You are here

Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

For performing musicians and engineers: stagecraft, engineering and gear.

Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:20 pm

Hey guys. Since my Lexicon MX200 effects machine can work with a Midi Footswitch, I am wondering if it might be possible to bluetooth it with a transmitter and receiver maybe something like this?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2in1-Bluetooth ... SwwH9d9unI

This way I can trigger the MX200 effects from my phone? The Eventide H9 is bluetooth capable so I don't see why it cannot be done this way.
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby James Perrett » Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:37 pm

There are two problems with sending audio over Bluetooth...

1. Latency - Bluetooth isn't designed for low latency so the absolute lowest latency is around 30ms each way and some devices will give a much higher delay.

2. Sound quality - Audio over Bluetooth is compressed so you are losing a little quality with every pass.

If you want a wireless link then take a look at some of the more specialised brands like Line6 who use their own protocols which take up more bandwidth than Bluetooth can provide.
User avatar
James Perrett
Moderator
Posts: 9947
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:00 am
Location: The wilds of Hampshire
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration. JRP Music Facebook Page

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 9:42 pm

Thank James, will look into that but to clarify my intent in this case, I only wish to trigger the effect on mx200 from the phone and not send any audio either to or from the phone.

As for latency, not an issue for this purpose.
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby Moroccomoose » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:03 pm

There are loads of MIDI controller apps for phones that work over WiFi rather than Bluetooth, but I think the route would be to connect the app midi to a pc, (requires a small interface program to be instalked) then via USB out to the lexicon, possibly via a DAW or midiox or something. Rather than direct to the lexicon from the phone.
The apps can have any buttons or sliders configured to cc's

Stu.
Moroccomoose
Regular
Posts: 283
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:00 am
Location: Staffordshire
 

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:12 pm

Thanks. I have joined the Line6 forum to see if any of their products might work.

I will now look into "midi controller apps for phones", get back to you.
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby James Perrett » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:18 pm

mikehende wrote:Thank James, will look into that but to clarify my intent in this case, I only wish to trigger the effect on mx200 from the phone and not send any audio either to or from the phone.

Looks like you may need something like this

https://www.cme-pro.com/widi-master/

No idea how well it works but CME have been around for a while.
User avatar
James Perrett
Moderator
Posts: 9947
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:00 am
Location: The wilds of Hampshire
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration. JRP Music Facebook Page

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:22 pm

Ok so with a midi phone app as mentioned in previous post, that should allow me to connect to this device?
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby Moroccomoose » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:40 pm

mikehende wrote:Ok so with a midi phone app as mentioned in previous post, that should allow me to connect to this device?

With the phone apps I've seen, I think you would still need to go via a PC....something like this...

Phone app to PC...PC to midi interface...midi interface to WIDI...WIDI out to WIDI in

Are you using iPhone or android?
Moroccomoose
Regular
Posts: 283
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:00 am
Location: Staffordshire
 

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 10:52 pm

Hmnn, seems like a very complicated process. I am using iPhone but also have an android which I can use instead if absolutely needed.

Lexicon tech support had said the only way to control their usb software option would be to get a programmer to write code for wireless. or other midi control.
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm


Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby The Elf » Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:11 pm

In my rig I connect my MIDI control panels (using MIDI Designer) to Cubase (and my synths/effects) wirelessly using rtpMIDI:
https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/rtpmidi.html

Very simple to set up and works reliably - and free. The iPhone/Pad need to be on the same wireless network, but beyond that they just work seamlessly.

I have the CME WIDI device, and it does work, but you have to run a special app to connect every time you start up - which is a pain.
User avatar
The Elf
Jedi Poster
Posts: 15409
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2001 12:00 am
Location: Sheffield, UK
An Eagle for an Emperor, A Kestrel for a Knave.

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:14 pm

Cool I will look into this, thanks! I am not all that familiar with midi since I play DJ music and only deal with mp3's but willing to learn and experiment with all that would be involved.
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Tue Nov 03, 2020 11:18 pm


I didn't;t see this post before, will look into it too thanks!
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby mikehende » Wed Nov 04, 2020 1:35 am

The Elf wrote:In my rig I connect my MIDI control panels (using MIDI Designer) to Cubase (and my synths/effects) wirelessly using rtpMIDI:
https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/rtpmidi.html

Very simple to set up and works reliably - and free. The iPhone/Pad need to be on the same wireless network, but beyond that they just work seamlessly.

Fast as I am understanding, you install the rtpMIDI driver on your pc and connect that to a phone but which phone app? Also what on your pc connects to the lexicon please?
mikehende
Regular
Posts: 259
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Can I bluetooth Midi Effects with Transmitter and Receiver?

Postby The Elf » Wed Nov 04, 2020 9:28 am

mikehende wrote:
The Elf wrote:In my rig I connect my MIDI control panels (using MIDI Designer) to Cubase (and my synths/effects) wirelessly using rtpMIDI:
https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/rtpmidi.html

Very simple to set up and works reliably - and free. The iPhone/Pad need to be on the same wireless network, but beyond that they just work seamlessly.
Fast as I am understanding, you install the rtpMIDI driver on your pc and connect that to a phone but which phone app? Also what on your pc connects to the lexicon please?
It's really no different to how you would connect it by cables. rtpMIDI simply replaces a pair of cables with a wireless option. If you don't already have your Lexicon connected via MIDI then I would suggest you cable it and get that working before you embark on wireless.

You install rtpMIDI on your PC (and declare a virtual MIDI port in there), and any compatible app on your iPhone/Pad (on the same wireless network) will now find this port. You can now run a DAW, or anything that will allow you to connect the rtpMIDI port with the Lexicon's MIDI port - the choice is yours.

Same goes for iPad software - the choice is yours. I use MIDI Designer as my control surface. Hopefully others can suggest other options.

There are YouTube videos describing the set up and use of rtpMIDI - try a search or three.
User avatar
The Elf
Jedi Poster
Posts: 15409
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2001 12:00 am
Location: Sheffield, UK
An Eagle for an Emperor, A Kestrel for a Knave.

Next