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Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

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Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby DoeZer » Fri Oct 01, 2004 1:55 pm

Hi y'all

hopefully i'll get one or two answers to ths here before the post is cast into the oblivion that is the acoustics forum!

I'm ready to order a building which I will use as a small studio in my back garden but one final thing is left to decide! which way the apex will run.... (the apex is part of these building btw, whether i like it or not...)

is it best to have your setup like this :

as you sit facing your monitors (ie in your normal mixinf position) should the apex be running above your head from left to right or front to back...

I ask this because Ive had people telling me BOTH ways are better! so im not sure which...

my gut feeling is that the apex should be running from left to right above your head, so that the roof slopes up from your end wall (where the monitors are)... am i right??

cheers
D
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Steve Hill » Fri Oct 01, 2004 2:12 pm

Sitting in my apex-roofed control room - just let me look up a sec - no, the ridge of the roof runs from front to back!

Having the sloping walls (ceilings?) L&R controls reflections much better. I am lucky to have enough space to have my monitors in the centre of the room. If I was more cramped (you say your monitors will be against the end wall), I certainly wouldn't want them placed under the eaves, with (presumably) parallel walls L&R. I imagine it would be like putting the monitors at the back of a big horn!

Do you have to make a decision right now anyway? Get the room built, put your monitors (only) in the room and feed them some commercial music you like from a CD, and try a lot of different positions. Then decide (I accept you may need to do this when the room is in say an 80% finished state, keeping options open about where to put acoustic treatment or underfloor wiring etc).

I'd be interested in any contrary views, as maybe I'm missing a trick here too!
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby DoeZer » Fri Oct 01, 2004 2:36 pm

unfortunately i cant wait until its built to try it out becuase one thing i definitely want is that the monitors are placed across the shortest dimensions withing the room, ie so that the back of the room (behind the mix position) is as far back from the monitors as possible (this is because its a relatively small room....).

so i guess i need to sort this out sooner than later.
your points make sense... ASWELL!!! :?...
anyone else care to thro in a third theory just to really confuse me :lol:

thanks
D
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Guest » Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:38 pm

Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

I find that putting the pointy bit at the top works best - otherwise the room keeps falling over.

....coat :beamup:
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Guest » Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:45 pm

And having put the pointy bit at the top, in general I'd say it's best to have the apex running from front to back.

There are a few variables to do with how you distribute absorption/diffusion in relation to ceiling height and whether putting the apex front to back will put the roof too close to your ears relative to the monitors but these are all open to some degree of manipulation so it needn't be a problem.

In a rectangular room, working with apex front to back usually makes better acoustic sense, better logistical sense in having the low points in the room at the sides where you can put racks/whatever rather than banging your head, and psychologically is more comfortable to work in as there's more of an impression of space from sitting, looking down the highest point in the room rather than at an angle that seems to be falling towards you.
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Steve Hill » Sat Oct 02, 2004 1:57 am

Just one final thought - never apologise for an apex! My CR was deliberately built that way to minimise standing waves from parallel surfaces. In fact one gable end is slightly wider than the other, so I have no parallel surfaces at all - something you might want to think about if you haven't got the footings in yet!

While I was having a sort-out in my studio I temporarily moved my computer and monitors to (what I call) my drum booth - a 10' x 8' x 7' "right angled" room. The monitors were on the 8' wall in the corners, firing down the length of the room. The bass standing waves were awful! I use Mackie HR824s which are supposedly tunable to corner positions, but they still didn't like it. Every mix I did in there, I re-did once I got my control room back.
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Adam Inglis » Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:29 pm

DoeZer wrote: one thing i definitely want is that the monitors are placed across the shortest dimensions withing the room, ie so that the back of the room (behind the mix position) is as far back from the monitors as possible (this is because its a relatively small room....).

Well I would've thought in a small room, you'd want to improve the ratio of Direct to Reflected sound as much as possible, so you'd put the monitors along the widest wall, with the apex travelling side to side as you say.
You'd then need plenty of absorption on the opposite ceiling and plenty of diffusion and absorption on the back wall...

?
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby giles » Sun Oct 03, 2004 6:04 pm

i don't know if your going to line the cieling; if not then this may be irrelevant; my studio has a flat roof & it has to be lined with a separation; i've decided to make a shallow barrel vaulted, curved cieling to vary the standing frequencies. if i had an apex cieling i would want to stop frequencies bouncing around in the apex; a curved lining might also work in this case?
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby Guest » Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:06 pm

Curved surfaces are best avoided in studios and other acoustically important environments - or at least concave curves are, because they act to focus reflected sound towards a specific point. Convex curves are ok as they have a diffusive effect but even then a compound/elipsoidal curve is much better than a simple/regular curve. A barrel vaulted roof is likely to cause far more problems than an apex roof.

Flat roofs parallel with floors are pretty bad news but if they're absorbent/trapped across a sufficently wide range their worst effects can be tamed, if not entirely eliminated. But I'd still probably prefer a flat roof over concave curves/barrel vaults.
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Re: Apex roofs... which orientation is best???

Postby giles » Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:49 am

thanks for that information on curved cielings; i'll drop the plan. what about slightly varying angles in the surface of the cieling?
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