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Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

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Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby not-the-first-note » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:16 pm

Hi all, my band is playing in two venues that both have their own house PA. For mixers, one venue has the Dynacord CMS 1000, and the other has the CMS 1600.

Our stage set up is generally 3 x vox mic, 2 x mic'd guitar amps, bass drum mic (and possibly one kit overhead), and bass is DI to the mixer.

The issue we have is that in both venues, the vox gets lost in the mix as the house speakers struggle to compete with the guitar amps. We have tried to turn down the amps on stage, but this doesn't help.

To solve the issue, we are looking at buying two additional powered speakers, and use them by either:
1) hooking up the additional speakers to the house mixer via auxiliary outputs. We want to kill the output to the auxiliary outputs for everything except the 3 x vox so these two additional speakers will augment only the vox, or
2) using a DI box to split the lead vox signal between the mixer and the additional speakers, and just accept the reduced backing vox quality.

Using the auxiliary outputs is preferred, but we don't know if this is possible considering the mixers provided. Can anyone let me know if they think this will be possible?

We have asked the house sound guy but he is not sure (we're based in a part of the world that is not blessed with sound guys who know what they're doing)...
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Re: Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby James Perrett » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:22 pm

What you are suggesting is fraught with potential problems.

A better solution would be to not put the guitars and bass through the PA as it would appear the sound from the amps is loud enough. If the PA only has to handle vocals it will be more likely to be able to cope.

One thing to watch out for - are the guitar amps pointing at the guitarists ears or just pointing at the guitarist's knees? If the guitar amps are pointing in the wrong place the guitarists will just turn things up until everything is just a loud mess.
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Re: Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby not-the-first-note » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:40 pm

thanks for the input! The guitarists use stands to angle the amps up toward themselves. They do struggle to hear themselves from time to time, but the amp volumes are kept to a minimum on stage.

The venues are pretty big but the owners just haven't invested in decent speakers, i think the guitars would struggle to hit the middle or back of the venue without going thru the PA. If we turn up the amps any more, then the singer struggles to hear himself as the monitor situation isn't great either. It's like a perfect storm of bad sound set up!

We've played venues with good systems and it isn't a problem, it's just these venues have us on long term deals, but their system isn't up to it...
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Re: Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby James Perrett » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:37 pm

OK - I don't think you are going to solve the problem with a random pair of additional speakers. In fact, you could make things worse if the any of the speakers were designed with different polarities for some of the drivers (a trick that some designers use to get around crossover phase shifts). Do you know what sort of speakers the venue uses and are they designed to be used as part of an array?

If they aren't designed to be used as part of an array then you may be better off bringing your own complete speaker system (and probably mixer too) so that you know that it is all going to work together.
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Re: Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby CS70 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 9:08 am

not-the-first-note wrote:thanks for the input! The guitarists use stands to angle the amps up toward themselves. They do struggle to hear themselves from time to time, but the amp volumes are kept to a minimum on stage.

You could try to place the guitar amps pointing towards the wall and turn them up a little. The sound would be higher on stage but reach the audience much less. It may not look great but you can easily hide the setup or even put a silent amp front-facing just for show.

For the singer, an inexpensive solution could be an additional small personal monitor mounted on a mic stand and pointing directly to his/her ears - that usually makes hearing yourself much easier without interfering with the rest of the band. You have to pay attention to the positioning but with guitarists and bass player usually on the side of the singer, the only one which may get a little bit more vocals is the drummer. :-)

All you need is a spare aux or more likely a thru from the current floor scene monitor.
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Re: Dynacord CMS (1000 and 1600), auxiliary outputs

Postby not-the-first-note » Sat Aug 11, 2018 2:55 pm

Do you know what sort of speakers the venue uses and are they designed to be used as part of an array?

We know that it's not an array set up, so it's looking like the additional speakers may not be the way to go.

You could try to place the guitar amps pointing towards the wall and turn them up a little

I think this will be worth a try for the next gig and see how it goes.
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