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Sound proofing a very small brick building

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Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby DVST » Sun Jun 24, 2018 1:19 am

I'm about to convert a back yard outhouse utility shed into a music space.

It's wall structure is bricks only . Roof is 100mm rafters, OSB board and felt.

Inner dimensions are roughly

Length 2.5m
Width 2m
Height 2.2m

There is a double glazed window that can be opened. A wooden door (i'm going to add a 2nd).

I'm hoping to find the best way of Soundproofing space to use without disturbing neighbours.

I could build stud walls decoupled from the existing walls inside but 200mm of each dimension when it's already a tight fit is pushing it...

To save space I'm wondering If I Rockwool the walls externally Rainscreen cladding type would this achieve reduction as much as inner soundproofing?

Any pointers would be very much appreciated...
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby ef37a » Sun Jun 24, 2018 5:47 am

Short of building another de coupled brick structure around the shed I think you are on a hiding to nothing. Even then the space is so small as to be almost useless for speaker monitoring and I doubt could be made of much use for acoustic recording. You could I suppose near fill it with absorbent and use it as a vocal booth!

I don't want to put you off but that space (a near cube!) could IMHO only be useful as a mixing/editing room using headphones.

But I am just an old amp tech and could be wrong!

Dave.
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby DVST » Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:05 am

ef37a wrote:Short of building another de coupled brick structure around the shed I think you are on a hiding to nothing. Even then the space is so small as to be almost useless for speaker monitoring and I doubt could be made of much use for acoustic recording. You could I suppose near fill it with absorbent and use it as a vocal booth!

I don't want to put you off but that space (a near cube!) could IMHO only be useful as a mixing/editing room using headphones.

But I am just an old amp tech and could be wrong!

Dave.

Dave,

Thank you very much for your reply.

My main issue right now isn't the acoustics of the room. I understand recording and monitoring is going to be very poor.

I don't need it to be a near pro mixing/recording environment just a private writing space.

As a creative i need to make this happen and I want to seal off as much sound escaping for privacy and security.

Any pointers in relation to this would be much appreciated.

Thanks
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby Sam Spoons » Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:26 am

I'd just make sure all the air gaps are sealed as well as possible, add secondary glazing to the window, fit your double door and beef up the ceiling (after sealing air gaps adding mass is the next best way of reducing sound transmission). Given the size you ain't going to be recording bands in there so as long as you work at reasonable levels that should get you in the ball park. As Dave says you'll struggle to achieve a good monitoring environment for speaker and headphones will probably be your friend anyway.
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby DVST » Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:42 am

Sam Spoons wrote:I'd just make sure all the air gaps are sealed as well as possible, add secondary glazing to the window, fit your double door and beef up the ceiling (after sealing air gaps adding mass is the next best way of reducing sound transmission). Given the size you ain't going to be recording bands in there so as long as you work at reasonable levels that should get you in the ball park. As Dave says you'll struggle to achieve a good monitoring environment for speaker and headphones will probably be your friend anyway.

Thank you for your reply Sam,

I am thinking of adding soundbloc plasterboard mounted on a resillient channel to the inner walls.

The ceiling 50mm rockwool with a layer soundbloc.

I'm questioning whether it's worth adding rainscreen cladding rockwool to the exterior of building ?

Any knowledge here would be welcome....
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:48 am

The devil is in the detail, so it really depends what you hope to do with this music space, and how much sound proofing is required...

But my gut reaction is that the proposed space is a small cube which is the most undesirable possible size and shape because it will always have a terribly lumpy and unbalanced low end with no bass at all in the middle of the room (which is where you're likely to end up sitting).

And if you want to achieve a decent level of sound proofing (stopping noise getting out or in) it's going to get a very great deal smaller...

So being brutally realistic, I really don't think it is worth investing a lot of time and money on such an inherently compromised space.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news...
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby Wonks » Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:54 am

Any chance of knocking the existing building down and building a bigger purpose-designed one in its space?
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby blinddrew » Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:05 am

I think it would help to understand what kind of music you'll be playing there. If it's just you and an acoustic instrument and your concerns are solely about having somewhere quiet to practice where neither you or the neighbours will be disturbed, then it might be worth a bit of time sealing gaps and adding a bit of mass. But nothing expensive.
If you're looking to crank up an electric instrument, or have anywhere to mix or record, then I'd be looking at alternatives I'm afraid. Sound-proofing is expensive, difficult, and bulky/heavy. To do a decent job on a room that size is going to leave you very little space to work in and, because you'll need to seal it, you're going to start running into unpleasant air very quickly.
Putting cladding on the exterior walls really isn't going to help because there'll be no isolation between the walls and the cladding, so they'll just transfer the vibration.

One question though, is it a free-standing building and could you build a second, unattached, skin around it?
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby DVST » Mon Jun 25, 2018 9:23 pm

Wonks wrote:Any chance of knocking the existing building down and building a bigger purpose-designed one in its space?


A new DIY purpose built construction would cost me 18months + 5 grand yet making use of this existing outbuilding for now would cost a couple weekends and few hundred quid......

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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby Sam Spoons » Tue Jun 26, 2018 10:41 am

Realistically how loud do you need it to be for a 'private writing space'? I'd have thought keeping the levels down along with the basic soundproofing measures detailed above would be the only practical answer.
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby garrettendi » Tue Jun 26, 2018 11:26 am

Sam Spoons wrote:Realistically how loud do you need it to be for a 'private writing space'? I'd have thought keeping the levels down along with the basic soundproofing measures detailed above would be the only practical answer.

I agree with Sam. If you keep the noise to a reasonable level, it will avoid the need for anything major in terms of soundproofing.

I live in a flat with a lease that prohibits excessive noise, so I run everything through headphones, only going "live" if I really need it (or just to blow the cobwebs off my amp). Even then, keeping the volume reasonable has never incurred complaints yet,

Sorry if it the above was off-point, I've only scanned the thread, not read exhaustively,
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Re: Sound proofing a very small brick building

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:17 pm

DVST wrote:A new DIY purpose built construction would cost me 18months + 5 grand yet making use of this existing outbuilding for now would cost a couple weekends and few hundred quid......

Fair enough. I get where you're coming from....

As long as you recognise the enormous compromises involved, then you're probably best off sorting out the obvious air-gaps first -- so seals around all four sides of the door (and second door if you add one -- which would be a good idea), and maybe an inner, well sealed window of lift-in frame that seals well around the edges.

The next most likely means of sound egress will be through the roof structure, so putting in a heavy ceiling with rockwool above would be next on my list.

How far you need to go with this really does depend on what you intend to play in this creative space, and how loud. If it's an acoustic guitar then the basics above will probably suffice. If it's a loud drum kit or electric guitar amp then you'll need to do a lot more...

H
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