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Bose S-1 battery issues

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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Sat Nov 02, 2019 10:06 am

Rob Kirkwood wrote:just trying to make sense of the behaviour of different S1's!
Rob

Yeah, me too :headbang:

Several users have demonstrated that the batteries are not the problem as they don't lose charge if removed from the S1 Pro . There is something going on in the S1 Pro that draws an excessive amount of current when the device is switched off. Li-Ion batteries have a self discharge of less that 3% a month even when taking into account the charge/discharge monitoring circuitry so that doesn't account for it. Bose even acknowledge that there is a problem with some S1 Pros and recommend removing the battery as a temporary fix.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Mon Nov 04, 2019 8:33 pm

Well, back to square one, Reading 90% now :headbang: Better than the last one but still on schedule to lose 20% in a month so it does have the problem. I can probably live without it for a few more days so will check again towards next weekend. It's annoying that the app only resolves the charge remaining to 10% increments. :madas:
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby James Perrett » Mon Nov 04, 2019 9:08 pm

So now the question is whether the app is rounding up, rounding down or a bit of both? Could it go to 90% if the voltage drops ever so slightly below full charge? Can you measure the actual battery voltage?
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Tue Nov 05, 2019 11:19 am

That was my thought, I plan to try to get an idea by letting it fall to 80% (expecting that to take another 10 days or so, will next check it next Tuesday if I can resist the temptation to use it, It might be my backup plan for a small outdoor Remembrance day service I'm supplying a PA for).

Once it's down to 80% I'll see if I can measure the batter voltage, and try to jury rig an ammeter into the circuit. It all has to be done fully reversibly with minimum risk of damage so it may not be simple to do.

It's been over a year since the first post about the issue on the Bose forum. I'm beginning to think Bose are just ignoring it in the hope it will go away.

Has anybody got any suggestions for a similar box from another manufacturer, there are loads out there but they all seem to be either mini line arrays (inconvenient), super expensive* or really cheap (in one or the other sense of the word).

* https://www.thomann.de/gb/sennheiser_lsp_500_pro.htm
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Tue Nov 19, 2019 6:36 pm

This looks interesting Image

£549 so £70 more than the Bose just now and, seemingly, not yet avalable but has a BT mixer app, four inputs and goes a decent bit louder, only weight 1kg more too. Not sure if it will sound as good though.


https://www.pmtonline.co.uk/jbl-professional-eon-one-compact-pa-speaker#product-details

If Bose don't sort out the battery issue the JBL might be a decent alternative.
-
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby blinddrew » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:24 pm

Sam, unrelated question, but am i right in thinking the S1 doesn't provide phantom power?
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:46 pm

Yes, it doesn't provide spook juice. :thumbup:

I don't know if anybody else has thoughts but I'm finding the S1's tonal balance very wayward. With my AER Compact 60 (or the TC VoiceLive) I can pretty much plug any guitar and mic in and get a usable sound, the S1 seems to have a mind of it's own, particularly WRT the bottom end. The eq is rudimentary at best and, with BT from iTunes on my phone the bass is very hyped.

I had a longish chat with the PA guy at my local dealer (from whom I bought the S1) and he says the JBL does not sound as good. He is an early adopter and fan of the S1 (but does not have a battery as he bought his S1 before the battery was included). The rep has said the fix is a simple replacement of a single component but Bose have not recalled existing units as the issue is present in less than one in ten. Hmmmm, do I sound dubious, I wonder if his S1 has the problem, undiscovered........

No announcement on the Bose forum yet though, time to poke a stick in the wasps nest methinks.......
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby blinddrew » Fri Nov 22, 2019 12:48 pm

Thanks Sam,
Been asked for some advice from a friend and this question is pertinent.
May start a new thread actually.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Fri Nov 22, 2019 1:05 pm

Sam Spoons wrote:I don't know if anybody else has thoughts but I'm finding the S1's tonal balance very wayward. With my AER Compact 60 (or the TC VoiceLive) I can pretty much plug any guitar and mic in and get a usable sound, the S1 seems to have a mind of it's own, particularly WRT the bottom end. The eq is rudimentary at best and, with BT from iTunes on my phone the bass is very hyped.

Just checking... you are aware that the low end is automatically equalised in different ways depending on the speaker's orientation, aren't you? It makes assumptions about the proximity of boundary surfaces depending on which way up it is, whether it's on a pole mount, etc.

H
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:21 pm

Yes Hugh, I am aware of that thanks :thumbup: . Haven't really experimented sufficiently yet with it but sometimes it sounds great, other times pretty naif. Will try to spend some time with it and try to make sense of the variations.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Wonks » Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:23 pm

There is always the possibility that one or more of its position sensors is playing up, and hence the sound variation (if you are always using it in the same way).
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Fri Nov 22, 2019 6:32 pm

Could be, I've had two S1s and both have the battery drain issue, the second much less, but I've noticed the odd behaviour on both. Will look into it further.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Sat Nov 30, 2019 10:42 pm

Went to my dealer on Wednesday and did a side by side comparison of the S1 Pro and the Eon Compact. The built in mixer in the Eon is a hugely attractive feature but not sufficient to offset the very harsh sound quality (so I guess the Berry XR12 is going to be a keeper for now). The S1 Pro is a much nicer sounding box so mine is winging it's way to Belgium for a repair which they assure me will solve the problem. I will obviously test it when I get it back and, if all is good, will buy a second one.

BTW, did anybody find out one way or another whether their S1 has the issue?
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby resistorman » Mon Dec 02, 2019 11:56 pm

I bought a new one and it seems to have the problem. My original one does not.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Folderol » Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:19 am

Late to the party...
The problem is based on the fact that none of this kit is ever truly off. This applies to almost all modern equipment, and it is the software switch that is the cause of the problem.

Probaly not a viable answer here, but what I've done with several bits of stuff is to put a physical switch in line with the battery. My laptop (which is seldom used) has a removable battery, so I just pull it out.
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:16 am

I agree in most cases*, however the UK rep has said the problem in the S1 is with the hardware and the fix involves changing a single component**. I'll see if they've fixed it when I get it back.

The problem is that, with my second S1 I was convinced it was fine when the app showed 100% battery after a week only to be disappointed a couple of days later when it was down to 90%. I'd guess very few users are prepared to leave a new toy unused for a couple of weeks to find out, even if they are aware the issue exists so if 1 in 10 users are reporting the issue it is probably much more prevalent than 10% showing a problem.

* Extensive Googling suggests the combination of self discharge and the current draw of the monitoring circuitry in a Lithium Ion battery system should be less than 3% per month (much less in most cases).

** In Uli Behringer's blog concerning the building of 'Behringer City' in China he cited the practice amongst Chinese electronics manufacturers of substituting cheaper components when the western managers had returned from whence they came after their periodic 'quality control' visits
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Rob Kirkwood » Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:10 pm

Sam Spoons wrote:... the UK rep has said the problem in the S1 is with the hardware and the fix involves changing a single component
I've seen this mention of a 'single component' by them before in one of the S1 forums.

Now in my head that means a resistor or something - but I guess it could equally mean a whole pre-built circuit board! ...I wonder if we'll ever find out? :protest:

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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:51 pm

Somehow I doubt it :headbang: (I don't think I've seen it mentioned on the Bose forum though).

Anyway a further update.

1, The excessive bass on the BT/aux channel is pretty well documented on the Bose S1 forum. I suspect it is partly a characteristic of BT devices which are expected to be listened to on earbuds, the S1 is a full range speaker with, I suspect, a hyped bass too so the combination is sometimes a little overpowering.

2, I bought an "Allpowers Portable Power Station" off Amazon which arrived today. It looks, as expected, a bit plasticky but feels fairly solid and has a useful (if it's accurate) LCD display.

Initialy, on plugging the XR into it I was dismayed to find it introducing an unacceptable amount of digital hash into the system but some judicious gain staging has rendered it all but inaudible. So after a not very exhaustive test it looks like it will power my XR12 for several hours (showing 7+ hours powering the XR12 and a TC VoiceSolo speaker) which is quite impressive. If it works as well with the S1 it'll be a useful addition to the inventory.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07H4FQFQW/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

BTW it arrived in a very respectable 4 days, particularly as I was given to expect it on 30th Dec....
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Re: Bose S-1 battery issues

Postby Sam Spoons » Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:30 am

Just a supplementary question for those with proper knowledge.....

Using the petrol genny I would have a ground stake and RCCD protected distro. With the rig being completely floating, one or two S1 Pros and the XR12 (with maybe an additional TC Voice Solo for foldback) powered at 230VAC from the power bank what practical safety precautions should I take?
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