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Expensive Vocal Mic

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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby MOF » Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:54 pm

Beyer M160 ribbon vocal mic’?
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby James Perrett » Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:45 am

One other thought - have you tried the Audix OM5? I know you have the OM7 but I've found that the OM5 gives a very smooth sound with a slight boost at the very high end.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Aptorian » Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:48 am

Tim Gillett wrote:Sure, we can't control how various people use the mic, though we can politely offer a performer advice on how best to use the mic, but we can control proximity effect (bass tip up). The KSM8 is one of the few current stage mics that does control it. It's one of its great but not always understood features.

I often barely get a soundcheck, let alone time to advise on mic technique. Proximity effect isn't really an issue for most of my work because the last thing I want is more LF muddying up the sound so I HP it, which also often helps reduce feedback. To put how little control I have in an example; I have singers that I will only trust with an SM58, an SM58 which I have swapped the nice grill for a dented rusty old one because I know they'll drop the damn thing.

The main reason for wanting an expensive handheld was for live shows with a very exposed vocal - where performers often know how to work the proximity effect to their advantage, or as an option for recording.

I'm aware of the advantages of the KSM8 and I haven't ruled it out, I just feel that atm. a condenser would be a better addition to the microphones I already own.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Aptorian » Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:55 am

James Perrett wrote:One other thought - have you tried the Audix OM5? I know you have the OM7 but I've found that the OM5 gives a very smooth sound with a slight boost at the very high end.

That's interesting, I'll consider that in the future. I'm a big fan of the OM7, it's probably my preference out of the mics I own for sound but it depends a lot on the singer knowing how to use it so I'm picky about who I give it to. Best mic I've ever had for a singing drummer though.

I've honestly never really thought about the rest of the OM series, I'll have to look at them again.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Dan LB » Sun Jul 12, 2020 1:06 am

My favourites are:

DPA 4018
Neumann KMS104/105
Shure KSM9
Sennheiser e965

I’ve not used the DPA 2028.
Also I’m not sold on the KSM8 yet - I need to spend a bit more time with it.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Tim Gillett » Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:43 am

Aptorian wrote: The main reason for wanting an expensive handheld was for live shows with a very exposed vocal - where performers often know how to work the proximity effect to their advantage, or as an option for recording.

When I sing live before an audience, or recording the last thing I normally want in the mic is proximity effect. It's a nuisance. If I occasionally work the mic it's to control my dynamics, not to change the bottom end at the same time which is unnatural.

Proximity effect is unfortunately the price usually paid for directionality in a mic. But since the 1950's some great designs have partially controlled it. The KSM8 is just the latest and maybe the best example in this respect.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby innerchord » Sun Jul 12, 2020 4:49 am

Tim Gillett wrote:
Aptorian wrote: The main reason for wanting an expensive handheld was for live shows with a very exposed vocal - where performers often know how to work the proximity effect to their advantage, or as an option for recording.

If I occasionally work the mic it's to control my dynamics, not to change the bottom end at the same time which is unnatural.

I agree with Aptorian. Good, seasoned live performers know the proximity effect of their chosen mic and are aware of it at the very least, and most use it frequently for effect. They understand that proximity changes tone as well as loudness. However, I have seen quite a few experienced vocalists who have never bothered to learn; they can be hard to deal with.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Tim Gillett » Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:43 am

innerchord wrote:
Tim Gillett wrote:
Aptorian wrote: The main reason for wanting an expensive handheld was for live shows with a very exposed vocal - where performers often know how to work the proximity effect to their advantage, or as an option for recording.

If I occasionally work the mic it's to control my dynamics, not to change the bottom end at the same time which is unnatural.

I agree with Aptorian. Good, seasoned live performers know the proximity effect of their chosen mic and are aware of it at the very least, and most use it frequently for effect...

I guess it depends on what the performer is doing but for straight singing in a band situation where you're trying to approximate the sound of popular songs and recordings, in my experience there's not much scope for that. Especially the sort of thing I've done where we're trying to live balance three l harmony voices. It's all about blending the voices, and balancing against the backing instruments, and that's hard enough on its own, let alone throwing in the complications of proximity effect on three different mics.

I've heard solo comedians use proximity effect for when they do certain voices or effects. Cosby used to go close miced for his "voice of God". Lots of bass and venue reverb, combined (on the live recording) with heavy limiting. But that was solo. There was nothing else to balance against.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby blinddrew » Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:37 am

I deliberately make the most of proximity effect live. Like most untrained singers i loose a lot of power at the bottom of my register so will balance the levels out a bit by relying on the mic to provide some extra grunt.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby shufflebeat » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:36 am

Aptorian wrote:
James Perrett wrote:One other thought - have you tried the Audix OM5? I know you have the OM7 but I've found that the OM5 gives a very smooth sound with a slight boost at the very high end.

That's interesting, I'll consider that in the future. I'm a big fan of the OM7, it's probably my preference out of the mics I own for sound but it depends a lot on the singer knowing how to use it so I'm picky about who I give it to. Best mic I've ever had for a singing drummer though.

I've honestly never really thought about the rest of the OM series, I'll have to look at them again.

The OM5 is great on flute where it helps bring out the reediness of the top end without taking up the whole picture where ideally you want vocals to be. It's quite subtle but effective.

It sounds to me like what you're describing is a bit Sennheiser-ry though, robust, soft sounding and detailed but easy to manage in a hostile environment.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby Tim Gillett » Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:20 pm

blinddrew wrote:I deliberately make the most of proximity effect live. Like most untrained singers i loose a lot of power at the bottom of my register so will balance the levels out a bit by relying on the mic to provide some extra grunt.
AFAIK we all lose power in our lower register. Live classical oratorio can show it up starkly when the singer is at the bottom of their range and is almost drowned out by the orchestra. The last time I heard Handel's Messiah, when the bass sang "Refiner's Fire" his voice was almost inaudible in the lower notes, but hardly a criticism. A very difficult feat for anyone.
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby ore_terra » Tue Jul 14, 2020 11:10 am

MOF wrote:Beyer M160 ribbon vocal mic’?
I like it (and use it) a lot on vocals. use a pop shield
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Re: Expensive Vocal Mic

Postby wdsteele » Thu Jul 16, 2020 7:15 pm

Telefunken M80 or the less bright sounding M81.

The M81 solved my own personal microphone quest by all but eliminating any sense of nasal overtones , quite amazing really.Had the Beyer88 before and loved it's big sound but the nasal aspect was quite over the top on my voice.

Believe the Telefunkens are popular with some big names just now and they have a huge array of colour options .

You could buy one of each and not stray too far from budget ; good heritage too.
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