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DIY Studio Build Diary

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Thu Feb 07, 2013 11:30 am

Thanks very much thefruitfarmer,

I did the same as you with the pva. It was such a cold day it probably just increased the viscosity, but i don't know. It was windy as hell and the spray mist was blowing away before i could get any on the panels, then the panels blew away ! Now its calm and even sunny this morning. Typical.

As soon as the panels are covered they are going straight in place so i will know what improvement there is. I Know from past experience it takes a fair few panels to make a big difference and its a very bad sounding room. I have got the insulation in already so i will just soldier on. I can always turn most of the panels round to give reflections if i decide it is too dead in there.

I got the timber yard to cut it at the exact dimensions as the slabs but when i measured it was 2 mm down. I think this is just tolerance. The timber yard told me to add one mil all round to accommodate this so i will do that for the rest of them. I am not using chicken wire, just joint tape mesh at the ends and a couple of small wood cross braces if needed so a slight amount of compression will be a good thing i suppose.

Can i ask you where you got a decent staple gun and staples from please ?
Did you use 6 mm staples ?

Cheers

Peter
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby thefruitfarmer » Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:48 pm

Helmutcrab wrote:

Can i ask you where you got a decent staple gun and staples from please ?
Did you use 6 mm staples ?


You should be able to get a decent staple gun from B and Q, Homebase or somewhere like that. 6mm staples did the job.

I would go for an all metal constructed one from a reputable brand. Mine has lasted for years.
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby James Perrett » Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:24 pm

thefruitfarmer wrote:
You should be able to get a decent staple gun from B and Q, Homebase or somewhere like that. 6mm staples did the job.

I'd avoid B&Q or Homebase for a project like this - they're very expensive unless you can buy things on special offer. I'm fairly sure my Tacwise staple gun came from Toolstation - certainly most of the screws and other fixings did.

And to answer an earlier question, I've used RS60 for my panels which has been very slightly compressed to sit inside the frames. I didn't bother with anything else to hold it in apart from the fabric on the front. On the walls I've glued the rockwool directly to the walls - the fabric covered frames are just decorative as I didn't want to totally cover the walls with rockwool so there are untreated areas behind some of those frames.

James.
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:08 pm

Cheers to both of you for your help,

Ive used toolstation for years. They are great on price and product availability but thats also where i got the failed drill bits and corner clamp. However it was only one manufacturer which i will be staying away from in future, still ive gone with more expensive quality wood screws from my local timber yard as they are essential to the structure of my panels.

I wanted to use Cara fabric to cover my panels but it was going to cost over £300 for the fabic alone so ive gone with 50 M of 4 oz polyester wadding (£45) and 10 oz upholstery hessian ( £65 ).

Lets just hope i don't get sick of potato sack beige colour !

Also, after feeling how heavy the wood panels are i think i may use 4 of the metal ones i made earlier for ceiling cloud panels.

Thanks

Peter
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby thefruitfarmer » Fri Feb 08, 2013 10:40 pm

Helmutcrab wrote:

Lets just hope i don't get sick of potato sack beige colour !

Also, after feeling how heavy the wood panels are i think i may use 4 of the metal ones i made earlier for ceiling cloud panels.


Any light and neutral colour will do the trick, you can always change it with coloured lighting if you want. Black will make it look like a dungeon.

I did think your wood frames were a bit heavy duty TBH but they will still do the job, might just need additional fittings. Glad you are getting use out of the metal frames too.
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Fri Feb 08, 2013 11:18 pm

I did think your wood frames were a bit heavy duty TBH but they will still do the job, might just need additional fittings. Glad you are getting use out of the metal frames too.

Im surprised to hear that - and heres me thinking i was making them as light as possible ! :headbang:

Do you have a design or suggestion you could share with me ?

I didn't do a bulk order as the timber yard are happy to cut wood as and when i need it. I don't know if they do 1 x 1 or 1.5 ". Im thinking that might work better for suspended panels but may be a bit fragile. The 2 x 45 mm sides do seem a bit much now you mention it.

Cheers

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Sat Feb 09, 2013 3:45 pm

Thefruitfarmer,

Thanks very much for pointing me in the right direction there regarding weight. The 1" x 2"s were definitely too heavy for suspending.

I've now got 1" x 1" cut ( with 4" corner and central supports ) and it is easily strong enough using the same design as above but with added centre braces.
I think i can trim a bit more off for the suspended panels too by reducing the corners to 3" and increasing the central supports from one 4" to two 1" x 1" braces ( same number of screws )

I should pont out for anyone following this that all cuts are dressed and metric so a 1" x 1" is actually 20 mm x 20 mm.

I will get some photos up of the frames next week.

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby thefruitfarmer » Sat Feb 09, 2013 4:38 pm

What you have done will make it lighter, all it has to do is support the mineral wool slab.

I made my frames from 12mm thick plank, conveniently at 10cm wide and used a hole saw to "honeycomb" it. Of course, there are several ways to make an effective frame, depending on your woodworking skills and what materials and tools you have available...

Mine look like this...

Image

Image
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Sat Feb 09, 2013 6:00 pm

Those are very nice indeed, and the sides will give good diffraction i think. Thanks for sharing that with me.

I may be asking my timber yard if they have any 12 mm in on monday !

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Thu Feb 14, 2013 4:17 pm

Hi thefruitfarmer and co.

Here is the new frame and old frame for comparison. In theory the new one should be around 40 % lighter ( i think ) but in reality there seems little difference, but the sides are definitely more exposed which is good so i will keep it this way.

Image

Image

The main problem i have now is how to get the screws to form a solid corner.
I messed up the screw positioning on this first thinner frame :

Image

I realised after doing this that i should have used the method of inner side and outer side with adjacent screws like i did on the 1 x 2 frame :

Image

I can do this for the central portion of the corners as these blocks are 110 mm deep but i do not know how to strengthen the thin ( 20 mm x 20 mm ) outer frame at the corners. I can only get one 4 mm screw in with ease. Putting two in would be very tight.

Secondly, I was intending to use the same method as the 2 x 1 frame for making the four individual frames ie using just one screw either side into the corner blocks. I am not sure if this method is strong enough either as the blocks are twice the size now ( 110 mm x 93 mm instead of 60 x 45 mm ), with less than half the size of outer frame securing them ( 20 mm instead of 45 mm ).

I am also a little concerned about the strength of the 20 mm x 20 mm frame with regards to hanging after feeling how heavy 15 cm of 60 kg/m3 insulation is. I was intending to use eye screws 20 % in from the edges ( so cord is hidden ) but this would mean using the weakest parts of the frames ( the outer 20 mm x 20 mm frame ) for the eye screws.
I could use two 2" mid frame supports instead of one 4" but that would not allow central side support for the insulation when i tension joint mesh tape or twine here to prevent sagging.

Any ideas appreciated ?

Peter
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby James Perrett » Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:38 pm

I used small triangles of thin plywood across the corners on the back face to make my frames rigidly square. I actually extended them outwards from the frame so that I could screw through them into the wall/ceiling studs to fix the frames. Not sure if you can see that from any of the photos I posted.

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Fri Feb 15, 2013 12:58 pm

Thanks for that James. The only problem with that is i will be wanting to face the rear face of some of the panels into the room at some point for reflections ( rear is paper faced )

I think doing the corners in the same way as the 1 x 2 should work ( i am just about to find out ) but it also means an extra hours work per panel as i need 4 extra screws per individual frame to secure the larger corner posts first in order for it to work.

By the way, i did the maths and the thinner panels are 25 % lighter than the 1 x 2 panels, which isn't as much as i expected but i can definitely feel it when i lift them above the shoulders so its worth doing.

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Folderol » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:03 pm

For something like this I would use 40mm plasterboard screws.
Before anyone objects...
They are cheap.
They are thin, so won't split the wood.
Have a coarse thread with a rough finish that holds really well.
Have a wide flat head that will sit in the wood without major bruising.
Have an excellent crosshead slot that really grips the screwdriver.

I've used these for a lot of lightweight frame/panel work - and even for holding up plasterboard!
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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby Helmutcrab » Fri Feb 15, 2013 1:38 pm

Thanks Folderol,

I am using 50 mm x 4 mm single thread screws at the moment and wouldn't want to go less than 50 for the central corners posts at least, but i get what your saying they don't half grip wood. If i need to get two screws in every 20 mm x 20 mm corner i might give them a try.

I have ordered a stanley light duty corner clamp as it was really hard doing the new smaller corners. hopefully it will help.

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Re: DIY Studio Build Diary

Postby thefruitfarmer » Fri Feb 15, 2013 10:49 pm

Corner clamps rock.
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