an order. Tones come in groups. Visualize them all at once, then play with them to make music at will. Harmony follows.



Love it.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Arpangel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:06 am

DC-Choppah wrote:RIP Mr Holdsorth - The John Coltrane of the electric guitar.

Love it.

Holdsworth was a great player, no doubt about that, but he leaves me cold, way too many notes and not enough "music"
Unlike John Coltrane, who used dissonance and contrast to create music that was not only original, but emotionally intense and moving. Going from works like Expression, to A Love Supreme, what a journey, through totally changing beautiful landscapes, and not a note was wasted.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby CS70 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:49 am

When I listen to Coltrane I'm always brought back to around the summer of 1982, a small TV set and an episode of "The Streets of St. Francisco". Not a bad thing, all considered. And probably it's different episodes every time.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Arpangel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:18 am

CS70 wrote:When I listen to Coltrane I'm always brought back to around the summer of 1982, a small TV set and an episode of "The Streets of St. Francisco". Not a bad thing, all considered. And probably it's different episodes every time.

I can remember the first time I heard "A Love Supreme" the opening sax notes are just pure genius, they stick in your mind like the melody from a Beatles song or something, he nails it in the first few seconds of the album, it’s beyond, just beyond.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby merlyn » Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:06 pm

Arpangel wrote:Holdsworth was a great player, no doubt about that, but he leaves me cold, way too many notes and not enough "music"

I think if you count them, you'll find Holdsworth and Coltrane played exactly the right number of notes. :D The parallel is often drawn as both their styles have been described as "sheets of sound".

In addition to having a science fiction level of ability on his instrument, Holdsworth was also a good musician and there was plenty of music. Check out the I.O.U album

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTnE0QQHxeA

This shades into prog rock. There's even singing!
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby PianoPerson » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:49 am

Check this out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gjCclNLBHY

You'd have to have a very limited concept of music to argue that that this doesn't contain enough 'music' . The theme and harmonic language are beautiful, and the guitar solo is intense and full of striking, spur-of-the-moment melodic invention. And yes, it does contain a lot of notes in places, because it has to. The interplay between guitar and drums is especially exciting during those fast flourishes.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Arpangel » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:15 am

merlyn wrote:I think if you count them, you'll find Holdsworth and Coltrane played exactly the right number of notes.

But maybe not in the right order.

:D
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby MOF » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:20 pm

I think if you count them, you'll find Holdsworth and Coltrane played exactly the right number of notes.

But maybe not in the right order.

:D
:lol:
A reference lost on the youth of today so here’s the relevant link. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uMPEUcVyJsc
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby BJG145 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 4:30 pm

Classic.

To be honest, most of Holdsworth's playing sounds like an annoying racket to me. I accept that this is my own failure. :D

I'd be interested in developing my appreciation of jazz. I got as far as Brubeck and that was it. I guess I need to listen to gradually more complex stuff; not sure where to go next. (I'm just listening to a bit of Coltrane and that sounds OK. This Holdsworth solo does nothing for me though.)
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby MOF » Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:19 pm

I'd be interested in developing my appreciation of jazz
Careful, it sounds like you’re displaying a classic symptom of being vulnerable to joining a cult. I think we need to provide an intervention, it’s for your own good, you’ll thank us later. :lol:
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby SecretSam » Thu Sep 10, 2020 7:00 pm

Start with Miles Davis' Kind of Blue, and Porgy and Bess, then some Herbie Hancock 60s stuff and Gershwin's World, then Cannonball Adderley's Accent on Africa. Round it off with Andy Sheppard's ASAP (which is a tune, not an album), then ask me again.
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Re: Allan Holdsworth explains how it works

Postby Agharta » Thu Sep 10, 2020 7:41 pm

I really enjoyed his sideman work in the 70s but went he solo I lost interest.
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