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The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby N i g e l » Fri Jul 24, 2020 1:18 pm

Im not sure if the PPG wave samples ( single cycles of waveforms stored digitally ) were worth copyrighting. It might have been a straight forward task to rearrange the data to make it look different but sound the same.

It was a long time ago so maybe any copyright has expired ?

Who owns the copyright ? - The PPG wavetables have left a trail of bankrupt companies in their wake [not the wavetables fault !]

I would have been keen to buy a PPG clone immediately but now, Im just "very interested".
Considerable time has passed since the 1st announcement and there has been a lot of wavetable synth activity from other manufacturers since then.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby DGL. » Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:21 pm

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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby ramthelinefeed » Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:25 pm

You can't copyright a waveform, it's not a musical, literary or dramatic work.

You can patent a circuit,
and you can trademark a brand.

Patents last 20 years in the UK. (During that time nobody can copy them)

Trademarks last as long as you renew and protect them. (During that time, nobody can pass themselves off as you).

So, if PPG had a patent on those waveforms, it would have long since expired.

If someone still owned and was actively making synths under the trademarked PPG brand, and Behringer labelled and advertised its new synths in a way which might reasonably be expected to dupe people into thinking they were buying a genuine PPG synth, not a Behringer rip off, then that could be dealt with in the courts.
Behringer undoubtedly sails close to the wind in that regard with products that emulate current manufacturers (e.g. Roland)
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby The Elf » Sat Jul 25, 2020 2:58 pm

Exciting developments...
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby DGL. » Sat Jul 25, 2020 9:21 pm

Another update from Behringer facebook,

Behringer FB wrote:Like for everyone, the Covid situation has been quite challenging, but we are very proud of our Tribers who immediately helped making radical changes, learned how to work from home and also found new ways to collaborate.
Many of our product launches have been delayed because the factory was shut down but we’re very confident that we’ll ship lots of new products for the remainder of the year.
With now 8 dedicated synth development teams working simultaneously on over 25 new synths we’re very excited to soon ship the previously announced products but also new ones we never spoke about.
You guys are absolutely fantastic and we’re so grateful for all the love we get from you.
P.S. Please wear masks and stay safe.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby DGL. » Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:54 am

There have also been some answers vis-à-vis the Ub-Xa on FB,
one commentator claimed it sounded "nothing like the OB-Xa", to which Behringer replied that it uses exactly the same circuits, components and their remakes of the VCO and VCF chips, plus they have done extensive comparisons with their own Ob-Xa so claim it will sound exactly like an Ob-Xa.

As for pricing they say that hasn't been fully worked out just yet but will be "a fraction of the cost of an original".
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby desmond » Sun Jul 26, 2020 8:07 am

DGL. wrote:one commentator claimed it sounded "nothing like the OB-Xa", to which Behringer replied that it uses exactly the same circuits, components and their remakes of the VCO and VCF chips, plus they have done extensive comparisons with their own Ob-Xa so claim it will sound exactly like an Ob-Xa.

:lol: That's the internets for you!

That "sounds nothing like" phrase that people throw around really bugs me, especially when it almost invariably means "it sounds pretty close to me but not identical", which is not the meaning conveyed in the words.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby DGL. » Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:41 am

desmond wrote:
DGL. wrote:one commentator claimed it sounded "nothing like the OB-Xa", to which Behringer replied that it uses exactly the same circuits, components and their remakes of the VCO and VCF chips, plus they have done extensive comparisons with their own Ob-Xa so claim it will sound exactly like an Ob-Xa.

:lol: That's the internets for you!

That "sounds nothing like" phrase that people throw around really bugs me, especially when it almost invariably means "it sounds pretty close to me but not identical", which is not the meaning conveyed in the words.

Which given the nature of analogue circuitry is exactly what you get with the originals, no two sound exactly alike.
Just waiting for pricing now, let's hope for a decent amount under £1000!
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby Dave B » Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:05 am

Lovely that they are carrying on with things in these interesting times.

I'm just waiting for the pricing / availability of their 2600 now. I'm surprised that it's been so quiet on that front given that it was planned to ship in April (it was planned to have been available for Superbooth). Hopefully there will be news on that soon.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby desmond » Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:15 am

DGL. wrote:Which given the nature of analogue circuitry is exactly what you get with the originals, no two sound exactly alike.

Indeed.

- "This Minimoog emulation plugin sounds *nothing like* my Minimoog! [implying it's a bad emulation]"
What they guy doesn't realise is *his* Minimoog sounds "nothing like" other Minimoogs out there, including the ones that were studied for emulation... :lol:

DGL. wrote:Just waiting for pricing now, let's hope for a decent amount under £1000!

What was the Deepmind price point on release? £799 or something? I'd guess it will be around there, but might be higher depending on the component costs etc. The Deepmind is the only true polysynth they've done to date, I think...
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby DGL. » Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:34 am

And it sounds nothing like my recording of said synth that is drowned in effects :lol:

One thing Andy from OMD always remarks is how crap their original synths (like the micropreset) sound without effects, a pot of reverb, chorus and eventide harmoniser were used in their studio.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby The Elf » Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:39 am

...and "sounds nothing like the other YouTube video I've watched."
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby BJG145 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:37 am

The Elf wrote:...and "sounds nothing like the other YouTube video I've watched."

...yeah, quite... ;)
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby Arpangel » Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:44 am

It seems all I have to do on this forum when talking about any bit of vintage kit is to say "I wonder if Behringer are going to make one?" and sure enough, it appears.
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Re: The All-New Behringer Keyboards 'n' Stuff Thread

Postby zenguitar » Tue Jul 28, 2020 11:19 am

The original E Type Jaguar is one of the most beautiful and iconic sports cars ever made, original examples change hands for 100's of thousands of pounds.

I wonder if Behringer is going to make one?

(fingers crossed)

Andy :beamup:
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