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the latest Behringer-gate

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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Arpangel » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:10 am

Rich Hanson wrote:I think I will probably sell the VC340, it feels tainted now. Maybe I'm being daft, I don't know, but that's how I feel about it.

Please don’t sell it, it’ll achieve nothing, and also, often actions can make things worse all round, let’s learn from the past and forgive and forget.
Some things are impossible to forgive, I know, and my attitude to life has changed a lot in recent years, sometimes mistakes are made, and it’s easy to add fuel to the fire, my attitude now is to shake hands and walk away.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby IAA » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:45 am

but that's how I feel about it.

..and in the final reckoning that’s what matters Rich.

I’m happy to move on, my interest in Behringer over.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Mar 03, 2020 10:59 am

Is it not ironic that those who are calling out a company for apparently bullying a critic are the same ones now bullying existing or potential customers of that company to sell, or not to buy, their products?

As usual, a lot of people are taking offence on behalf of someone else, too, without actually knowing the full story and making all kinds of assumptions about the origins and intentions of the video without any facts at all.

Was this video commissioned by Uli, or was it an underling who got carried away and made a very poor judgement call? The answer matters enormously, but does anyone actually know?

Was this a genuinely vicious and carefully planned attack on an 'innocent' independent critic... or was it misdirected humour between old and well-seasoned sparring partners with well-ground axes?

All we really know is that the video was pulled pretty quickly and Uli himself has publically apologised... which I think is significant. Everyone makes mistakes... it's how they're dealt with that matters, surely?

And before anyone has a go at me for 'condoning' this fiasco... I don't. Not in the slightest! But equally, I'm not a fan of those who jump up on any passing bandwagon mainly so they can look down on all the people around them. :geek:

H
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby IAA » Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:06 am

All we do know is that it was pulled pretty quickly and Uli himself has apologised... which I think is significant. Everyone makes mistakes... it's how they're dealt with that matters, surely?

Sure, As well as how they learn from them. Let’s see.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby The Elf » Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:10 am

:clap: :clap: :clap:
Well said, Hugh.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Chet Leeway » Tue Mar 03, 2020 11:13 am

IAA wrote:
Plus it cost them the sale of at least one Poly D
...and a 2600!
I’m going to go Korg odyssey, my brief interest in Behringer has dissolved, what a crummy thing to do. As much as anything else it’s the bullying of critics, I’m glad it was called out.

Agreed. Using the PR resources of a corporation to attack someone on a personal level ... that's pathetic.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Rich Hanson » Tue Mar 03, 2020 12:12 pm

Arpangel wrote:
Rich Hanson wrote:I think I will probably sell the VC340, it feels tainted now. Maybe I'm being daft, I don't know, but that's how I feel about it.

Please don’t sell it, it’ll achieve nothing, and also, often actions can make things worse all round, let’s learn from the past and forgive and forget.
Some things are impossible to forgive, I know, and my attitude to life has changed a lot in recent years, sometimes mistakes are made, and it’s easy to add fuel to the fire, my attitude now is to shake hands and walk away.

To be honest, I was thinking about slimming things down anyway, just on space grounds (those that were at the SOS meet on Saturday will know what I mean!) so it's only really nudging me in the direction I was already going.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby johnny h » Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:38 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:Is it not ironic that those who are calling out a company for apparently bullying a critic are the same ones now bullying existing or potential customers of that company to sell, or not to buy, their products?
If this is little pop at me, "Please reconsider" is hardly bullying. There are lot of very decent, hard working people in music tech who don't have the financial, marketing and manufacturing muscle Behringer enjoy and personally I encourage (not bully!) people to consider supporting them instead.
As usual, a lot of people are taking offence on behalf of someone else, too, without actually knowing the full story and making all kinds of assumptions about the origins and intentions of the video without any facts at all.

Was this video commissioned by Uli, or was it an underling who got carried away and made a very poor judgement call? The answer matters enormously, but does anyone actually know?

Was this a genuinely vicious and carefully planned attack on an 'innocent' independent critic... or was it misdirected humour between old and well-seasoned sparring partners with well-ground axes?
Trademarking someone's name and spending many thousands and many months mocking up a synth and producing professional video goes way beyond this. To imagine Uli would not have to sign this off is completely absurd. Go to the Glassdoor website and you can get an idea about how he treats his employees.

I do actually know Peter. Behringer have acted very aggressively in the past and all Peter has done is calmly point this out on his website. He's a really nice guy and has never got involved in childish spats with anyone. He doesn't deserve the false equivalence and victim blaming he's got from some corners, although happily it seems most are in support of him.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby desmond » Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:09 pm

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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby OneWorld » Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:36 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:Is it not ironic that those who are calling out a company for apparently bullying a critic are the same ones now bullying existing or potential customers of that company to sell, or not to buy, their products?

As usual, a lot of people are taking offence on behalf of someone else, too, without actually knowing the full story and making all kinds of assumptions about the origins and intentions of the video without any facts at all.

Was this video commissioned by Uli, or was it an underling who got carried away and made a very poor judgement call? The answer matters enormously, but does anyone actually know?

Was this a genuinely vicious and carefully planned attack on an 'innocent' independent critic... or was it misdirected humour between old and well-seasoned sparring partners with well-ground axes?

All we really know is that the video was pulled pretty quickly and Uli himself has publically apologised... which I think is significant. Everyone makes mistakes... it's how they're dealt with that matters, surely?

And before anyone has a go at me for 'condoning' this fiasco... I don't. Not in the slightest! But equally, I'm not a fan of those who jump up on any passing bandwagon mainly so they can look down on all the people around them. :geek:

H

I think you got it on there Hugh, spot on, back of the net, a good point well made :-) Whether Behringer is right or wrong who knows who cares, if you don't like the plums then don't shake the tree.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Mar 03, 2020 3:36 pm

:lolno: :think: :roll:
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby johnny h » Tue Mar 03, 2020 4:51 pm

:lol:
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Agharta » Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:21 pm

It's seemingly considered normal now that if a person or entity even just allegedly did something considered to be 'wrong,' that they are totally written off via a publicly expressed view.
Maybe the modern day equivalent of public executions albeit virtual ones! People throwing virtual rocks at the 'sinners'.
Forgiveness isn't considered cool these days.

If I boycotted all the tech firms who have had dodgy dealings at high levels I'd be left with an abacus; home made version.
Goodbye to:

Samsung
Apple
Intel
Microsoft
Even Linux maybe! :D
etc

Not so easy and convenient to boycott all those is it?
A lot of knee jerks going off here.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby johnny h » Tue Mar 03, 2020 6:59 pm

Agharta wrote:It's seemingly considered normal now that if a person or entity even just allegedly did something considered to be 'wrong,' that they are totally written off via a publicly expressed view.
Maybe the modern day equivalent of public executions albeit virtual ones! People throwing virtual rocks at the 'sinners'.
Forgiveness isn't considered cool these days.

If I boycotted all the tech firms who have had dodgy dealings at high levels I'd be left with an abacus; home made version.
Goodbye to:

Samsung
Apple
Intel
Microsoft
Even Linux maybe! :D
etc

Not so easy and convenient to boycott all those is it?
A lot of knee jerks going off here.
Yes all these firms have engaged in dubious behaviour. The difference here is that this is not Behringer’s first foray into bullying and they have a long history of lawsuits.

If this was ancient history then there’s an argument for letting bygones be bygones, but it’s not. Just last year they were suing Dave Smith, suing forum users and are now actively bullying journalists who dare speak out against their aggressive behaviour. They quell dissent and furiously delete negative comments on their channels.

Personally for me Behringer’s ethics have stopped me from ever buying one of their products even before this latest stunt.
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Re: the latest Behringer-gate

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Mar 03, 2020 7:23 pm

johnny h wrote:Personally for me Behringer’s ethics have stopped me from ever buying one of their products even before this latest stunt.

I'm pleased your budget allows a range of alternative products... I just hope your preferred suppliers are all genuinely as ethical with squeaky-clean business practices as you imagine. ;-)
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