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how to know which amplifier i need

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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Wed Sep 12, 2018 7:29 pm

the yamaha dzr12 impressed me. I want to buy 2x yamaha dzr12 and 2x yamaha dxs15mkii. Is this enough for 150 people sometimes more? is there a way to put thisnspeaker on a truss or maybe something else bevause sometimes i do sound for bigger venues where a stage is avaible but my speaker stand has max 6 m lengt maybe you have ideas? thnx)
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Sam Spoons » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:18 pm

I have 2 QSC K12s and would be happy to use them to a crowd of 250+ for all but the loudest band. The K12s have a max SPL of 131dB, the Yamaha DZR12s you like can output a remarkable 139dBSPL, way more than you'll ever need for indoor gigs to 150 people. Add a couple of the matching subs and you'll be good for metal bands in quite large venues. If you have the budget those should set you up for a considerable time into the future (but invest in some good ear plugs as it's gonna get LOUD :D )
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:28 pm

so for a crowd 250+ its will be good? soo 400 people without problem
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:35 pm

hownu place thebspeakers if u have a stage which is big and high? on a speaker stand or do you use something else? thank you)
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Sam Spoons » Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:42 pm

Impossible to say without knowing the venue, genre and more but they are 7dB louder than nearly anything else similar which is a lot. WRT mounting, they are light enough to go on stands/poles and have fly points so can be flown (but flying them needs a qualified rigger if you want to avoid invalidating your PLI).
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:18 am

how you use it to let it fly? on a truss lifter?
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Sam Spoons » Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:46 am

You need to consult the tech documents provided by the manufacturer WRT flying speakers. It is not something for casual advice on a forum.
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:14 am

iv never had it before i dont know how to let it fly. It just a truss lifer on that i put the speaker with the special speaker lift mount? Or how to let it fly? thnx for help
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Wonks » Thu Sep 13, 2018 10:15 am

And it's not something that you can really do just by reading. You need to be shown how to do it, along with how to set up a frame/gantry with sufficient strength and support to fly the speakers from. You are at the professional end of PA when you do this type of stuff, and there's a lot of responsibility involved as you are dealing with heavy equipment that can kill or injure if improperly installed.

It's really worth getting hold of a copy of the 'SOS guide to live sound', which will have a lot of the answers to your questions. https://www.soundonsound.com/shop/books ... live-sound (also available on Amazon). There are also books aimed more at the pro end of the market which you might want to move onto after that.

There's a limit to how much you will learn from asking questions here. So I suggest a mixture of reading followed by hands-on experience. Don't try anything to big or fancy. Stand mounted speakers at small gigs to start with, then add some subs for bigger venues. Don't forget that as the rig expands and you put more through it, you'll need more mics and mic stands, cables etc.

You don't have to spend a fortune for decent stage mics, but it's false economy to start with really cheap equipment if you can afford to spend a bit more. A good mic will last 20+ years if looked after, even if they look a bit battered at the end of that period. But you can replace grilles on the mics from good manufacturers.

Likewise mic stands from a good manufacturer may cost a bit more than the cheapest Chinese-made stand, but they will be rugged and reliable and again, often can have parts replaced.
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Thu Sep 13, 2018 11:27 am

thnx im just asking bevause the band gor which im doung sound are also play on some stages where i have to take own pa. I use mics from musicstore their own FAME ms58 mics they are amazing they sound better than shure sm58 and cist less a lot less just look for fun! its a very funny price but the sound is amazing rlly amazing
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Wonks » Thu Sep 13, 2018 12:48 pm

I've just ordered one so I can compare it against a real SM58.
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Thu Sep 13, 2018 3:31 pm

i think you will be surprised. The price is very funny like very funny setimes u have dals that you can get a mic and a mic holder for 23 euros. The mic is just a little bit smaller in my opinion
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Wonks » Thu Sep 13, 2018 3:43 pm

I did buy one of the Behringer SM58-style mics when they came out (also the three mics for about £20 that were introduced at the same time). The Behringer XM8500 had less top end and more bottom end than an SM58, but nothing that couldn't be countered by more treble and less bass on the mixing desk to get a sound pretty close to an SM58 with the EQ flat. So it wasn't a bad mic for the money, but it could have been better. Neither were as good as my E/V dynamics, but they did cost quite a bit more at the time.
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Fri Sep 14, 2018 7:03 pm

I think that the fame has a lot of sennheiser colour. Amazing mids and highs and enough low. In my opnion the fame sm58 has too much low.
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby dennisgamalej » Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:34 pm

hey) and do u have the fame mic? what do u think about it? i have a question. I like a lot of fame stuff maybe i have to buy for foh one of them speakers like this one https://www.musicstore.de/de_DE/EUR/Fam ... V000087263 is that enough for punk,rock? for how much people i can play about? thnx i rlly like fame stuff
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Re: how to know which amplifier i need

Postby Wonks » Sat Sep 22, 2018 9:08 pm

Yes. I did a review of it here https://www.soundonsound.com/forum/view ... 27&t=63147

Once modified to balanced operation it's not bad, if a bit bright. It may suit duller voices but could be rather harsh on others. But it really does need to be modified. I've got their SM57 copy arriving next week to see if that is similar.

It's really hard to tell how good a speaker is without hearing it. It's a lot of speaker for the money and in theory should be pretty loud. But teer are no frequency response charts and there is a huge jump in peak SPL from the 12" version to the 15" one, from 119dB to 136dB for just 50W more RMS power (400W to 450W). You typically tend to get a 1 or 2 dB increase going from 12" to 15" versions of speakers, not 17dB. I've seen lots of mistakes in the Fame documentation and on the Music Store web site, so without hearing the speakers, there's no way of really knowing if they sound good or are as loud as they claim to be.

Personally, for a similar price, I'd go for the new ALTO TS3 range of speakers as there are lots of people here who have the previous ranges and whilst not the very best quality sound, they are very acceptable. https://www.musicstore.de/en_GB/GBP/ALT ... 019819-000

If I wanted to add subs, then I'd stick with 12" speakers as vocals sound better on them than 15" speakers. Only go for the 15" if you don't plan to have subs but will be putting bass or drums through them.

Just note that even on the TS312, Music Store quote two different SPL levels on the same page. They really have too many cut and paste errors on their website! So it's really best to check on the manufacturer's websites for the full details (which unfortunately you can't do with the Fame range).
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